gun blast in small room question

C

confused

New member
What would you guys recommend for a hd gun that would'nt blind and completely deafen you/your spouse if called upon to use?
Our house is small and so are the rooms.I worry that any blast might have potenetial repurcussions to hearing.
And yes I would rather be deaf than dead so beat that horse somewhere else please.
I am asking if there is a handgun with a more tolerable noise level for close quarters use?
 
22 short revolver is your best choice....

then again it might not do the job on that 'dead horse'.

sounds to me like you need to pay for a tax stamp on a sound suppressor.
 
If you are in a home defense situation, you won't even hear the report. A few shots in close quarters is not going to make you deaf anyway. Your ears might ring for a few hours, but, like I said, you aren't going to hear the noise during the event. You may not even remember firing.

Those that have been in situations like this know what exactly what I am talking about.
 
Don't worry about noise levels from gunfire

Hi,
I am a VERY lucky man. in 1985 I was wounded by an IED.
It was a 155mm cannon shell, and it exploded less than 3 meters (possibly less than 2M) from the Jeep in which I was travelling.

I did require a fair bit of stitching, and I surely do have some residual tinitus (ringing) but I can still hear quite normally, wihtout any hearing aids. ( This, and some scarring are the only impairement I suffered from this incident, hence my belief that I am a lucky person).

I think we can all agree that the "boom" factor of a 155mm at close range is far worst than any firearm you may use in a small room.

So, for SD or Home Defense, choose whatever firearm you shoot best with, in a caliber that is potent enough to incapacitate an oponent without requiring more than 2 hits to COM. It is far more important to be able to neutralize the threat succesfully than to worry about hearing loss.

Regarding the muzzle flash, it is highly unlikely that you will be in absolute darkness , and as soon as there is some ambient light the muzzle flash does is not a hindrance. Generally, guns of the same caliber have more muzzle flash with shorter barrels, so if this is a concern you may want to choose a firearm with a barrel of 4" at least; most full size autos have it, and off course it is easy to find revolvers with this barrel length as well.

Brgds,

Danny
 
I've fired a 45 acp 1911 inside a house once by stupidity. Now, I was pretty shocked by the fact the gun fired, so I didn't hear it, see a muzzle flash or feel the recoil. As a matter of fact it took a few seconds to even realize what happened.

However, the funny part is no one else in the house heard anything either. My wife's uncle in the next room thought I'd "popped a primer" reloading. My wife and my mother in law neither one heard anything, just down the hall.

I have no desire to try it again.
 
If you are in a home defense situation, you won't even hear the report. A few shots in close quarters is not going to make you deaf anyway. Your ears might ring for a few hours, but, like I said, you aren't going to hear the noise during the event. You may not even remember firing.

Those that have been in situations like this know what exactly what I am talking about.
Click to expand...


It sounds like you are fairly young. 20's to 30's. Hit 50 and the answer is MUCH different. While you may not register the sound cognitively due to the massive release of adrenaline, your ears ARE still damaged.

Hearing damage is cumulative and acceleratatory. That means every loud sound does a little ding of damage. At first the difference going from 100% to 99.9% is un-noticeable. However, it is like whacking a boulder with a sledge hammer. At first only little chips fly off, but after a while huge chunks fly off after you have created cracks and faults in the stone. The force used may actually be reduced, but the destruction of the boulder is much greater with each hit. The cilia in your ears respond the same way. In fact, a sound that may have killed off 0.1% of the cilia when you are 20 years old may kill off 20-50% when you are 50-60 years old.

The deal is, the earlier damage puts faults into your hearing mechanisms (cilia) and those faults add up and add up and add up until just like the sledge hammer on a boulder - they break and you have lost a large amount of hearing. Permanently.

I'm about to pull the trigger on a tax stamp myself for that exact reason. Why harm yourself when you don't have to?
 
I dont know about small rooms, I DO know about tiny tunnels, I know for a fact if you have to shoot a 1911a1 with 45 hard ball in a confined space, YOU WONT HEAR IT. Your heart beat while cawling through the tunnel before you encounter what you're looking for sounds like thunder, but when the time comes to let off a couple rounds you wont notice the pistol going off. Same with HAVING to fire a M16 in small rooms. You dont hear the nose of the gun, you can hear screaming and hollowering but I don't recall hearing the nose of the gun going off.

