Going to Start a "Bedding the Action and Stock on an M91/30" Thread

M

Mosin-Marauder

New member
So, after doing a fair bit of research for my trusty M91/30, which I have aptly named 'Критерий' or 'kriteriy" which means " Yardstick" in Russian (see what I did there?). Anyway. After being thoroughly dissatisfied with its accuracy. I will be starting a thread that shows every step I take in improving the accuracy of this rifle, and if possible, I would like you fellas to judge my performance at my first endeavor in gunsmithing ( at least for me it is). I will record it's accuracy at 50, 100, and 200 yards before the experiment and after the experiment. Using both Surplus rounds and Winchester White Box 54R Rounds. I would like this to be a guide as to a new Mosin owner who wants to improve the accuracy of his/her rifle and to put everything into layman's terms (because Russian action bedding tutorials are hard to read) if everything pulls through correctly. I just thought this would be a nice little contribution to the Forum community to pay forward all the help I've received so far, and a nice learning experience for me and hopefully others. I would like to hear your thoughts on this before I do this aswell. I will be uploading pictures to accompany the paragraphs of information and instructions. Anyway, that's about it. Thanks!
 
For what it is I have been very happy with my mosins accuracy..I don't think I would ever put the time or money into trying to make it a precision rifle when I can sink that cash into a gun that is already built for precision..but with that said I am curious to see how this turns out and there is honestly no better gun to learn these skills on right now than the mosin if you mess it up (assuming it is not a collector of course) it's no big deal reach in safe and grab one of ther five or six you have in there lol..

Personally out of my mosins 1 is my personal shooter I consider the other ones investments for the future when the surplus drys up
 
I'm glad you approve of the idea. At first I thought it was a bad idea no one would like. I'm glad there's interest for it though. I hope you check out the thread when I get it up and running. First I have to pick up the supplies though. Thanks!
 
As you do your shooting for record, don't do it with the bayonet attached.

Also, have you inspected the bore for the condition of its rifling & to see if it's counterbored at the muzzle?
Denis
 
^thats big I'd make sure before you invest any time into it that the bore is in good shape..if the gun has a bad bore no amount of tweaking or upgrading will help it..also do you plan to leave the irons stock or replace them??i persoNlly prefer the slot and post sights over the ghost rings most people prefer today but that's what I learned on growing up..
 
Actually, I don't own a bayonet.
As for the bore, it's rifling is in good shape as Dar as I can tell. I'm not sure how to check if it's counterbored. It does need to be cleaned in copper solvent before use, as surplus rounds leave some nasty gunk in the barrel.
 
Look at the inside of the bore at the muzzle end.
If the rifling extends all the way to the end of the barrel, it's not counterbored.
Denis
 
And as for the sights, no, I do not plan to adjust or upgrade the rifle in any way other than this field-adjustment technique. As it doesn't require precise measurements and the supplies are easy to come by.
 
I'll check out the rifling tomorrow and see if it's counterbored. Does counterboring have an affect in the accuracy? Is it good or bad if it's counterbored?
 
Counterboring was a cheap way for the Soviets to salvage a barrel that'd had the last inch or two of the rifling worn away from improper cleaning, which did affect accuracy.

Counterboring removed the worn section of rifling, leaving that section slightly overbore, and letting the bullet exit without contacting any part of the barrel wall at the end.

Counterboring is the sign of the attempt to save a compromised barrel, and it can accompany worn rifling behind it.
It CAN affect accuracy, but it doesn't HAVE to.

The thing with trying to accurize a Mosin is that it can be very frustrating, time-consuming, and frequently a failure.
When it does all come together, it can be satisfying & the process can be fun.

Not saying don't try it, just don't expect too much, especially if you stick to the iron sights.
It'd be advisable first to get over your flinch & eye-closing. The poor accuracy you say you're getting may not be the rifle's fault.
Could be either you or the ammunition.
Denis
 
I've bedded a number of rifles with Marine-Tex and Brownell's Acra Glass. When I got my last Mosin- I less than thrilled with all the wiggle room and floposis there was between the stock and the receiver. I'd read some threads on here about using JB weld. Well, I had some of that, some modeling clay, some Johnson's paste wax, and a little time to kill. I always figgered I could dremmel the stuff out if I didn't like the results. I don't think I'll be needing to do that.

My barrel is fair to good and the front sight post leans way to the right. It started out producing a dismal 7" (+/-) shot pattern. Afterward, it brought it down to roughly a 4" group. I added a 3/4" x 2" strip of denim cloth to the bottom of the last 2" of bbl channel and now it squirts out about a 3.25" group at 100yds from a bench.
 
