Hand guns and bears . . . let's chat.

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Prof Young

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Yours truly is in Alaska.

I didn't think I'd get the opportunity to fish in an unpopulated area, but we stayed in Cantwell prior to going to Denali and got the opportunity to fish in the Jackson River. Walking down there a group coming back up tells us that the fishing is good. The lead guy has a huge handgun strapped to his chest. He tells us to stay "aware" as a grizzly has been chasing the local moose around. We get to the river and meet a fellow fisherman. Gary too has a huge handgun on his hip, and he too mentions the moose chasing grizzly. I'm now starting to think I should have brought one of my large handguns along.

Next day we are in Denali. We have the good fortune of seeing a sow grizzly and two cubs about 150 yards away. The binoculars bring them in close and it is clear that the mama is MORE THAN HUGE. Huge doesn't even begin to describe her. (Amazingly majestic animal.) Now I'm thinking a big handgun would be better than nothing, but not by much. You'd have to have a really big gun and be a really good shot to stop this thing with a hand gun. I talk about this to the park guide who suggests that properly used bear spray is a better bet. I'm thinking well that's the park person talking so . . . I talk to the guys behind the gun counter at Sportsmans Warehouse in Fairbanks and they agree, bear spray is better bet. So I suppose one should take both.

Let's talk about this.

Life is good. Watch for more gun related posts from Alaska.

Prof Young
 
From who spend their lives in such situations:

A firearm (even a big one) may kill the bear, but not before he kills you.
Spray (actually a high-pressure stream) will stop a bear dead in its tracks "almost every time"

Carry both, spray first.
 
Yep. I grew up in So Calif. our bears are like big dogs. When i went to Ak for the first time, i was told to bring a rifle. The largest one i had was a Steyr scout in 308. Once up there, and seeing my first Ak bear in the wild, i wanted something bigger...like 375 or so. Lol
 
If you do a search you will find a TON of "what handgun for bear" threads of numerous variations.

Many things get discussed, though somethings are often overlooked. Like how service class semiautos are not good for bears. Their lack of thumbs means they have trouble with safeties and magazine buttons....and, for the same reason, SA revolvers are about out...

The long claws really need a pretty generous open triggerguard, so probably the best choice is a large frame DA revolver. :D

ok, a bit more serious, bear spray is a DETERRENT (if/when it works) Firearms are a defense, IF/when they work. The desired end result of both is the same, not having the bear disassemble your parts, but the approach is completely opposite.

Neither one is right for ALL situations, so carry both, and know how to use either correctly.

Ol' Elmer used to say something like "any decent caliber handgun will stop a bear attack, every time, if you keep your nerve"... what he meant by "decent caliber" was .38 and above, and what he meant by "keep your nerve" was being able to shoot the bear through the mouth and break the bear's neck. He never claimed you wouldn't get "clawed or chawed, some" only that if you kept your nerve, you would win.

Never had even the slightest desire to test the truth of that, but it made sense. Having heard of a bowhunter who managed to survive a grizz attack by stabbing the bear with an arrow, (and survive long enough to reach medical attention, and beyond) I'd say a sufficiently determined fellow with a fairly powerful handgun stands a reasonable chance.

The other side of the coin is, its defense, not stand your ground to the last man and the last round. Meaning, mostly, yield to the bear if its after something that isn't you or someone else body. In other words, don't fight them over what in your creel or camp cooler.

Spray is for you can't retreat, NEED to drive them off, but aren't at enough risk to justify shooting. A gun is for when nothing else will work.

Seems to me that only carrying one, or the other in dangerous bear country is artificially limiting your options needlessly.
 
"..."what handgun for bear" threads..." This one's about that in Alaska. Last I heard it would be a .44 Mag you can shoot. If you can't shoot a .44 accurately and fast, you might as well carry a stick with a bell on it. Mind you, no handgun round will give you a 100% guarantee. Neither will any round, handgun or rifle, stop anything in its tracks. Physics doesn't allow that.
Not that it'll help anyway. You'll never be fast enough to recognize the threat, draw and fire. Said firing being aimed at the central nervous system only. A small target on a great big critter. Even less so if Yogi(more likely to be Cindy) is coming from under 100 yards. Either of 'em can cover 100 yards in less than 6 seconds.
 
