Gun Laws on Indian Reservations?

M

Matt VDW

New member
I'm curious about the extent to which state and federal gun laws apply to Indian (or Native American, if you prefer) reservations. It seems that the reservations have sort of a strange semi-sovereign legal status, which lets them do things like open casinos in states that prohibit gambling elsewhere. There aren't any reservations in Ohio so I don't have any first-hand experience.

Does anyone here know? I don't need (and can't afford :)) a legal opinion, just an outline of the facts.
 
This is just a guess, but I believe that the Reservations are considered to be Federal Territory, with the Tribes paaing their own laws and the Federal Gov't having the last say on what passes.

I have seen a lot of vehicles in the Navajo and Cherokee Nations with .30-30's in the rear windows, but I haven't seen a lot of pistols. This could be the Gov't disallowing them, or it could be the fact that the residents are too damn poor to afford a pistol.

You might try sending a letter to the Bureau of Indian Affairs. They are the Agency responsible for enforcing Federal Law in the Nations. When the FBI doesn't think they need to stick their noses into it, that is.

LawDog
 
The way I heard it (from my CCW instructor) is that each reservation has their own laws concerning guns. You have a right of passage through their land, but unless you are up-to-date on the specific reservation's gun laws, you are advised not to stop with your gun.

Around here, I've heard numerous stories about guns getting confiscated from people shooting on reservations. I liken the reservations to foreign countries; and I don't know the rules there. I stay away.
 
It would be great to get some answers on this. My UT cwl is good in many states with numerous reservations... AZ, MT, WY, etc. I'll try to do some research. My understanding is that the crime rate, (especially involving non-Indians as victims...justifiable revenge?) can be high on some reservations. I had a tribal policeman in CA tell me "I wouldn't drive on the reservation after dark if I were you..."

I have a friend in AZ who has spent a lot of time on the Navajo reservation...I'll ask him.
 
especially involving non-Indians as victims...justifiable revenge?

Now there's a pearl of wizdom! I am caucasian, so I ought to be fair game for someone whose ancestors were harmed by a person of "my" race? I am sure that reasoning appealed to gunboat commanders who would shell Polynesian islands, killing the guilty and innocent alike, if one of their crew got kai-kai'd. Except your justification is even more removed from even a chance of nailing the guilty party.

I suppose I can hunt down and kill German, Russia, Arab and Polish tourists for all the wrongs they may or may not have done to my ancestors. Let's add other races to the target list, too, as I am sure some person of that race had hurt a Jew in the past! Ridiculous? Sure.

Or were you kidding?

[This message has been edited by cornered rat (edited September 27, 1999).]

[This message has been edited by cornered rat (edited September 27, 1999).]
 
cr-
Ummm- I don't think he was kidding; just stating fact. Don't shoot the messenger. ;)

400 years of overt and neglectful genocide wear on any race.
Rich
 
I was wondering if an Indian tribe could set up some sort of gun-related business that would skirt state (and federal?) laws the way the Indian casinos do (or do they?). Maybe buying a couple of AKMs and charging tourists $15 a mag to let 'em rip? :D But perhaps the treaties that established the reservations have some sort of disarmanent clauses, a la our post-WWII peace treaty with Japan.

If I were a tribal leader, I'd think along the lines of making a little bit of sovereignty go a long way...
 
Growing up 40 miles south of the Cheyenne Indian reservation it is my basic understanding that on a reservation Indians are subjected to FEDERAL law, state law does not apply and they make their own laws. Therfore no new AKMs because federal law prohibits it. State and local law enforcement can not go onto and Indian reservation and arrest an Indian. The charge must be a Federal charge and the Federal Authorities must be called. State and local law enforcement can wait until the Indian suspect come off the reservation and then arrest him/her. It is my understanding that state and local authorities (at least on the Cheyenne Res) get very little cooperation from the BIA in handing over suspects.

