Feed Problem with S&W .45 4513TSW

G

Greg All Calibers

New member
Recently, I started having a failure with my S&W .45 4513TSW. After it goes bang, the casing ejects just fine, but when the slide moves the next round into battery, the back of the new casing, at the cartridge extractor groove, sometimes will end up on the *wrong* side of the extractor (towards the barrel). Sometimes the round will slide over the extractor and seat on the breechface properly after the slide closes, sometimes it will not. You have to give the slide a good push from the rear to seat the round when this happens.

Getting new mags and recoil springs helped a lot, but still got one failure in 50 rds (started with very clean gun, kept shooting until a got a failure on rd # 21). The failure almost always happens on the last few rounds in the mag (makes sense, that's when the mag spring is more relaxed).

1. Has this ever happened to you- or do you know about this failure?
2. Is it normal, during the cycling of a round, for the back of the new casing to move from the barrel side of the extractor, then snap under it when the slide closes under the recoil spring pressure (or are autos always supposed to move the new round underneath the extractor as it's taking it out of the magazine

Thanks for your help.

Best Rgds, Greg
Dallas, Texas
 
I've seen a failure similar to this, however, it doesn't include the extractor groove being on the outside of the extractor.
Some shooters will place the strong hand as high as possible on the back strap of the grip. So high that the slide will leave marks on the thumb webbing of the strong hand. On occasions the grip will be too high and actually keep the slide from cycling properly. Either the slide will not extend far enough to allow the breach block to grab the next round, or the thumb webbing will slow the action of the slide causing the round to not seat properly.
I dont know if this is the problem or cause, but may be something to look at.! Also make sure your breach face is nice and clean!!
Good luck
EK
 
ek127, what you describe does not sound like the issue I am having. Has anyone out there had feed failures (on any gun) that involve the extractor ending up BEHIND the extractor groove on a newly chambered cartridge?

In other words, the aft end of the cartridge is not in full contact with the breech face because the extractor ended up either not sliding up into the groove when the gun cycled, OR it did not snap over into the groove?

Thanks.
 
I have seen this happen with improperly sized reloads. If you're using factory ammunition, contact Smith & Wesson or a local gunsmith. Your extractor's face may just need to be recontoured.
 
Thanks for the feedback. Can anyone comment on this part of the question? My gunsmith is not clear on it. Thanks.

2. Is it normal, during the cycling of a round, for the back of the new casing to move from the barrel side of the extractor, then snap under it when the slide closes under the recoil spring pressure (or are autos always supposed to move the new round underneath the extractor as it's taking it out of the magazine
 
Moving to the Semiauto forum for additional feedback...

(And I'll change the title to reflect the gun model.)
 
Does anyone know the answer? Thanks!

Can anyone comment on this part of the question? My gunsmith is not clear on it. Thanks.

2. Is it normal, during the cycling of a round, for the back of the new casing to move from the barrel side of the extractor, then snap under it when the slide closes under the recoil spring pressure (or are autos always supposed to move the new round underneath the extractor as it's taking it out of the magazine
 
OK I'll take a stab at this.

The case should slide up the breech face under the extractor.
It sounds like the case is being pushed forward by the breechface, and the case is snapping up out of the magazine before it can be captured by the extractor. Most auto pistol extractors are not designed to close over a chambered round. As an example, the practice of dropping a round into the chamber of a 1911, and dropping the slide overstresses the extractor, leading to eventual failure.

Since you've already tried a different magazine, try different ammo.

If this doesn't help, try a new extractor/extractor spring, or better still, send it to S&W for a sure fix.
 
Thanks so much for the replies.

You understand my issue 100% correctly.
The cartridge was not sliding *under* the extractor, but rather ended up on the outside of it, as it was ripped off the mag and into battery.

I recontoured the extractor (put more of an angle on it, while still leaving plenty of metal), and no issue with the past 200 rds. I hope it stays that way, if not, to S&W it goes !
 
Happens sometimes with Smith extractors.

Mass has to be removed from the inside of the extractor arm,which it sounds like you did.

On some,when the round feeds up,the extractor does not spring out of the way sufficiently enough to allow the case to feed under the hook. You corrected this by removin some of that mass. Now,make sure the angle on the hook is slightly positive,and you should be fine.

Good Luck!
 
Still need help, thanks.

eger precision:

Interesting you have seen this issue with the Smiths.

- would you recommend sending it in for a new extractor (I carry this firearm and it must function 100%)
- I actually removed some metal from the *outside* of the extractor.... and it helped. I did this before seeing the responses to my posting, and thought it would help the extractor snap over the casing. Now I find out it should slide under it..... is it possible that there was too much mass on the outside of the extractor hook and it was hitting that side of the extraction groove??
- How can I tell if the back of casing is *now* going under the extractor.... or is the extractor snaping over it when the breach closes? Again, not sure why what I did helped unless I just made it easier to snap over the casing??
- How much mass would you suggest removing from the inside of the extractor arm? (the part the fits into the cartridge extraction groove)
- and this is key: what do you mean by "make sure the angle on the hook is slightly positive"... I want to understand this fully.

Sorry for all the questions.
Thanks for your time. Greg
 
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