Never had to shoot in building searches in LE, but again, I remember my heart beat sounding like thunder and breathing sounding like a wind storm.

I think you can file this in the catagory, if you have to shoot in a confined SD situation, nose of the pistol is the least of your problems.

As far as damage the ear, all I can say is HUH

I think my hearing loss is do more to 35 years shooting compitetion plus years of EOD work.
 
Hi Cougar,

I am NOT saying that loud noises, (inlcuding gunfire) do not cause hearing loss, they do.

What I am saying is that this is not what should be the decisive consideration when choosing a SD /HD gun and caliber.

With exception to LEO's and military personnel, most of us will ever fire a limited amount of rounds (most never will) in a house. but when (and if) we do, our primary concern is to survive, and for that, what really matters is that we use a firearm with which we shoot well, and we use a calliber and ammo that is effective.

In a confrontation there wil be many factors that play a role in your success or failure to defend yourself. you will revert to what you have ingrained by practice (including bad habits) but with the added impairment that comes from stress, adrenaline, reduced mussle control, tunnel vision and so on.

This will affect you when you are on the street, and possibly more when you are at home (due to the added stress about your loved ones being in danger)

Therefore, unless you are a very well trained person, and have trained to the point that you are able to be equally proficient with a variety of firearms of different calibers, I recommend (again) that your choice of HD firearm is the one with which you shoot best.

As for the choice of calibers, unfortunately those that are less noisy are so because they have less power, so again I would think twice about choosing a less powerfull caliber because of concern for hearing loss. failing to stop an attack can ( and most likely will) cost you more than your hearing.



WRT to your reference about the age of Gyvel, perhaps you are right, maybe not.
However,

I actually agree with him. ( I am way past my 20's and I have fired more rounds inside buildings than I could ever count, not only in training)

My best example is the day when I won 1st place in pin-shooting with a 0.45. we were in an indoor range, and 4 of us were shooting at the same time with 0.45's.

I was not fighting for my life, only for a coveted 1st place, yet all I could remember was my front sight and trying to keep it on target while shooting as fast as I could.

In a confrontation, this will be more pronounced, and usually accompanied by tunnel vision.

Kraigwy just reinforces what I have said.




Brgds,
Danny
 
Keep a set of electronic earmuffs with your HD firearm and put them on at the first sound of an intruder. They will amplify your hearing of normal sounds, but protect you against the sound of the gunshot....of course your son who just came home late and unexpectedly from college will think you are out of your mind as you emerge from the bedroom in PJ's and earmuffs.
 
use a subsonic round

a long barrel 38 w/ 158 gr or a 45--colt or acp.

id be more concerned with a strategy than the boom.
coordinate w/ the wife and dont trip over the dog.

consider e-muffs or the suppressor. both items show for thought though their lawyer may rip you a new one for using them.
emuffs amplify sound and thats a big plus.

consider being able too control select lights in the house from the bedroom.
being able to back light the subject while you are still in the dark is in
you favor.
 
As Dr. Gun suggests, get a set of electronic muffs. Sportsman's Guide and some other have inexpensive ones that will do for HD use -- an are much better than nothing!! -- for around $30.

The brightness of the flash is a problem -- but it's a problem for the bad guy, too. In actual trials at a range, during one of our club's IDPA shoot, it didn't seem to be too bad a problem.
 
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Pistol caliber carbines are going to be the quietest firearms you can get without a tax stamp that will still shoot a reasonable caliber for defense. Especially if they lob their projectiles at subsonic velocities.
 
Subsonic ammo and ear muffs are not a solution (IMO)

Hi,
First, the term subsonic refers to the fact that the velocity of the bullet does not exceed the sound barrier, and therefore will not give a "crack" when fired.
However, this crack is only audible when you are on the side (or in front ) of the bullet's path, so it is fairly irrelevant to the shooter.

Unless you are using a suppressor (silencer) then you will hardly gain anything from using subsonic ammunition.

