Here's a quandry;

Which .45?

  • CZ-97B

    Votes: 17 29.3%

  • Springfield Mil-Spec

    Votes: 41 70.7%
  • Total voters
    58
N

Nightcrawler

New member
As you all know, I turn 21 soon and the choice of which .45 draws near.

Here are two I'd like to compare: The CZ-97B and the Springfield Mil-Spec. Neither of them come with a safety I can use, a mutual disadvantage. A safety can be added to the 1911 (add $100) and the CZ-97 is double action, so the safety is not necessary.

They'll both probably cost the same. 1911 has more parts and service, the CZ is a CZ and lacks an integral lock, and is almost certainly going to be more reliable out of the box.

Choices...
 
Neither of them come with a safety I can use
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I assume then you're a fellow leftie?

I've never been a fan of the 1911 (oh crap, better duck and cover!) but then I've never taken the time to learn about a "good one" as opposed to the few I've shot. So I definitely vote for the CZ. I know it's not your caliber, but I was told by a tech at CZ that all the CZ's in .40 come with Ambi safeties. Also not on your list, but EAA's CZ clone "Witness" pistols have an ambi safety option for about $70 more, and they make 'em in .45.

It really bugs me to have a gun with the safety on the "wrong" side for me.
 
These are very different pistols. They share a caliber and not a lot else, in spite of their similar appearances from a distance. Different actions, different sizes, different construction.
 
My only concerns with the Springfield Mil-Spec are that I don't think there are any 1911 smiths in my area, so I'd have to send it elsewhere for the ambi safety installation.

Secondly, reliability. The 1911 design can be a very reliable pistol. BUT, the commercial ones made today are might tighter than the old GI guns. Will the Mil-Spec feed ball, hollowpoint, and +P ammo reliably?
 
I'd go CZ for a first gun. You want to make your first handgun purchase and ownership enjoyable and as problem free as possible. I think the CZ will do that. I'm not knocking the 1911...I really like mine ;) 1911's tho can be finicky and potentially more than a new handgun owner is willing to put up with.
 
"I don't think there are any 1911 smiths in my area"
Check out where the USPSA shooters are in your area. They'll know where the 1911gunsmiths around you are. You find them, you'll have no problem finding the gun smith.
 
The only place with no 1911 smiths would be on another planet.
Good ones ?........nuther story.

Mattjoe has it, check the competition ranges.

Sam
 
Check out where the USPSA shooters are in your area
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There aren't any. Nor are there any competition ranges in my area. There are all of two rifle ranges in the county, and that's about it.

I asked my dealer; he knows of a gunsmith, but doesn't know if he does ambi safety installations.

I was quoted the following prices by my dealer:

Springfield Mil-Spec: $526.00
CZ-97B Black Polycoat: $545.00

Tack $70+ onto the price of the 1911 for the installation of the ambi safety, and the CZ is the price winner.

Looks like that settles that, at any rate. If the prices seem a bit high, that's because prices are just high in my area. $599 for a full sized Glock is common.
 
It's no secret that I really love the CZ-75 line. In this case, however, I'd really be torn. I love the CZ-97, but it's huge. The 1911 is pro'ly a better carry gun, but the last Springfield Loaded I've seen had a horrid trigger (8+ pounds!)

You'd probably be happy with either. Are you dead-set on a .45? The CZ-75b in 9mm is a bit smaller, easy to conceal, and has that wonderful $45 15-round magazine...

- Chris
 
Over the last 40+ years, I've owned almost every .45 ACP made. My first choice today is the Sig P220, followed by the Glock 21, the Beretta, and the CZ.

I own a "full house" target 1911 that was made from a GI surplus Remington Rand. It's fun to shoot, and I shoot it often. But it would be my absolute last choice for carry/self defense. Just MHO.
 
I voted for the Springfield. I'm not saying that the CZ is bad, but I'm such a 1911 freak I had to vote Springfield.
 
Sig 220


I've got a Mil Spec, and like it quite a bit. The safety issue, though, makes me wonder if you're not left handed.

I'm left handed, and I don't have any problems operating the safety with my left hand.

Then again, I don't carry the 1911, so if that's what you're looking for, it probably wouldn't be as good a choice.
 
Yes, I am left handed. I could carry a pistol right handed (as some have suggested elsewhere), of course, but why should I do that? I'll make the machines work for me, thank you.

I can't afford a Sig P220. That's why it wasn't one of the options. I suppose I could afford one if I saved, but I don't really want one. The control layout is disagreeable to me, especially the slide release.