Work on the flinch & eye first.
Even a $3000 target rifle with a $2000 scope will shoot poorly if you close your eye & flinch on every shot.

You seem undecided on what you want to do, go with the Archangel or stay military.

A good rubber recoil pad, either fixed or slip-on depending on which way you end up, can help a lot with flinch.
A PAST shooting bra is great for shooting steel buttplates, if you have the money.
A folded-over towel to provide some padding between steel & shoulder works, if you don't.

Sticking to the military furniture leaves it looking historically correct, but also leaves it vulnerable to warped wood along the barrel that can affect how it shoots, and oil-soaked or other degraded wood internally around the action that can also affect how it shoots.

The Archangel stock seems to be developing a following, mixed reviews on their magazines.

As far as accuracy goes, the bores on Mosins vary widely in condition and tolerances.
I wouldn't waste time or money in trying to bed a counterbored barrel.

If you have a "looser" bore, you can get relatively poor accuracy even with good rifling.
Conversely, if you have a tighter bore you can get good accuracy even with worn rifling.

Bedding may improve it, may not.

Of the three Mosins I currently own, one is an unaltered PU sniper, one is a much sporterized rifle, one has only been dropped into a Boyds stock & had the front sight swapped for an adjustable post.

The sporter was cut back to 22 inches & bedded with aluminum pillars in its Boyds walnut, Leupold scope mounted on a Rock Solid base after the rear sights were removed. Minor trigger work on existing trigger. Rock Solid long & bent bolt handle installed.

The sporter with scope has done 3 shots in 3/4 inches at 100 yards with Hornady Match. Surplus averages about 2.5 inches.

The PU has done 3 into 1 5/16 inches with Hornady, averages around 2 inches with surplus loads.

The kickaround truck gun Mosin with iron sights & un-bedded Boyds laminated wood (to resist weather extreme warpage) has been astonishingly accurate, going 3/4 inches for 3 shots at 100 yards with surplus, despite a mediocre bore, and averaged about 1 3/4 inches with Hornady.

The Winchester stuff's not bad, not quite as tight as the Hornady, but not as expensive, either.

Three "grades" of Mosins, best overall performance off the bench was from the humblest of the bunch, with the worst bore & no scope.

Mosins are total crap shoots.
If you have a good one, you can have a very decent shooter.
If you don't, you can spend hundreds on one to make it into only a fair shooter.

Also, accuracy will tend to vary between cans of surplus ammunition.
What you have right now may be part of the problem, next can could improve your groups, or could be worse.
Denis
 
-But for the pure sake of learning, there is nothing wrong with learning to bed on a Mosin rifle. Mistakes won't sting nearly as bad as they would on a rifle with 4x more value.
 
Counterboring is the sign of the attempt to save a compromised barrel, and it can accompany worn rifling behind it.
It CAN affect accuracy, but it doesn't HAVE to.
Click to expand...

It can also improve accuracy, which was the whole point of doing it. You have heard of "re-crowning" a barrel? Same thing, except that the new crown will be recessed.

A quick Google search turned up this video, which explains it pretty well: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GBOhsgHXoLA

He does say that the reason for doing it is because "the rifling wears from use" which may be true, but it is not the reason for couterboring. The reason is to fix a worn crown, generally caused by the steel cleaning rod.
 
Em,
That's basically what I said.
Done by the Soviets to salvage a barrel with rifling worn at the muzzle from improper cleaning.

It wasn't done to "improve" accuracy in the conventional sense, it was done to restore lost accuracy in a well-worn barrel.

It is not the same thing as re-crowning, and it can have different effects on a bullet, depending on how it was done.

Re-crowning may typically be less than an eighth of an inch deep, usually less.
Mosin counterboring can be up to a couple inches deep.
Vastly different.

Denis
 
Mosin-Marauder,
Starting this journey now with my 1943 Izhevsk 91/30.

I've decided that rather than bed it, I'm going to buy a shim kit from Smith-Sights and use it to shim the action in the barrel. I'm also probably going to support the barrel with Cork or some kind of fabric. This will, in effect, keep the barrel consistent at known pressure points and reduce the wobble of the barrel.

In theory, anyways.
 
I'm going to do a Scope Scout Mount and NCStar Optic, or else I'd probably be looking at a Smith sight also. Heck, I still might if the mount is see through and allows me to use iron sights. You should see how bent my front sight post is :confused:
 
I went with a conventional scope position on my Tula.
I've worked with Scout scopes before & found I prefer the magnification of a regular optic, but that's just me. :)

I also can't express in words how much a longer bent bolt changes the Mosin's personality.
Recommend it, need to get it done on the truck gun.
Denis
 
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