Also, some handguns will fail to cycle with sub-sonic ammo, so if you are going to try it, make sure that you test it first in a range, to ensure reliability.

WRT ear muffs, I really think that you want to give your senses the best chance to help you, and that includes you hearing. Electronic EM's are great but can malfunction, and I would hate to find that mine did at the wrong time.



Brgds,
Danny
 
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It should go without saying that hearing protection should be down the list from rapid response. However, IF time clearly permits, good quality electronic hearing protection definitely offers you some big advantages. It protects your hearing, it actually improves your hearing since you can adjust the volume to give yourself superhuman hearing and it also allows you to hear what's going on immediately after a shot. If it malfunctions you can remove it in less than a second.

I fired a handgun indoors (one shot) without hearing protection and while I did not hear the report, it was several minutes before I could hear anything at all. Then I was about half deaf with ringing (ringing ears tell you that damage has taken place) for the next half hour or so and badly impaired the rest of the day. I have not recovered all my hearing even though it has been years--I don't expect to. Fortunately the ringing stopped.

That said, I would never consider reaching for hearing protection unless there was absolutely no immediate threat. They're great for a typical "bump-in-the-night" scenario but a bad idea if there is a pressing need for immediate action.

Suppressors are nice, but they won't do a thing to protect you from the noise of your opponent's firearm.

As far as picking a caliber for minimal hearing damage, I would advise against trying that approach for two reasons.

1. You need to deal with the threat before you worry about your hearing. To do that you should ideally be shooting a caliber in the service pistol class--and all of those are pretty similar in terms of noise level and hearing damage.

2. No matter what you choose it won't affect the noise level of your opponent's firearm.
 
I've read 90% of these replies and have become confused.

Below are my own personal facts, maybe some can be applied to some of you.

Fact #1: If I was going to shoot a perp with a shotgun, I would need no more than ONE shot, and he would be dead or down. Which means that the flash from the shot means nothing. If I were top use a Pistol, I would have a light on and there would be NO reason for flash to effect my sight. (hearing be dammed, it's your life that means something, not your hearing during a one time event)

Fact #2: If I was to shoot at a perp in MY home, I would have a LIGHT ON, or I would NOT shoot.

Fact #3: If I was EVER to pull the trigger in a SD situation in my own or another person's home, I would ONLY do so in Full recognition that the person I was squeezing off at was NOT Friend or Family!

Fact #4: If YOU or anyone else pulls the trigger in the dark or at something they cannot 100% identify to be a bad guy, they are the King of FOOLS. Simple & factual!

Fact #5: I will NEVER fire at an unidentified target, whether it be human, animal or Paper. If I cannot fully identify it I cannot shoot it. This should apply to EVERYONE that touches a firearm...



To take time to put on a set of ear muffs during a Home Invasion, or suspected home invasion, when you need to be 100% aware of everything, is a foolish thing to do in my opinion.

I tried to put things as I see them, but I also tried not to force anyone to assume that they need to do what I do. I only feel that my actions are what is necessary to prevent accidents.

Accidents kill more loved ones than any other thing known to man.


K

P.S.
it also allows you to hear what's going on immediately after a shot.
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If you do NOT know what's going on after a shot, either yours or a perps, then you are in serious trouble...
 
Seems like some here haven't been able to suppress the need to rant OT. Back to the OP's question, I'd shoot a 3 to 5 (6 overlong for ideal wieldability) inch .38 out of either a 38 or 357... and not be overly concerned beyond. That said, I was at a gun show (medium sized room maybe 40X50), and there was an AD on the far side of the room (from me) of a .22 revolver--later determined to be .22LR--and youd've thought a .45 went off. Lots of folks, especially vets, scrambling for cover. No prolongued ringing of ears at my distance, but I was shocked. Btw, LE0s were so quickly on this scene to investigate it was amazing. Sure glad I wasn't that vendor or customer (who fired the gun at the floor). Good chip out of the concrete but no one hurt by the richochet. Now I've gone OT.
 
