Hearing Protection

M

Machineguntony

New member
Two questions...

What brand/model hearing muffs will provide the most hearing protection? All the ones I see commercially available reduce about 35dcB.

Does using both ear plugs and hearing muffs stack the decibel reduction? For example, I purchased box of ear foam plugs that rate at 33DcB reduction. I then put them on with a pair of ear muff protectors that rated 35 DcB reduction. I expected to hear almost nothing, or at least to have double the reduction in noise; however, that wasn't the case. When I used each form of hearing protection separately, the ear plugs sounded like they reduced noise as much as the ear muffs, and vice versa. But when I used them both at the same time, it sounded like I was only using one form of protection. In other words, the protection didn't stack. Is this my imagination? Or am I receiving double protection and not realizing it.
 
I don't think I have ever seen a pair of muffs rated at more than NRC 30 -- most I see seem to be in the mid-20s.

I wear both plugs and muffs. There is a stacking effect, but not linear. If you wear plugs rated NRC 20 and muffs rated NRC 25, you don't get a 45 decibel reduction. The decibel scale isn't a linear scale, it's exponential, so it's difficult (maybe even impossible) to predict an equivalent number when combining two forms of hearing protection. But doubling up does make a perceptible difference. Shooting mostly at an indoor range, I think it's essential. God only issued us one set of ears.
 
When shooting a rifle the stock lifts muffs and they don't protect well.

Thus I wear both plugs and muffs when shooting at the range.
 
When using plugs and muffs the effective level of protection is greater than either singly, but it doesn't add up to the dB reduction of one + the dB reduction of the other.

Using both plugs and muffs is a good idea.
 
I like plugs and electronic muffs together, whenever possible.
Especially indoors.
If/when the muffs don't work, the plugs still do.
Both together seem to do the job.
Still allow decent hearing for what's going on, and protect hearing enough to be safe.
 
I am another who stacks them. My hearing is already damaged, and I do all I can to protect my remaining hearing. Electronic muffs over plugs seem to do the best for me.
 
Most law enforcement academies today require bot plugs and muffs unless electronic muffs are used. Being a Police Firearms Instructor I use electronic muffs from Caldwell so I can hear what goes on when there are no shooting strings being run. They work great for my purpose. The Senior Police Firearms Instructor I work alongside also uses Caldwell electronic muffs.
 
I recommend that you seriously consider custom plugs. They make a BIG difference compared to disposables. Not just the noise reduction but comfort is much better and they fit better under muffs than many types.

The kits to make them yourself aren't very expensive.
 
I think I remember reading that getting plugs and muffs tends to increase the dB reduction by about 5dB.

I am a huge fan of electronic ear muffs plus foam plugs. You can still hear pretty well, and you get good noise reduction for gunfire.
 
There are a few reasonable options.

1. Plugs
2. Conventional muffs
3. Electronic muffs
4. Plugs and muffs

I've used a variety of combinations, but always use something. I prefer both plugs and muffs, as others mentioned.

I've used Peltors electronic muffs in the past and liked the performance but hated the battery location and the lack of auto-shutoff and they were not slim. Batteries invariably died, and were a real hassle to change (you have to nearly disassemble the unit to replace the battery located inside the earmuff on both sides - really dumb design). Ultimately the batteries died and corroded and ruined the unit. I would NOT recommend the version that I had.

I just today received my Howard Leight new unit and tried them out with a loud stereo and other household noises. The amplification and dampening were awesome. They are a slim design, have auto-shutoff, and the battery compartment is on the outside of the unit for easy access. And they have a Ipod jack and cord for music. Claims to reduce to 22db! All for only $50. Assuming these perform well, I'll order another pair or two for the nightstand gun, the range, and maybe for yard mowing.

I will say that for home defense and for the range, the amplification and ability to actually hear your surroundings is very important to me.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001T7QJ9O/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
 
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The geometric scale used to assess decibels is something that doesn't allow for additive calculations when doubling up.

Secondly, the way muffs are rated tend to assess them more for their worst case performance - as when a stock lifts one away from the ear. It's a game of numbers, like horsepower or lumens.

I have Peltor Sport Tacs, and the outer cover shields more of the exterior than my set of HF muffs. The Peltors seem to have much better fit against moisture penetration.

As for battery maintenance, like cars, it's on the user to exert and enforce. One thing that can be done is to use lithium batteries, as they are much more suited to long term storage and have far fewer leaks compared to alkaline. They also have better performance and are worth the extra money.

The point of amplified muffs is to get near normal hearing, even if doubled up with plugs. And if you are out hunting they can be turned up so that they add to the user's ability to hear game, as well as protect the hearing of the shooter. They do add to the insulation around the head in a very effective area, hot weather users tend to add cup shields to increase comfort against perspiration.

I'm looking forward to using them with an AR pistol this fall, while auto off would be nice, I don't care for the feature with either muffs or red dot optics. The technology is advanced enough that battery life isn't threatened by a 10 hour session - as said, the muffs will last 25 days constant on, and some optics for literally years.

Most upper tier competitors are using electronic muffs today, and most small unit soldiers in special unit have them incorporated into their headgear along with communications. Even using silencers, muffs are necessary. There's incentives beyond peak sound suppression that give them an edge.
 
Just want to comment on the above post.

