Hello Lee CC single stage, bye bye RCBS Summit

S

stubbicatt

New member
A couple years ago I bought a RCBS Summit press. I thought it looked cool, which it does. I have struggled with that press ever since, trying to like it. But in the end it is sort of like size AA Italian shoes... they look great, but I have a size D foot.

I bought a Lee classic cast single stage press and mounted it up yesterday, the first really nice day hereabouts. Loaded up some 30 WCF cartridges with some RCBS 180 grain gas checked bullets and IMR4227 powder. Haven't shot any yet, but the difference between the feel of these two presses has to be experienced to be believed. The Lee is so much better to use, effortless sizing.

Prepped some of my 32-40 fixed cartridges this morning. The ease and slickness of sizing was so much better.

I am reluctant to admit when I've made a mistake, but the Summit was, for me, a mistake. I tried everything I could think of to like that press, but it just doesn't "fit."

Now to put the thing in the for sale forum and send it to someone who may like it.
 
stubbicatt said:
A couple years ago I bought a RCBS Summit press. I thought it looked cool, which it does. I have struggled with that press ever since, trying to like it. But in the end it is sort of like size AA Italian shoes... they look great, but I have a size D foot.

I bought a Lee classic cast single stage press and mounted it up yesterday, the first really nice day hereabouts. Loaded up some 30 WCF cartridges with some RCBS 180 grain gas checked bullets and IMR4227 powder. Haven't shot any yet, but the difference between the feel of these two presses has to be experienced to be believed. The Lee is so much better to use, effortless sizing.

Prepped some of my 32-40 fixed cartridges this morning. The ease and slickness of sizing was so much better.

I am reluctant to admit when I've made a mistake, but the Summit was, for me, a mistake. I tried everything I could think of to like that press, but it just doesn't "fit."

Now to put the thing in the for sale forum and send it to someone who may like it.
Click to expand...
I have a Summit and a RCB RockChucker press, Summit is my seat the bullet press as you can get a clear straight seating,I would never willingly resize rifle brass using a Summit press not enough leverage even with long handle, Still you going to a Lee single press is better than trying to use a Summit for all brass stages.
 
I got a new classic cast in a trade a few years ago. I took it out of the box and mounted it, to just give it a try before putting it for sale. Well, I liked it so well that I sold my Rock Chucker that I had been using for 25yrs and kept the classic cast. Mine has been great...and I think that you will enjoy yours.
 
The Lee Classic Cast first came out selling for about $60. One of the best bargains in reloading. Today you can get it on sale at Midway for $100 dollars. Still a bargain. They also make a Breech Lock version, but I prefer the original because I like way it disposes of primers into a tube dangling from the ram better. But that's a personal preference. YMMV. The "O" frame is extra wide, so I don't think you'll complain about bullet seating with it.
 
Love my classic cast. I've put together quite a bit of accurate target ammunition with it. I've had it 4-5 years now. It is in its forever home.
 
I'm sorry your not happy with your RCBS Summit press. I use mine solely for rifle, 223 & 308. I use a Dillon for pistol. As far as sizing, i use Imperial Case Sizing wax & Imperial dry neck lube. No problems at all, nice and smooth. I really love my little Summit, so I'm Just wondering, why was your Summit not playing nice? What are your dislikes?
 
ka9fax I don't know that there is anything wrong with Summit, I just never grew to like it. Perhaps it is like a Pepsi/Coke comparison... some prefer one over the other.

The Summit requires much more effort to resize rifle cases than the Lee. While I don't always FL resize for a given chamber, where one only sets the shoulder back a certain amount to give minimal clearance, when I do try to get precision shoulder setback using the Summit, I get wildly erratic setback numbers. The positioning of the handle above the press I find less ergonomic to use. The screws that attach the top and bottom castings to the ram seem to find a way to work themselves loose. I really don't like that at all. When FL sizing the MG fired 308s, of which I have many, it would make all sort of noises, popping and screaming, and I got tired very quickly. The compound linkage on the Lee makes this chore much easier. Heck, I even tried a different case lube with the Summit because I was having such difficulty, but the issues remained. I even suspected my dies were not properly finished as the "feel" of resizing was rough, and I sort of had to jerk the Summit handle to pop them free from the dies on the downstroke (or is it "upstroke"). -These same dies are smooth as silk on the Lee. Simply put, resizing is effortless with the Lee.

Of particular note to my setup, and the ergonomics of the Summit referenced above, I use the kitchen table and "C" clamp my presses, which are mounted to 2x12 boards, to the table. With the Summit it was difficult to find a position to use the press. Seated at the table, it was quite a reach upwards to grasp the Summit handle, so I would stand to use the press. Standing, it was quite a reach down to the shell holder to insert cartridges. There just was no comfortable way for me to use the press. The Lee, mounted the same way, places the handle in an easy to reach position while seated, with a clear view of the shell holder, so I don't have to bend over to put a cartridge in. In all, I don't experience fatigue using the Lee.

I can work around all these features of the Summit press, but why should I have to? In all I found it more aggravating than satisfying.

I haven't tried "precision" resizing 308's yet on the Classic Cast press, so I may find some shortcomings here too. So far though, with the minimal use I have given it, I find the Lee press much more satisfying to use.

Perhaps the proof of the pudding, so to speak, is that I had found myself putting off reloading because I just didn't enjoy it anymore with the Summit. I would simply skip shooting so as to not have to use the press, as I found it such a struggle. To my view, a tool should facilitate performing a task, not make it more complicated, or an unpleasant experience. I just found this tool to not meet my needs. Now? I look forward to assembling cartridges, which in light of the fine weather, should make it easier to go to the lever action silhouette matches at the club.

