If someone was interested in having an H&K pistol(.45) just for the fun of it which would you choose and why? Is the Expert really worth the $1,250 CFI showes in the Shotgun News. The Tactical is $865. The USP is $575. The Compact is $665. Which one is the best value? Why? How will the Expert shoot compared to the USP or Tactical etc.
H&K .45's....Compact, USP, Tactical, or Expert
- Thread starter Jonpod
- Start date
Hi there. I recently purchased a full sized USP .45 and am very happy with its performance thus far. It is as accurate as my Kimber, easier to shoot(although not as fast into action)i.e. less recoil and torque, and is very low maintenance. The tactical and expert models both have the barrel positioning o-ring and higher visibility sights, which in theory should enhance accuracy. Personally, I don't believe that I would necessarily be a better shooter with those accoutrements. Others may feel differently about the enhancements. It's a big pistol, to be sure, but it doesn't feel as big in my hand as a Glock 21 does. Subjectively it feels a bit like a double-stack 1911, and the controls are arranged similarly. I'm happy with it "as is". Sorry that I can't offer more insightful commentary on the other models you've mentioned.
------------------
semper ubi sub ubi
------------------
semper ubi sub ubi
David Roberson
New member
I have both a Tactical and Compact, and I like them both, although admittedly the Compact is unnecessarily large for CCW, which seems to be its main purpose in life. Fortunately, I'm a big guy, and with a decent belt slide, I can carry the Compact acceptably well. It's been my CC gun of choice for a while now.
The Tactical has the same match trigger and adjustable sights at the Expert, and also has an O-ring barrel (although it's not the same as the Expert's barrel, which has the O-ring in a different place). It shoots great, but I haven't fired an Expert and so can't comment on it. I'm not convinced that it's worth paying the extra money for the longer slide and ambi safety you get with the Expert (in fact, since I don't like ambi safeties, I regard that as a drawback for the Expert when compared to the Tactical). If you get the Tactical, check with Capital City Firearms in Richmond, Va., for some neat accessories for it (thread protector, flash suppressor).
Also, if you want a Tactical, move fast -- Tacticals aren't being imported into the US any more (and may in fact be discontinued, although it's tough to tell -- HK makes lots of stuff that they don't sell in all countries). The Compacts are plentiful, at least here in NC.
Final tip: You'll find a reasonable selection of holsters marked for the USP .40, but they'll also fit the .45.
[This message has been edited by David Roberson (edited February 25, 2000).]
The Tactical has the same match trigger and adjustable sights at the Expert, and also has an O-ring barrel (although it's not the same as the Expert's barrel, which has the O-ring in a different place). It shoots great, but I haven't fired an Expert and so can't comment on it. I'm not convinced that it's worth paying the extra money for the longer slide and ambi safety you get with the Expert (in fact, since I don't like ambi safeties, I regard that as a drawback for the Expert when compared to the Tactical). If you get the Tactical, check with Capital City Firearms in Richmond, Va., for some neat accessories for it (thread protector, flash suppressor).
Also, if you want a Tactical, move fast -- Tacticals aren't being imported into the US any more (and may in fact be discontinued, although it's tough to tell -- HK makes lots of stuff that they don't sell in all countries). The Compacts are plentiful, at least here in NC.
Final tip: You'll find a reasonable selection of holsters marked for the USP .40, but they'll also fit the .45.
[This message has been edited by David Roberson (edited February 25, 2000).]
I have owned my compact USP for about 6 months now. Great gun, reliable, very easy to clean and maintain. As a CCW, it's ideal for me. I am bigger than your "average Joe"
so it conforms well. Thousands of rounds have been fired through her, with no problems at all. As for the tactical, and the expert, I remain uncertain. A co-worker has the full size USP. Great weapon also, just bigger. If you are looking for a CCW, I recommend the compact .40 or .45. An on duty weapon, either the full size or the compact. I see no sense in spending the extra hard earned cash on the others unless you plan on competing or intend on joining the Navy S.E.A.L.S. My $.02.
JJC
so it conforms well. Thousands of rounds have been fired through her, with no problems at all. As for the tactical, and the expert, I remain uncertain. A co-worker has the full size USP. Great weapon also, just bigger. If you are looking for a CCW, I recommend the compact .40 or .45. An on duty weapon, either the full size or the compact. I see no sense in spending the extra hard earned cash on the others unless you plan on competing or intend on joining the Navy S.E.A.L.S. My $.02.
JJC
Thanks guys for all the information. You have helped me rule out the Expert. It is just too expensive. That leaves the other three. I am curious about how these all perform on the range. How about a rough estimate of group sizes at 15 to 25 yds. My Sig 220 performs very well with 8 to 10 inch groups at 25yds (I could probably do better if I didn't buy cheap ammo and if I had some shooting instruction). I really don't need it for ccw or home defense. I'm more interested in having one for shooting nice groups at the range. Plus I'd like to have one before they are all gone. I know that the compact model does not have the recoil system like the larger models. Should this be a big issue in the decision.