I've hunted in Alaska twice. I wasn't hunting bears either time but I saw lots of them and they can get big. I was carrying a 30-06 both times which would probably be adequate most of the time from a power and penetration standpoint, although it wouldn't be the fastest gun to get rounds on target. A big bore carbine loaded with hot hardcast flat nose is probably the best answer.
 
I bought my Dan Wesson 10mm 1911 after someone saw a black bear 90 miles away. For some reason, the thought of buying bear spray never occurred to me. :)
 
I agree with IdaD, a high power rifle would provide me FAR more comfort in Grizzly Bear Country than any handgun or Bear spray.
 
For anyone that thinks a loud high pitched whining noise will deter bears here's some famous proof positive it won't:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B3qhEIZBlX8

Her "bear spray" doesn't seem all that effective but the bear does react some...but for all I know she might have got "bug spray" by mistake.

Then there's this parody video too:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pm2mWYbsLZc

And of course there is the apocryphal story the park rangers tell of the tourist asking how long before they enter the woods should they apply their bear spray.
 
This is a good read


https://www.ammoland.com/2018/02/de...s-rate-37-incidents-by-caliber/#axzz5tJOdZ6pH

In a nutshell they investigated 37 incidents involving bear, both grizzly and black bear, and handguns. The handguns either killed the bear outright, or stopped the attack in all but one instance. That involved a 357 mag and it is thought the shooter missed with all shots.


Handguns ranged from 9mm up to the 454. The 44 magnum was used most often, but 9mm, 40, 45, and 10mm worked 100% of the time and combined for more successful stops than 44 mag.

Somewhere out there is updated data where and they have profiled something like 60-70 incidents. The overall success rate remained about the same.

Another good read.

https://www.wideopenspaces.com/alaska-man-kills-charging-brown-bear-with-a-9mm-pistol/


I've always felt handguns were UNDER RATED for bear defense. This backs up my suspicions. I'd not have any issues with 9mm loaded with heavy hardcast bullets on typical black bear. But for bigger bear I feel that heavy 10mm hardcast loads is as small as Id want to go. Regardless of Shoemakers success.

a high power rifle would provide me FAR more comfort in Grizzly Bear Country than any handgun or Bear spray.
Click to expand...

Me too, BUT... carrying a rifle and having it in your hands 100% of the time is no more practical in the woods than walking down main street. Last fall a guide was killed in Idaho by a bear while gutting an elk killed by his client. He HAD a pistol, but took it off while gutting the elk. They were archery hunting so no rifle.
 
Not that it'll help anyway. You'll never be fast enough to recognize the threat, draw and fire. Said firing being aimed at the central nervous system only. A small target on a great big critter. Even less so if Yogi(more likely to be Cindy) is coming from under 100 yards. Either of 'em can cover 100 yards in less than 6 seconds.
Click to expand...

The proof says otherwise.
 
My first experience with a good sized brown (900+ lb) was from a tree stand about 15 yards away. He was tall enough to probably have reached my feet if he wanted and my .300 mag and .44 mag didn't feel like enough (though both would have done the job).

My wife describes them as "furry smart cars", I feel it is quite apt.
 
you should always take a friendly bar bum who is legaly blind-over weight with a bum leg along with you. they can be gotten at a local bar by offering a free week end of drinking at the end of the trip.
 
jmr40 said:
Me too, BUT... carrying a rifle and having it in your hands 100% of the time is no more practical in the woods than walking down main street.
Click to expand...

That's the main rub with a rifle for bear defense. You would have to be disciplined about keeping it on you all the time which is much harder than a handgun.

Cool stats on handguns and bear defense, though - thanks. I've never felt undergunned with a 9mm in where I live (Idaho) but I think cats are a lot more likely problem than bears. Frankly people are a lot more likely than either - animal attacks are really rare.
 
Few people speak bear (I don't). Bear spray works when the bear is being pushy, not when the bear is focused on killing. If you don't speak bear, you either error on the side of killing the bear or you risk getting munched.

I speak dog pretty well and I know a little black bear. But I don't speak any of the Grizzly species. So I would tend to rely on a firearm versus bear spray.
 
I have been given to understand that if one speaks dog to a bear, the bear doesn't like it, and will run away. I do not plan to try that out on an angry grizzly.

D
 
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