Satisfaction is nearly wholly a subjective experience. I am sure many are satisfied with the Summit, and that's great. I made a change to try to address the issues I was having, and for myself, it has so far been the right choice.
 
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I've been using a RCBS single stage Rock Chucker for about 40 years. Single stage works great for me, as I don't load large volumes of anything. Although this press must have hundreds of thousands of strokes attributed to it, the thing feels like new - tight and smooth every time.

Bayou
 
Subbicatt, it seems you sold a "Some folks like the Forster Co-ax, as recommended by Unclenick. I had one for several months before I happily sold it down the chain of commerce to some other poor unfortunate. I hope its new owner is as happy with it."

If you didn't like Summit, find it strange you get Co-AX.

I sure could understand not liking a press.
 
Friend of mine bought one and had same problems. It has been sent back.
IMHO, it is a dud.
I have great respect for RCBS and most of my reloading gear is "Green".

Having said that, the Summit is not the first time RCBS has hatched out a turkey. 30 years ago, they came out with their progressive "Green Machine" a boat anchor at its best. :eek:
 
Old Roper. I must have mis stated something, or you misunderstood something, as I didn't get a Co-Ax after the Summit. I had the Co-Ax maybe early 1990s? The Summit is maybe 2 or 3 years old. They do look the same, true enough, but the Summit attracted my attention because it uses shell holders rather than that infernal sliding jaw fandango on the Co-Ax, and the dies thread into the "die holder" rather than requiring the use of special lock rings.

Mostly I was attracted to the fact that the press is all above the table, as I had gotten tired of shedding tears and bouts of incontinence each time I would bash a kneecap on a Rock Chucker under the table linkage. Heh! Now I've bought another under the table linkage press, and may suffer again. Trade one set of woes for another... I sure hope not.

I was disappointed on both Co-Ax and Summit presses. I had hoped to solve one problem and so I made the change. See what hope and change will get ya?

Chiefr, I have to agree with you. I don't think the Summit is RCBS's best effort. I still like their dies, hand primer, and other tools I use. I guess even Babe Ruth struck out sometimes. :)

Be well.
 
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stubbicatt, Your post about the Co-Ax didn't mention what year you had it.

I stand when I FL size cases so have no problem. I have old Rock Chucker that's over 40yrs old and I made reloading bench high and if I wanted to sit I'd need bar stool.

For neck sizing and seating bullets I use Arbor Press.

SINCLAIR ARBOR PRESS | Sinclair Intl
 
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I used a Rock Chucker and an Orange Crusher for many years. I am not a huge fan of the Lee classic. I currently use a Redding Big Boss II. It is a toss up between it and a Forster Coax as to what my favorite press is.
 
For those with a Co-ax who don't like the self-centering shell holder, you can buy an adapter from Forster to let you use standard shell holders. If you don't like it being below bench level, you can now get an aftermarket elevated mount for it. Personally, I make my benches tall, for standing use. The bottom of the press is then above knee level, even with normal mounting.

I note that Inline Fabrication also makes curved replacements for the straight linkages on the Co-ax press to give you a wider effective opening.
 
Sorry stubbicatt I have been sick with the flu. Anyway thanks for the great explanation. I think the thing i like best is the openness of this press. I'm happy you found one you like. Looks like you gave the Summit a good workout before you gave your opinion. I think one day i might try a Rockchucker just for the fun of it and comparison. ya know, you can never have to many presses.
 
I too appreciate the contributors on this forum. Not everybody likes the same thing, and for some, the Summit would be a good choice. It has pained me to let it go, as I said, I really want to like it. :(

I haven't tried it yet, but I bought a neat little gizmo that threads onto your sizing die in lieu of a lock ring. It is sort of like a two part lock ring, with an index scale on it. You thread your die on in as per usual, just touching the shell holder. Size the case, measure shoulder. Turn this gizmo so many index marks, try again and measure. The index marks allow you to turn the equivalent of .001" at a time to arrive at the shoulder dimension you seek. Unfortunately, it didn't fit on the Summit due to its design of the die carrier. --There just isn't enough room to really use this gizmo very well.

I've had this gizmo what, maybe 2 years now? I have a few 6.5x47s I'd like to size, but I haven't, as I intend to use the lock ring gizmo to see how close to the "right" shoulder setback I can get. I have less than 60 shots through the rifle, and I would like to arrive at a good load and maybe shoot a couple "F" Open matches this summer. The arrival of the Lee with its wide open space above the press will facilitate the use of the gizmo, and perhaps get me on my way with "F" class shooting this year.

Funny how a minor equipment change can bring about a "revolution" of sorts in one's interests, and spark or rekindle a sense of excitement going forward. I built this "F" classer back in 2013 to keep my mind off significant spinal injury, and have only shot it a couple times. I have even thought to sell it a couple times, but now I feel energized to load and test cartridges. All this excitement brought about by an inexpensive single stage press! LOL. (I sure hope the linkage on the Lee press is precise enough to take advantage of the gizmo's precision.)

Be well everyone. :) And thanks for your inputs.
 
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I sent Redding and Forster the suggestion to replace the diamond knurl pattern on their lock rings with a straight 71 or 72 line knurl so the individual knurl teeth could be used to give 0.001" adjustment from any registration point on the press or put on the die with a Sharpie. I even found a metric knurl that would do that on their existing ring diameters. No takers yet. I may try RCBS next.

Is your's the PMA tool?
 
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