Fact #1: If I was going to shoot a perp with a shotgun, I would need no more than ONE shot, and he would be dead or down. Which means that the flash from the shot means nothing. If I were top use a Pistol, I would have a light on and there would be NO reason for flash to effect my sight. (hearing be dammed, it's your life that means something, not your hearing during a one time event)

Fact #2: If I was to shoot at a perp in MY home, I would have a LIGHT ON, or I would NOT shoot.

Fact #3: If I was EVER to pull the trigger in a SD situation in my own or another person's home, I would ONLY do so in Full recognition that the person I was squeezing off at was NOT Friend or Family!

Fact #4: If YOU or anyone else pulls the trigger in the dark or at something they cannot 100% identify to be a bad guy, they are the King of FOOLS. Simple & factual!

Fact #5: I will NEVER fire at an unidentified target, whether it be human, animal or Paper. If I cannot fully identify it I cannot shoot it. This should apply to EVERYONE that touches a firearm...
Click to expand...

All that assumes the best of all possible situations, when the SHTF.

What if Fact #2 and Fact #4 occur together? Or what if Fact #4 occurs while the shooter is in the dark but you aren't, or if the perps have cut off power to the house? Or, what if you shoot just as the perp fires and moves, and YOU MISS!! You can miss with a SHOTGUN, too, you know.

A good home defense plan includes a certain amount of flexibility.
 
My HD gun is a .38 Special or .357 Magnum 4" revolver (I have one of each that swap back and forth) I use 158 grain .38 Specials instead of 125 grain .357's because I'd kind of like to keep the hearing I have left.

I had good hearing until one day when I was shooting with my father-in-law, and I was standing about 10 or 12 feet away and to the left side when he fired off 5 or 6 rounds of .41 Magnum. This was outside. I was totally deaf for a couple of hours from that one exposure, and I still have permanent ringing in my right ear. That was about 10 or 15 years ago.
 
In spired by Koominx, I have decided to weigh in with a few observations of my own.

Electronic muffs are good and useful, but you get what you pay for. The $30 electronic muffs my friend and I have are monaural. One microphone (but a speaker inside each side of the muffs) means there is no directional information. His have broken twice. Once, the electronics quit working. The replacement set's battery compartment broke such that the battery didn't make contact any more. They also don't seem to increase hearing sensitivity. If you are looking for an increase in hearing sensitivity, I believe you will have to pay more, but not too much more. The cheapest Peltors are around $100. Higher up on the scale are ones actually designed to enhance hearing. (Not quite like night vision goggles for your ears, but if you believe the advertising copy, really, really good).

Try a few brands. We like them for use at the range.

A couple of posts seem as if the author expects to only have to shoot once. Not a particularly valid assumption. Anticipate multiple invaders, missed or ineffective first shots.

Fact #4: If YOU or anyone else pulls the trigger in the dark or at something they cannot 100% identify to be a bad guy, they are the King of FOOLS. Simple & factual!

Fact #5: I will NEVER fire at an unidentified target, whether it be human, animal or Paper. If I cannot fully identify it I cannot shoot it. This should apply to EVERYONE that touches a firearm..
Click to expand...
Tactical situations are highly fluid. The shoot/no shoot decision is, by definition, situational and it is the rare situation that will see any of us in full possession of all the facts. Koolminx is absolutely correct that you must be sure (not only is it the law of the land, but it is required by any decent moral code), but sometimes you have to go with the "preponderance of the evidence". If I am in my house, and a voice challenge to "Identify yourself" is answered with a bullet, I think it reasonable to take defensive action. Duck and cover, retreat, return fire, whatever the situation demands and is justified by the facts in my possession at the time.

If I really believed I had a home invasion or even a cat burglar in my home, I not only have a firearm and multiple lights, I have body armor. In the event I must leave the safety of my defensible space (and assuming I have the time), the vest goes on.

Of course, sitting here at my computer, bravado is easy. Likely, I would stay put. If I did not have to engage in a gunfight, I would not. Nothing portable enough for a thief to carry is worth the risk of taking a bullet (or the hassle of a legal defense, civil or criminal after sending bullets). If I have called for backup (the police), I am content to lay in wait in a tactically defensible position.

Lost Sheep
 
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