This happened in the town next to mine. Makes me wonder how one is expected to react when the door comes in and someone yells police
http://youtube.com/watch?v=qVhdK8nL9l0
http://youtube.com/watch?v=qVhdK8nL9l0
fake cop home invasion
- Thread starter garryc
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westphoenix
New member
This is the kind of thing that worries me about no knock entries.
I know I did nothing wrong, but maybe the police have the wrong house, or maybe its not the police after all.
I would hate to shoot a cop who entered my house by mistake, but I would hate it even more if a police impersonator shot myself or someone I love.
I hope I never have to deal with this, but if it does happen I guess you just go off your gut feeling.
I know I did nothing wrong, but maybe the police have the wrong house, or maybe its not the police after all.
I would hate to shoot a cop who entered my house by mistake, but I would hate it even more if a police impersonator shot myself or someone I love.
I hope I never have to deal with this, but if it does happen I guess you just go off your gut feeling.
"Standard" Home Security
I think that this is everyone's nightmare. From what I've seen, entry is usually via the front door of the residence, rarely through the back or sides.
What I've done to all the houses we've bought is replaced the front door with a steel entry door. During the installation, I build out the door jambs with additional two by fours to make the attachment for the hardware as solid as possible. On our current front door, it is solid 2x4 to the first studs on each side, a total of 7 2x4s!
When the door itself is as solid as possible, I add the "Door Club" to it. This product was invented by some guy here in my city (disclaimer: I have not, nor ever had, any connection to this company or product). It provides a solid steel, removable door stop that you put into a hole drilled into the floor. The package also comes with a reinforced striker plate and extra long screws for the hinges. When you do the totla install, your door becomes reinforced against forced entry on three of its four sides.
The sales literature claimed that it would take several tons of force to defeat the system. I saw a demonstration of the system at a home show, and a HUGE guy (dressed in football pads) hurled himself at the door and couldn't budge it. I seriously doubt that you could get through my front door unless you used some type of vehicle as a battering ram.
Anyway, these things are available on ebay (search for "door club") for about $10. They also are removable if you move or are in rental property (just plug the hole in the floor).
All the other work is much more expensive, of course; but the peace of mind is worth it to me. YMMV
My .02
JS
I think that this is everyone's nightmare. From what I've seen, entry is usually via the front door of the residence, rarely through the back or sides.
What I've done to all the houses we've bought is replaced the front door with a steel entry door. During the installation, I build out the door jambs with additional two by fours to make the attachment for the hardware as solid as possible. On our current front door, it is solid 2x4 to the first studs on each side, a total of 7 2x4s!
When the door itself is as solid as possible, I add the "Door Club" to it. This product was invented by some guy here in my city (disclaimer: I have not, nor ever had, any connection to this company or product). It provides a solid steel, removable door stop that you put into a hole drilled into the floor. The package also comes with a reinforced striker plate and extra long screws for the hinges. When you do the totla install, your door becomes reinforced against forced entry on three of its four sides.
The sales literature claimed that it would take several tons of force to defeat the system. I saw a demonstration of the system at a home show, and a HUGE guy (dressed in football pads) hurled himself at the door and couldn't budge it. I seriously doubt that you could get through my front door unless you used some type of vehicle as a battering ram.
Anyway, these things are available on ebay (search for "door club") for about $10. They also are removable if you move or are in rental property (just plug the hole in the floor).
All the other work is much more expensive, of course; but the peace of mind is worth it to me. YMMV
My .02
JS
If intruders (badge or not) enter my home unannounced, I am defending myself. If I have to go to court (which I will) and they are indeed police (and they have the wrong house), if we have a dead cop on our hands my attorney will be presenting the case to the jury that it was the DA and/or police supervisor's fault. I may very well be dead, but I am not risking being killed by intruders because the intruders MIGHT be policeman who MIGHT be serving a correct warrant against me.
Many states consider it illegal for people to defend themselves against no knock police intruders even if they have the wrong house. Which is absurd because you can't expect people to not defend themselves when their door is kicked in with guns being waved around.
If states would adjust their laws accordingly making it the police's fault if an officer winds up dead, police supervisors and DAs would think twice and be DANG sure they have the right house and a DANG good reason for risking officers lives when they do no knock entries (like if they know these are perpatrators that are armed and considered dangerous).
Many states consider it illegal for people to defend themselves against no knock police intruders even if they have the wrong house. Which is absurd because you can't expect people to not defend themselves when their door is kicked in with guns being waved around.
If states would adjust their laws accordingly making it the police's fault if an officer winds up dead, police supervisors and DAs would think twice and be DANG sure they have the right house and a DANG good reason for risking officers lives when they do no knock entries (like if they know these are perpatrators that are armed and considered dangerous).
OneBagNomad
Inactive
My simple solution to this was to secure the door to my bedroom (which has a window facing the street). I lock the door when I head to bed. Hopefully, this buys me enough time to wake up from the noise of the main entry, and to look out the window when I hear them yelling "police". If I don't see any patrol cars, I'm shooting if they push me to it. I wonder though, what kind of breaching tools does the general public have access to? Is it reasonable to think that these sorts of people might be well equipped to quickly force their way through a door? I'm talking about the type of equipment SWAT teams have, not crowbars and the like.
Took me about 2 seconds to come up with this.