I absolutely HATE lithium replacement batteries for items like flashlights and earmuffs. I do not find the life of these significantly any longer yet the batteries come in about 50 or more unique shapes and sizes and ratings and cost anywhere from $5-10 individually.

Years ago I bought one of these "new and improved" lithium battery flashlights. I experienced no noticeable improvements in performance or life, just much more expensive batteries. I quickly rid myself of it. A year ago I got a shotgun with a Surefire foreend and light. Wouldn't ya know it had the 123A lithium battery.

Ya know, the battery makers *could* design these "new and improved" batteries to be the same size and design as current offerings, and let the product and its miracle properties sell itself. But they purposefully make them marginally different in size and shape so as to REQUIRE their purchase. :mad:

I just had to buy some new 123A batteries for a surefire light. Individually they were $5. I had to buy a box of 12 of them to get the price down to under $2 each. Now I have to stock about 5 or more uniquely different types of batteries like I'm a convenience store!

I've never believed that alkaline were a drawback, nor saw any improved life or performance of the lithium. In fact, the batteries I replaced were from a flashlight that sat for a year and the batteries were dead! So if they are going to die, I'd much prefer to spend 1/5th the costs on the battery, and have a greater chance of having some around the house. It's the design of the item (not having auto off feature, and a very inconvenient areas to change the battery feature) that were the problem.

When shopping, I specifically avoid anything that requires the lithium disposables.
 
I just today received my Howard Leight new unit and tried them out with a loud stereo and other household noises. The amplification and dampening were awesome. They are a slim design, have auto-shutoff, and the battery compartment is on the outside of the unit for easy access. And they have a Ipod jack and cord for music. Claims to reduce to 22db! All for only $50. Assuming these perform well, I'll order another pair or two for the nightstand gun, the range, and maybe for yard mowing.

I will say that for home defense and for the range, the amplification and ability to actually hear your surroundings is very important to me.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the info. I am in the market for something "better". Are they comfortable to wear? My cheap pair is not very comfortable, but easy to replace the batteries.

Also, I tend to agree about your comments on lithium batteries and the sizing. I think the quality of the product should sell itself not have it required or the only option.
 
Which Howard Leight model reduces to 22 decibels? I'm on the website and I don't see the model.

Do you mean it reduces sound BY 22 decibels or it reduces TO 22 decibels? Reducing to 22 decibels would be amazingly quiet.
 
Reducing TO 22 decibels would be an impossible claim, because you don't know what the decibel level is of the sound source. If the muffs reduce a 100 decibel sound to 22 decibels, they will reduce a 120 decibel sound to 42 decibels.
 
I usually use Howard Leight electronic muffs. However, I wear glasses and they "bend" the earpieces, so I've started experimenting with various plugs. Not as much noise reduction though.
 
Well there may be some product confusion or marketing confusion, perhaps even misleading marketing with the NRR rating. Not uncommon in the world.

The website says NRR 22. That claim is defined here and is not the same as reducing it 22db:
http://www.coopersafety.com/noisereduction.aspx

NRR is a formula to determine db.

Per the manual:
Example:
1. The environmental noise is 92db
2. NRR is 22
3. Resulting noise entering the ear is approximately 70 db.
Click to expand...

So, in laymans terms, the electronic muffs reduce shop tools (saws, lawnmowers, etc) to household appliances (dishwasher, vaccuum cleaner, comfortable stereo volume, etc.).

These feel slim and comfortable but I have not yet used them in the field or range.

If you're really looking for cheap earpro, then the foam inserts provide excellent protection!
 
leadcounsel said:
The website says NRR 22. That claim is defined here and is not the same as reducing it 22db:
http://www.coopersafety.com/noisereduction.aspx

NRR is a formula to determine db.

Per the manual:
Example:
1. The environmental noise is 92db
2. NRR is 22
3. Resulting noise entering the ear is approximately 70 db.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
So you're saying that 92 - 22 does not equal 70? Or that 92 - 22 =70 does not mean that the muffs reduce the incoming sound level by 22 decibels?
 
The muffs I own use AA's, and those are available in lithium at the common discount box stores.

Lithiums have a ten year shelf life and were developed for long term storage with military equipment that 1) had to be stored long term 2) had batteries with it that could be immediately used at full power. (Other items the military powers up use thermal batteries, same problem. Long term storage in the munitions they power, but must immediately provide full power. I used to make them at a local defense contractor.)

I keep a AA flashlight in the console of my vehicle - it's been there two years in the summer time heat (not good for batteries at all) and the light remains functional with no leakage from the lithiums.

I don't use them in all my gear - the personal EDC light uses rechargeables. One difficult behavior with rechargeables is that the voltage output dwindles with use and that affects the performance of the gear they are in. Lithiums run full voltage until nearly the end - which signals their life clearly. The lithiums I have used last just as long as alkalines - add the lengthy and harsh storage on top of that. Lots of gear enthusiasts report the same.

No question the 123's are a pain, I gave them up and even donated the Surefire that used them to the military. AA's and AAA's are a better source for my use on a daily basis - and most of the lights available at economical prices these days are more than good enough with sufficient light output. Same as red dot optics - or muffs.

I may have retired the oldest guy in my unit when we came back off the first deployment, but I try to keep up.
 
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