FTF question

M

mrentropy

New member
New here. I actually joined to ask this....

I had a failure-to-fire (two, actually) in my revolver. S&W 386SC "Mountain Lite" Scandium-Aluminum alloy .357 mag.

I've had it for years but I've only put a few 100 rounds through it.

Ammo was Sellier & Bellot .38 sp 148gr wad cutter. I was also firing some .357mag ammo at the same range session with no problem.

Two rounds out of 7 FTF'ed. Inspection shows good, solid (well, solid-looking anyway), centered primer strikes. In fact, inspection shows that the bullet of one of the rounds is pushed out about 1mm out of the casing.... unless it was like that to begin with (?).

This for me was my first moment of putting my gun down gently at the range, keeping it in hand, muzzle pointed down-range, and just counting down from 10.

The ammo was several yrs old and had spent some time in the attic, where temperatures can get down to 40F on "winter" nights, and up to 120F or more during summer days. Humidity needle never strays from 50% RH. This is coastal CA.

So, ah, I'm guessing you're not supposed to store ammo like that? Or should that have been fine?

Thanks.
 
mrentropy said:
The ammo was several yrs old and had spent some time in the attic, where temperatures can get down to 40F on "winter" nights, and up to 120F or more during summer days. Humidity needle never strays from 50% RH. This is coastal CA.
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If the firing pin hit the primer, then I would suspect the ammo first, especially in a newer revolver. I would stick to newer ammo, and try to keep your ammo stored in moderate temperatures away from any significant changes in humidity.
 
Two rounds out of 7 FTF'ed. Inspection shows good, solid (well, solid-looking anyway), centered primer strikes. In fact, inspection shows that the bullet of one of the rounds is pushed out about 1mm out of the casing.... unless it was like that to begin with (?).
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Other folk here have actually done tests so I'll let them confirm it but JUST the primer going off would have pushed the bullet out of the casing more than one millimeter.

An alternative explanation of the bullet pushed out can be found in this thread.

http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=469829&highlight=setback

You could try firing the rounds a second time to see if they would go off.

You could pull the bullets and then check the powder and primer.

The 'solid hits' on the primer and the fact that the .357 magnum rounds fired without problem pretty much lets your firearm off the hook.

And you already know this, you should find a better, more temperate place to store ammo. Stored with even a little bit of care ammo will last for years and years and years. I've shot 20 year old ammo that worked fine and that is not even close to what others have reported.
 
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I recently had two squib loads in my LCR357 with 125gr Freedom Munitions 38 remanufactured ammo. The gun has had zero issues with other ammo. And I've fired more of that load with no issue yet from a GP100. Sometimes a certain gun just doesn't like a certain ammo.
 
About 10 years ago, I bought 1K of a foreign made 38SP ammo only to find numerous FTF in the batch. The company replaced the ammo at no charge but I did keep some of the empty brass from the defective lot. After some head scratching and lots of measuring, I found that the rim thickness on some cases was much thinner. Actually found this when the shellholder pulled off a case during resizing. The thin rim allowed the case to enter the cylinder deeper reducing the depth of the firing pin strike just enough to cause ignition failure. Give those FTF cases a good look and you might find the cause.
 
Thanks for the feedback.

The situation did make me realize, on afterthought, that a hang fire in a revolver can be a problem if you just keep pulling the trigger..... glad they were just full-on FTFs and not HFs.

Re the ammo: common sense on storage I suppose, but for a while I was pressed for space, and I thought, hey, ammo in Iraq has to deal with temps up around 120F, shouldn't mine? But maybe that's different? Mil spec ammo vs cheap off-the-counter ammo & all.
 
You said you don't shoot it much; does that mean you also don't have a lot? If so, a green military ammo can or two in a closet on the floor under heat and air should solve any issue in that regard.
 
I think you just came across a couple hard primers in that lot.

The bullet moving 1 mm are from "bullet pull", due to other rounds in the cylinder being fired, the heavy projectile wants to stay put while the firearm + cases pull rearward from recoil.
 
I will not buy S&B ammo anymore due to hard primers.
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Interesting. Is that true just for revolver cartridges or do you think that holds for 9mm too? I picked up two boxes on sale at Cabelas last week, 115gr and 124gr FMJ. Shot half of each through my Glock 19 last week with no issues.
 
regardless if the primers were hard, or not seated properly, gone bad from poor storage or whatever. it sounds like an ammo issue most likely. try another brand and see if problem continues, if so, then you can start being concerned with light strikes. but as of know, you can only assume ammo problem until you provide further evidence with more use. i wouldn't worry about it at the moment, but keep track of the types of ammo used if it continues, mark the cylinder it happened on and see if you can find a pattern of any kind. as for now, just keep shootin'. if it doesnt happen with any other brand, you can assume your ammo is no good and shoot it up and expect failures, but keep an eye out for squibs
 
My own experience is that loaded ammo is just about impervious to damage from external sources, short of throwing it into a fire.
Any reliability problems have been from the loading process.
No guarantee of that, but that's been my view.
 
A revolver might have these issues...

(1) If you have had it for a long time and have used oils and cleaners, it can be a cleaning issue for collected oils on internal parts.

(2) if the ammo you are using is misfiring 2 of 7, go to a different brand of ammo.

If you are still having the same problem of misfire, take it to a gunsmith and have it checked out with possible cleaning and checking for part misalignment.
 
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