Later
Daren
 
Rat & Rich: tongue was fairly well in cheek, in a serious way. I can sympathize any hostility that some Native Americans might have against whites, as surrogates for our ancestors. As Rich said "400 years of...". I don't condone violent acts in the name of revenge, but I do understand them on a certain level. Hopefully, they don't happen often.

Btw, the scandal continues, in the name of the Bureau of Indian Affairs. If we can spend $120 BILLION on Stars Wars technology that didn't work, do you think the Gov't could cough up a billion and improve the reservations? As much as I dislike Klinton, he is the 1st President to visit (whatever his motives) the reservation in 50 years or more. Very sad.

[This message has been edited by Covert Mission (edited September 27, 1999).]
 
If any of you remember the second "Battle of Wounded Knee" there were lotsa photos of AIM
(American Indian Movement) members with AK-47's. This was well before AKM's were imported into the US. After the stand off all the Feds could find were some shot out .22's and lever guns.

Look north to Canada, they have been having problems with their Native Canadians(?), there has been near open warfare between the two sides. At places along the St. Laurence River, armed N/C's have pirated pleasure craft and even some larger boats. In a country were private ownership of firearms is tightly controlled, they did not seem to have much trouble obtaining AK's, RPG's, and the like.

If all the rest of the firearms in Canada were confiscated by the government, I would bet, those on their reservations would be able to give the Canadian military a real run for the money.

As to gunlaws on tribal lands inthe US, there are lots of places that sell guided hunts. I don't think that I would want to be caught hunting without permissinon from the tribal council.

------------------
Ne Conjuge Nobiscum
"If there be treachery, let there be jehad!"
 
I live in Shoshoni, Wyoming just off the Wind River Indian Reservation. Used to live on the Bureau Of Reclamation land surrounded on three sides by the "res".

Your post got me to wondering just exactly how the relationship between the reservation and other law enforcement agencies work so I called a buddy of mine who is a Divison of Criminal Investigations agent for the State. He is also sworn in as a federal officer so he can work investigations on the reservation.

According to my LEO friend, no one really understands how the system works if it does at all. For instance, his power of arrest on the reservation is limited if the perp is an enrolled tribal member. OTOH, if a non-Indian commits a crime on the reservation, local LEO will make the arrest. Now, when local LEO goes onto the reservation to assist BIA police, they do so as limited capacity federal officers for the purpose of tort liability.

If a non-indian goes on the reservation and commits a crime other than a misdemeanor under tribal law, the reservation police can not arrest the perp. In other words, BIA police can not incarcerate a non-indian in their reservation jail.

As for Indians who commit a crime, the BIA police can arrest them and put them in the reservation pokey for the little stuff. However, for a felony, the FBI makes the arrest and processes the perp through the Federal Court system. Got that?

My friend tells me he once had a federal arrest warrant for a tribal member on the reservation. Even though he is a federal officer, he had to get the FBI (not the BIA) to make the arrest. The perp then went through extradition proceedings from the res to the state just as you would from state to state.

My friend concluded our conversation by telling me that it is very confusing and complicated and not to quote him since it is clear I still don't understand how it all works in spite of his best efforts to educate me. It seems it appears not only whether the crime takes place on tribal land, it also matters if the perp is an enrolled tribal member. It also depends on whether the crime was a tribal violation (BIA police) or a federal violation (FBI).

As for federal gun laws, they all apply to residents of the reservation. State laws, such as our CCW laws don't mean squat.
 
Yet federal law per se, does not prohibit one from carrying a weapon concealed or not except on certain grounds or structures. The Army Corps of Engineers for instance, prohibits firearms on Corps property for any purpose other than hunting. With the Bureau of Prisons, the agency I work for; the Warden of each prison is granted broad discretion in determining what is and isn't cotraband by Title 18, USC. Basically, "anything" that is brought onto the grounds of a prison without the "knowledge anmd permission" of the Warden is legally considered contraband. Obviously, BOP Wardens are omniscient, since they are expected to know of and approve everything that enters the property. It's quite an accomplishment.
 
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