I don't think this pistol that I'm buying will be a carry gun, except perhaps in a shoulder holster when it's cold enough to wear a coat (most of the year here). I really don't know how some of you go around carrying full sized 1911s on a belt and keeping them concealed; I like my shirts tucked in and don't wear vests.
 
The Springfield with the 8+ lbs trigger that Christopher II mentioned was mine. I'm going add a Videcki short trigger and have it adjusted to about 3-3.5 lbs. The fullsize 1911 is a very easy gun to conceal, I think its even easier to conceal than the baby Glocks. Since the 1911 is thin it is easy to carry concealed. You just need to find a good holster and a good belt. The rig I have is a Milt Sparks Summer Special II and a Mitch Rosen 1.5" contoured belt. Shoulder holsters are a no-no for carry in my book. Any rig that forces you to cross your hand across your body and/or cover people with the muzzle on your weak side is a stupid design. I can fully conceal the full size 1911 if I wear a loose button up untucked over a tucked in undershirt. Mind your I'm 5'5" and I can conceal the 1911 with ease. If I'm wearing a suit or something like that concealing it is a no brainer. Do you really think the only time you'll need your gun is in the winter?
 
I really don't know how some of you go around carrying full sized 1911s on a belt and keeping them concealed; I like my shirts tucked in and don't wear vests.
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I like my shirts tucked in too. Matter of fact, I haven’t worn a shirt untucked for as long as I can remember. Plus I live in Texas, no over wear around here. You would be surprised what the right sort of holster can help you accomplish. I wear polo shirts and khaki pants or jeans pretty much all the time, when I put on my Milt Sparks Versa Max II I can tuck my shirt in and nobody’s the wiser (and yes it is a 1911). Don’t rule it out until you give it a shot. For what its worth, my money for a first pistol would be all over that Spring Field. I’d like a CZ myself, I think they’re great pistols but its pretty hard to beat a good 1911. I will admit its all about the preference though...
 
Nightcrawler,

I feel kind of bad for you - I know I have read this same exact question from you quite a few times (not that it's a bad thing..) It is hard to agonize over a choice like this.. and I am sure that no matter what you eventually end up with, you'll think back and say, "If only...."

In my own personal preference, I'd go with the 1911, as I prefer it's grip. My CZ freak friend (who purchased a CZ97B about a month before I got my 1911) shot my 1911 and was about to purchase one and break his long string of CZ-only purchases, until he realized that the 1911 he wanted was broken. He took it as a sign from the CZ gods and decided not to make the purchase. His loss, in my opinion.

However, I also notice that most of your polls are CZ97B vs XXXXX... leading me to believe that deep down you want that CZ97.

If the prices in your area are high, is it possible to order from another gunstore in another area? For instance, if Glocks are $600 in your area, buy a Glock from J&G for $450 and pay the $25 transfer fee, and come out $125 ahead.

I'm a college student as well, so I have some grasp of the limited funds that you are operating under. Don't forget to take into account a holster, a pistol case, cleaning supplies, spare magazine or two, snap cap, ammunition.... My 1911 was only $320 but I was pushing $400 after taxes and accessories.

In any case, you could always get the 1911 now and the 97 after you graduate and have some high paying job :)
 
I voted for the Springfield, but I'd shop for a Parjerized Loaded model. I see them all the time for around $550 at the major guns shows which role through town. Not much more at the smaller ones.

CZ are great pistols. I hope to have one soon. It won't be the 97, though. As someone already mentioned, it is big. Too big, and unnecessarily so, imo.
 
I was struggling with the same problem.

I finally got to rent a 1911 today (didn't like the grip on the KZ-45, liked the Springfield with a tuned trigger but settled on trying a Charles Daly. It just didn't fit me that well (yes, I know sacrilege!) and I prefer the manual of arms for a DA/SA. My mind is made up: I'm going to get a 97B.

I like the DA/SA option better than the SA. The DA trigger reach on the 97B is long, but it's still doable for me, and I think I'll enjoy shooting the heavier gun more than the lighter 1911. Plus it just looks cool :-).

I think it comes down to what will you use it for. If you are in my situation, and you aren't into tweaking your guns, and you will use the .45 as a house gun with some IDPA and light bullseye (and you like the ergonomics) the CZ97B is the best buy (especially if it as accurate as my PCR).

If however, you want a light, carry gun, then a 1911 is the way you should go. You can trick out the 1911 to your heart's content and there's tons of experienced gun smiths who can tune it for you. On the other hand, there is essentially NO market for add-ons for the 97B (except for Hakan's grips of course, check out czforum.com if you haven't yet). Heck you can't even get Novak style sights for the 97B.

Whatever you choose, let us know how it goes.
 
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