Help me educate a columnist

Noel

New member
Will the more literate and erudite among us help to educate Ms. Sallie Tisdale? She requests input from pro-gun people.

DC, as a mother you could have more impact?

She also asks if Ben Franklin would really want us to send kids to a unsafe school.

I think Ben is on record about saftey and freedom.

Please help if you have the energy.

http://www.salon.com/mwt/col/tisd/1999/05/06/elimination/index1.html

BTW I have reformated the RKBA quotes by founders and bounders put up by Morgan and Richard in a Word document without the unneeded spaces and line feeds. Email me and I'll get my compilation to you.

Noel
 
Here is my start on the education. I will have to finish later. Must go now.

Dear Ms. Sallie Tisdale:

I despair of giving any argument to you that would cause you to reconsider your opinion that all firearms must be eliminated from society if we are to somehow be safer. Yet, I feel that if you take an intellectually honest look at the situation you may reevaluate you stance. You are writing as a mother that thinks.

I am a Father. I have a 12-year-old son who is the most important feature of my life. I deeply love my wife, but I feel more responsibility to my son. He is not yet an adult and needs my guidance and help to develop into the great human being that I see as his capacity. My dear wife needs only my support, and is already an admirable person. So it is that I worry more about the future

My personal background is given in the following brief synopsis so you may know a little of how my thought may have developed. I grew up in a small town in Colorado, and had my first .22 caliber rifle at 8. I had my first job as a paper boy at 9. I grew up in what was categorized as poverty by statistics of the time. My father was self-employed and died of heart failure when I was 14. We recieved no governmental assistance. My mother was to proud to apply for welfare (and social security did not have a record of my fathers contributions for the required 40 quarters, he had only 39 recorded). And so, we worked; my brother, mother and me. I worked my way through university, obtained a Ph.D. and now am a Professor in the Northwest. I still help support my mother, who is now 80 and does receive Social Security.

A person has responsibilities. A person also has inalienable human rights. Rights and responsibilities are much more significant than a simple statement of comfort.

My primary concern for the future is the loss of the ability to develop into a fully rounded human. What sort of life will my son have? How will his children live? I do not believe that our quality of life can be measured in terms of life expectancy and median family income. There is much more. I do not belive that trusting ohters to know what is safe or best for a person allows the development of a full understanding of rights and resposibility.

You mention a handgun ban (actually a near total firearms ban) in England. But is England safer? Do young English men and women live a better life now that no one except military and police have access to firearms? How would you evaluate that goal of safety or of an increased quality of life??

Terrorist bombs are still exploding in London and Ireland. What have they lost? What have they given up? What will they become? ..........

more needed....

Noel
 
Noel...

Have you corresponded with her personally? I ask because if not, her request is just rhetoric.

I read her article and I'm afraid it would be a total waste of time and effort.
She has succumbed to the histrionics and hysteria the anti-gunners have shoveled out, and she has a fundamental misconception of this principles of this country and of history.

What she is unaware of is that this country is not a democracy it is a democratic Republic. I don't have to get her ok or anyone else's ok for anything....I have certain basic unalienable rights and am not required to accomodate her neuroses and phobias. Statistically speaking....how many female killers have been brunette? Likely more brunettes than blonds. If she develops a fear of brunette females, must I change my hair color or move to a country more tolerate of brunettes? What other traits do I have that she wants to outlaw? I also have an extensive library of scientific texts, chemistry, physics and biological. I have 2 post graduate degrees and enough theoretical and applied scientific knowledge to be able to kill all life in the Western States. I'm by no means unique either....every year this country turns out thousands and thousands of young people with this kind of knowledge. No boast, this is pure statement of fact. What does she want to do about us?
She doesn't wish to be educated or even argue from a fact based position. She recites the same bogus discredited arguements. She has made up her mind and she isn't interested in seeing reality or facts. She isn't interested or even comforted by the fact that she and everyone she knows has a less than 0.0012% chance of being killed by a gun....whereas she does have better than 30% chance of dying front breast cancer...she has a 25% chance of being raped.

My brother and I had free access to guns from day one and all the kids we grew up with did too....the only people I personally know who have ever killed anyone were Dad, uncles, and other men who were in a war. My infant son is going to be raised like I was...he will be exposed and instructed in firearms. I will take him hunting as my Dad did me, if he likes it we will always go hunting. I will give him the very best fundamental value system I can while he is in my charge. He will learn responsibility and duty. He won't be allowed self-pity or self-indulgence for the experience of normal trials and tribulations of life. He will know he is special to me, but he is equal to other people and they must be respected. He is and will be loved, never ignored and will forever know that he can talk to mom about anything and at anytime in his life as long as I am alive. I will never fear my son, never give him cause to fear or distrust himself. No one on earth, least of all a government, will do this better than me.