T Post Pounder
Actually took me about 2 minutes to find a pic on the net though
Fill with concrete and you are good to go, one battering ram.
tony pasley
New member
Tools available to public www.Galls.com this is just 1 site too many more out there to list.
WeedWacker
New member
I think it would be pretty obvious if it were police breaking down the door if you opened fire. You'd probably be dead in 5 seconds.
westphoenix
New member
markj said:
No
Regardless of who breaks down the doors (cops or fake cops) - if they have you dead to rights in your living room eating dinner, the only thing you can do is give up (unless you want to get shot.)
Now if you were in another area from where the initial entry is made, perhaps you have a chance to negotiate - telling them you are an armed homeowner, would like to cooperate but would like to verify their identity by calling 911 or the local police.
A firefight in your own home with multiple gunmen is not a recipe for survival.
Now if you were in another area from where the initial entry is made, perhaps you have a chance to negotiate - telling them you are an armed homeowner, would like to cooperate but would like to verify their identity by calling 911 or the local police.
A firefight in your own home with multiple gunmen is not a recipe for survival.
HardcoreHehaw
New member
I just got out of fire school and they have some neat tools but the most common are the axe and halligan, using these two tools you could force someones front door in seconds.
Heres a Halligan.
Heres a Halligan.
BreacherUp!
New member
No Knocks
This still comes up and it shows there is still a bit of misunderstanding with regards to no-knock warrants.
1st: A No-knock warrant must be requested and approved by a judge, showing PC as to the need for this type of service;
2nd: A No-knock does not equate to some stealth dynamic entry. "Police!', or whatever the acronym, must still be announced upon, or better, just prior to the entry. The no-knock warrant permits the serving agency to begin breaching without the normal, knock-announce, wait reasonable time (could be 15 secs or more). However, again, it does NOT remove the necessity to announce the purpose and authority (i.e. "Police!, warrant...") upon entry.
3rd: Typically, investigators do not attempt to gain no-knock warrants because of their inherent risk to the entry team and to the occupants. There is not a person on an entry team that does not think of the elevated level of danger with breaching a door before the typical knock-and-announce and being misidentified as an intruder. That is why the investigator must convince the judge that the no-knock is necessary AND prudent.
This still comes up and it shows there is still a bit of misunderstanding with regards to no-knock warrants.
1st: A No-knock warrant must be requested and approved by a judge, showing PC as to the need for this type of service;
2nd: A No-knock does not equate to some stealth dynamic entry. "Police!', or whatever the acronym, must still be announced upon, or better, just prior to the entry. The no-knock warrant permits the serving agency to begin breaching without the normal, knock-announce, wait reasonable time (could be 15 secs or more). However, again, it does NOT remove the necessity to announce the purpose and authority (i.e. "Police!, warrant...") upon entry.
3rd: Typically, investigators do not attempt to gain no-knock warrants because of their inherent risk to the entry team and to the occupants. There is not a person on an entry team that does not think of the elevated level of danger with breaching a door before the typical knock-and-announce and being misidentified as an intruder. That is why the investigator must convince the judge that the no-knock is necessary AND prudent.
Any booby trap that has the potential to do serious injury is almost certainly illegal. Definitely in TX anyway.
No, but it may make enough noise to alert the neighbors (which might cause the intruders to flee) and it might allow others in the house to get to safety. Getting taken prisoner in your own house has got to be at the bottom of the list for positive outcomes. (In case it's not apparent, I'm responding in light of the title which is "FAKE cop...")
azsixshooter
New member
I wonder what potential flashbangs have in a "booby-trap" capacity? Maybe something you'd arm only when you go to sleep in the back bedroom. Keep in mind, I am single and have no children so nobody will be entering my domicile unexpectedly at any time.
A flashbang rigged to pop when a door was forced would stun the intruders and surely wake the deepest sleepers up in a back room. I'm sure police wouldn't appreciate that, but it might buy enough time to communicate or something, at least make them back out and rethink their entry and maybe give a little break in the chaos just long enough to figure out what's going on.
A flashbang rigged to pop when a door was forced would stun the intruders and surely wake the deepest sleepers up in a back room. I'm sure police wouldn't appreciate that, but it might buy enough time to communicate or something, at least make them back out and rethink their entry and maybe give a little break in the chaos just long enough to figure out what's going on.
Edward429451
Moderator
A while back, we had a short string (3 or 4) of home invasions here in C. Springs where they were dressed up as city workers. Uniforms, ID, radios, everything. The suggested procedure for homeowners is to call in to the city and ask for name, description, etc of said city worker who wants to enter your home.
This has nothing to do with fake cop invasions but is another angle the criminals are using so I thought I'd toss this in also for peoples edification.
This has nothing to do with fake cop invasions but is another angle the criminals are using so I thought I'd toss this in also for peoples edification.
John,
I respectfully disagree. If the choice is to shoot it out with 2 or more guys fake cops or not in my home when they have guns pointed at me, and I have to draw and shoot - Especially if I am not sure whether they are cops or not - I think prisoner or DOA, I prefer prisoner. At least there is a chance to live.
Now if they broke in, and I am in another room and have the chance to arm up, before confronting the "fake" cops and I am more than reasonably sure they are not real cops. I might defend myself fully.
But certainly not at the dinner table - dead to rights.
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