Hammer weight question?

R

rrruger

New member
As I understand it, a lighter DA hammer spring can affect the gun's ability to ignite primers. I am also told that the the hammer impact is more about speed than weight. That being said, is there a ratio between the hammer weight and spring weight that would allow you to lighten the spring 'and' the hammer, and retain the reliability of the impact?
Thanks for any feedback.
 
I think there's too many variables to assign a specific ratio, and the optimal balance would need to be determined empirically. Nonetheless, a lot of people have messed with spring weights & hammers, and can give you some guidance. You'll get some of the best info there is on this subject on the revolver subforum of the Brian Enos forum. Those guys really know their way around a tuned revolver.

As for my guns, I have a 686 with a radically bobbed hammer. The action's been tuned to a 7.5 lb DA trigger pull, and it shoots everything I've put in it.

I have a 625 with a similarly bobbed hammer, and I've taken the action to about 6 lbs, at which, it's pretty close to it's limit, even with Federal primers.

I also have a 66 in which I've installed an Apex hammer and tuned the action to about 6 lbs. I get occasional misfires (with Federal primers), so one of these days I'll stiffen it up a bit.

Guys like Randy Lee can get the DA down to 5 lbs and still be reliable with Federal primers, but it takes a lot more than simple polishing of the internals, bobbing the hammer and swapping springs.

My 686:
partialCarmonizedHammer003.jpg


My 625:
TomCarmonizedHammerRight.jpg
 
If you reduce the hammer's mass it will fall faster with the same spring. This is good. The locktime is also reduced. That's also good. With a factory weight spring under a hammer you should not lose any reliability when bobbing a hammer. Just don't try to go too light on the spring weights. For DA shooting you want the hammer to fall quickly and reset quickly. I handled one of Miculek's guns at a match and he doesn't reduce the springs on his guns. He told me he actually uses heavier springs in some guns to get the trigger to reset fast enough to keep up with his amazing finger. He can easily outrun a factory S&W trigger pull in DA.
 
He told me he actually uses heavier springs in some guns to get the trigger to reset fast enough to keep up with his amazing finger. He can easily outrun a factory S&W trigger pull in DA.
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Not taking anything from Jerry, but it's unlikely any human can cycle a stock DA trigger that fast, especially while shooting in match conditions.

More likely, IMO, is that Jerry rides the trigger during the return (generally considered a bad habit): A heavier rebound spring helps him go faster because the trigger's pushing his finger faster, not because he'd otherwise outrun it. And if he rides the trigger, a stronger rebound also lessens the chance of a short-stroke. Fortunately for him, he's got plenty of power in that trigger finger of his for the trade.
 
I can assure you he is not riding the trigger. He has been shooting stock S&Ws since he was a young man and has built up incredibly strong and amazingly fast hands. When he fires the gun his trigger finger is snapping back forward faster than it moved when pulling the trigger back. He told me that if your finger is having to wait for the trigger to reset then your speed limit is determined by the gun. The reset speed of the gun's trigger is as fast as it's ever going to fire DA. A heavier rebound spring will make it reset faster. I too find it hard to believe a human can outrun a factory sprung S&W but Miculek and McGivern have done it. I cannot even cycle an unloaded S&W as fast as Miculek can fire it with live rounds AND hit with it. I have stood right behind him and watched him shoot and I still cannot believe what he is doing.
 
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He has been shooting stock S&Ws since he was a young man and has built up incredibly strong and amazingly fast hands.

When he fires the gun his trigger finger is snapping back forward faster than it moved when pulling the trigger back.

I cannot even cycle an unloaded S&W as fast as Miculek can fire it with live rounds AND hit with it.

I have stood right behind him and watched him shoot and I still cannot believe what he is doing.
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Agreed. He's an incredible shooter - achieving Bunyan-like status among wheelgunners - so while not taking anything away from his extraordinary skill, none of this speaks to an ability to outrun the trigger.

I too find it hard to believe a human can outrun a factory sprung S&W but Miculek and McGivern have done it.
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You have actual data? Here's at least some: McGivern was pretty clear his guns were pretty stock. Nonetheless, he set a record of 5 shots in 0.45 seconds - a record Miculek tried unsuccessfully to beat (0.45 vs 0.57 seconds), strongly suggesting that even with optimized equipment, Miculek isn't outrunning his trigger.
 
It makes ya' kind of wonder if the the faster times of the the guys in the past wasn't due to the relative accuracy of their mechanical and manual operated stop watches vs the electronic marvels of today.
 
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