If people would get off their lazy asses and get involved in their kids lives, none of this will happen. I'm not talking about activities I'm talking about knowing what they think, how they feel, their worries, dreams, pain, etc.
These people never squawk about bank robbers and hold ups killing people....they fear their kids. The concept of a kid going off is their horror and is blown totally beyond proportion. This country is held hostage by the acts of maybe 20 abberrant kids.

Sorry, I can't and won't let her neurotic phobias and personal failings influence my life.

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"Quis custodiet ipsos custodes"



[This message has been edited by DC (edited May 21, 1999).]
 
DC:

If I may be so bold... I would suggest that someone here write her a brief note stating something about you and what you requested of us. Then to send her a copy of your post. Would do more good than harm.

Richard
 
Bookie..
Thanks, but I didn't make the request, Noel did.

After reading her column I felt that she(Sallie) is a typical neurotic unthinking liberal.
Don't get me wrong, I don't discourage writing to these people, but I also consider her publication's stance and believe that anything I did that struck her interest would merely insure her next week's paycheck. Basically I believe her request for dialog with gunowners is merely to gather fodder and give her ready made copy. Very much like Gloria Steinem (Ms magazine) asking for feedback from sexist men



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"Quis custodiet ipsos custodes"
 
Noel

FYI, I think this is ths Ben Franklin quote to which you refer:

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.[/quote]

Its unfortunate that people like this particular columnist are willing to give up their unalienable rights but it is unconscionable that they are also willing to give up MY unalienable rights. The former is idiotic, the latter is intolerable.

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Ciao

MM
 
I find it rather ironic that she says that if we want to own guns that we should move to a country where it is legal.
Um....excuse me? One of the primary reasons that the founders came here was to be able to take care of themselves and be armed as they wish. Now, two centuries later those people built this beautiful country, and this liberal is telling the people that follow those beliefs that we should find a new country!?
She seems to enjoy the benefits that this country has from our constitution. ALL of the constitution is what has made America what it is.

I have a proposal: She seems to think that there are some (many!) eutopias out there that have no gun violence....how about if she moves there! There is only ONE America. There are lots of Canadas, Australias, Japans, England, Frances and their ilk. Canada is not far away...or she can plop herself just about anywhere in Europe (where me ancestors ESCAPED FROM) that she can find all kinds of her immoral types.

thaddeus

Ps- in a synopsis below the article about Columbine, they claim that the shooters were "right-wing extremists". HUH???!! They are Anarchists. I used to, (unfortunatly, in my bad years), hang out with the hardcore type. Let me tell you, those people are about as left-wing as possible on most every political and moral issue, to the extreme.
And isn't one of the parents of the demons an avid HCI member? A right wing HCI member? I think not.
I am constantly amazed at what leftist liberals will do do demonize their nemeses.


I agree with you DC, this chick is well beyond hope. I think that her own emotional ranting will be her own downfall if she continues to banter(a la Rosie). The more her type talk, the worse they look. Leave her alone and let her boil herself.
 
Oh yeah, and another thing....She says that she "fears for her life and saftety by writing anti-gun articles".

Give me a friggin break! Talk about using scare tactics (which is what her type accused US of of all things).
When was the last time an NRA member tracked down an anti-gunner and shot them for their beliefs?
What a crock of crap. Just more attempts at demonizing gun owners...implying that they might do something so utterly ridiculous. She has no basis to make such an extremeist accusation and I am frankly offended that she would even imply that gun owners as a whole go around shooting anyone that disagrees with them. These people use every chance they get to slyly paint us as villans.

Grrr...
thaddeus
 
NRA member my tush. We are only about 5 percent of the gun owners in the country, when was the last time ANY gun owner (excuse me, I should say "gun nut") hunted down an anti gunner and whacked him/her? Lady's an idiot, but I guess I'll waste a few minutes to suggest that she read and recommend "Guns and Crime in America" before she or her victims, er, I mean readers make up their minds to not think ever again, on principle.
 
DC and others,

Yes, I also think is is a waste of time. At the moment I thought it might help and I considered giving her a copy of the Lott article that gun control costs lives. But I don't think it would help.

Noel
 
Noel...

Please don't take my refusal as any sort of condemnation or value judgement upon you. I very likely would have agreed had Tisdale's article contained facts and reasoned opinion instead of emotional hyperbole and histrionics. A few paragraphs into her article I realized that she debates like a pre-teen...emotional absolutism.

She is very much like the people we meet everyday and on Rosie's board....they think they know and comprehend the Bill of Rights and the Constitution merely because they are aware of the existence of such documents; and when debating they rely on what they "think" they (documents) mean....these folks are too intellectually lazy and apathetic to even spend a little reference time. Its no wonder they are afraid of guns and people with guns, and have absolutely no understanding of principles and standing up for whats right. That takes some work and committment.

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"Quis custodiet ipsos custodes"
 
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