Jonpod,
The Tactical would be my first choice as a range gun. A liitle impractical for carry, especially since the sights sit so high on the top of the frame. (Tough to holster) However, accuracy is phenominal. The grip takes a little getting used to, at least for me. The compacts fit my hand better, but don't even come close to the Tactical for accuracy. If you can find one (tactical) and don't like it for some reason, you will have no trouble getting rid of it. It's a really fun gun! Good luck,
SM
The Tactical would be my first choice as a range gun. A liitle impractical for carry, especially since the sights sit so high on the top of the frame. (Tough to holster) However, accuracy is phenominal. The grip takes a little getting used to, at least for me. The compacts fit my hand better, but don't even come close to the Tactical for accuracy. If you can find one (tactical) and don't like it for some reason, you will have no trouble getting rid of it. It's a really fun gun! Good luck,
SM
Gopher a 45
New member
AHM1776,
In my experience, no. I have the standard-finish .45compact, which I use as a carry gun, range gun, etc. I live near the ocean but don't take any special precautions with the finish other than normal cleaning (no dessicant packs, etc.) and the finish has held up very well. HK brags about it in all their sales literature and, IMHO, they have a reason to. In fact, the only appreciable wear on my pistol is on the sights, extractor and minor wear on the barrel (all of which do not have the finish of the slide). So, I would have to say that the stainless is just for looks, and I didn't want a shiny gun for a carry piece. Anyone who has had better luck with the stainless, feel free to contradict me, though.
In my experience, no. I have the standard-finish .45compact, which I use as a carry gun, range gun, etc. I live near the ocean but don't take any special precautions with the finish other than normal cleaning (no dessicant packs, etc.) and the finish has held up very well. HK brags about it in all their sales literature and, IMHO, they have a reason to. In fact, the only appreciable wear on my pistol is on the sights, extractor and minor wear on the barrel (all of which do not have the finish of the slide). So, I would have to say that the stainless is just for looks, and I didn't want a shiny gun for a carry piece. Anyone who has had better luck with the stainless, feel free to contradict me, though.
I picked up the USP 45 full size just before the end of the year. The only reason I didn't go for the tactical was the threaded barrel and I knew that Kalifornia was going to consider them assault weapons after the first of the year per SB23.
I didn't go for the expert because I figured I could buy two pistols for what that one cost.
[This message has been edited by bullseye (edited February 27, 2000).]
I didn't go for the expert because I figured I could buy two pistols for what that one cost.
[This message has been edited by bullseye (edited February 27, 2000).]
Jonpod;
Good choice! I use my Tactical as my house gun. It's accurate, though I'm not sure if would be much more accurate than your Sig P220. I haven't tried very many loadings in mine, but it has been 100% reliable with everything I've fed it so far. I commonly fire 230 grain +P rounds through it and find the felt recoil almost pleasant. The USP recoil system works. However, muzzle flip is still clearly present, much like the muzzle rise on the Sig P220.
The double action trigger pull sucks. The single action pull makes up for the double action pull.
Like someone else said, the front sight is tall, but I found a nylon holter by Shooting Systems that fits nicely. The sights are also very easy to see, I'm thinking of adding a white bar and dot set-up on the existing sites.
I could go on, but you've made your decision. Again, good choice.
jjc2
Good choice! I use my Tactical as my house gun. It's accurate, though I'm not sure if would be much more accurate than your Sig P220. I haven't tried very many loadings in mine, but it has been 100% reliable with everything I've fed it so far. I commonly fire 230 grain +P rounds through it and find the felt recoil almost pleasant. The USP recoil system works. However, muzzle flip is still clearly present, much like the muzzle rise on the Sig P220.
The double action trigger pull sucks. The single action pull makes up for the double action pull.
Like someone else said, the front sight is tall, but I found a nylon holter by Shooting Systems that fits nicely. The sights are also very easy to see, I'm thinking of adding a white bar and dot set-up on the existing sites.
I could go on, but you've made your decision. Again, good choice.
jjc2
I called CFI and they were completely sold out of all their H&K USP's. I found a local dealer who sells H&K. He ordered two back in November of '99. They will be arriving this week and my name is on one of them for $899. This seems like a very fair price to me. I've heard of retails as high as $1,300. Anyway, I'm pretty excited to add the Tactical to my growing collection of handguns. I have to wait until the 18th though until "Big Brother" will allow me to have another pistol (one per month in Va). I will drop a range report for anyone interested. Good shooting all!