Fair and balanced in the SF Chronicle...

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Guy B. Meredith

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The personal argument
- Debra J. Saunders
Sunday, August 21, 2005

VACAVILLE'S Cindy Sheehan, the mother of Casey Sheehan who died in combat in Iraq, became a public figure when she demanded a second visit with President Bush so he could answer her questions: "Why did you kill my son? What did my son die for?" She had set up camp near the president's home, until a second tragedy -- her mother's stroke -- caused her to leave Thursday.

By the time that happened, Sheehan, who has made her personal situation the issue and has hurled so many personal insults at others, was complaining that the protests are "not about me," they're about the war.

Not true. Cindy Sheehan never asked Bush to meet with other mothers of those who have died in Iraq. She has never tried to represent those mothers of slain soldiers who support the war. What's more, while many thoughtful critics of the war exist, Sheehan personifies the me-me-me focus of the anti-war movement. And that corner doesn't think.

Note how Sheehan refuses to look at the war as anything but the spawn of President Bush. She won't acknowledge that the newly elected Iraqi government doesn't want U.S. troops to leave yet. She simply repeats the same old anti- war movement slogans: Bush lied. Bush killed her son. Last week, CNN's Anderson Cooper asked Sheehan how she reacted to an Internet plea by two Iraqi dentists to stop calling for immediate withdrawal of U.S. troops from Iraq. Cooper read the words: "You are free to go and leave us alone but what am I going to tell your million sisters in Iraq? Should I ask them to leave Iraq, too? Should I leave, too? And what about the 8 million who walked through bombs to practice their freedom and vote? Should they leave this land, too? Your son sacrificed his life for a very noble cause? No, he sacrificed himself for the most precious value in this existence; that is freedom," they wrote.

Asked for her thoughts, Sheehan could only protest that she wasn't programmed to answer that question: "Well, Anderson, we're still -- we're getting away from what, what the president said when he went to Congress and asked for the authority to invade Iraq. He said (the U.S. needs to invade) because they had weapons of mass destruction, and he said because there was a link between Saddam (Hussein) and al Qaeda, and those have been proven to be wrong." In short: Bush lied, and that's the reason America and its many allies went to war. She also opposes U.S. troops in Afghanistan, and told MSNBC's Chris Matthews, Afghanistan "is almost the same thing." Sure, except that al Qaeda was linked to the Taliban and Osama bin Laden, who was hiding behind the Taliban in Afghanistan after Sept. 11, 2001. It's not even remotely the same thing.

It feels as if the far left has come down with a case of mass amnesia. To believe this, one would have to forget that, other than Howard Dean, every major Democratic candidates running for president in 2004 -- Dennis Kucinich doesn't count as major -- voted for the resolution authorizing force in Iraq. Sen. John Kerry, who began his career denouncing politicians who vote for a mistake of a war, also voted for the war resolution. Like other senators who had served on the Senate Intelligence Committee he had access to reams of information. His running mate, John Edwards, also on the Intelligence Committee, voted for the resolution.

What is more, potential future Democratic presidential candidate Sen. Hillary Clinton, D-N.Y., voted for the resolution. And if she believed that Saddam Hussein had weapons of mass destruction, it wasn't because "Bush lied." Her own husband, when he was president, explained that he was bombing Iraq because in 1998, "Saddam Hussein must not be allowed to threaten his neighbors or the world with nuclear arms, poison gas or biological weapons." Bush didn't just utter the word "yellowcake" and magically the Senate was in a trance that made John Kerry and Hillary Clinton dutifully vote yes.

They looked at the evidence, and they endured years of watching Hussein in action. They knew that he had advanced his nuclear program beyond intelligence estimates before the Persian Gulf War. They then voted for a resolution that said, in part, "in 1998 Congress concluded that Iraq's continuing weapons of mass destruction programs threatened vital United States interests and international peace and security, declared Iraq to be in 'material and unacceptable breach of its international obligations' and urged the president 'to take appropriate action, in accordance with the Constitution and relevant laws of the United States, to bring Iraq into compliance with its international obligations'." That context is missing in action at Camp Casey.

E-mail: dsaunders@sfchronicle.com.

Page B - 5
URL: http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2005/08/21/EDGB6E9N981.DTL
 
I am really really tired of the fact that one someone disagrees with Bush and the "War" the first thing that comes out is the name calling and character assasination.

This is the by God United States of America where you have your right to state your opinion and protest. I may not agree with you but I will damn well defend your right to do so.

I dont know of any of the talking heads who were up in the hospital when she gave birth to her son. Were there when he was sick or needed some love from his mom to help him through the bad times. Where were these talking heads when she changed his diapers.

WE do not know if her son would have approved nor dissaproved. I even remember one poster here saying that her son should spit in her face. I dont know where most folks were raised or if its a generational thing. But I would never spit in my mothers face for something like that. In fact my mother and I do not see eye to eye when it comes to this war. Yet we still love and respect each other.

For all the folks saying what her son would do or should do please PM me I have some realtives who passed on I need to ask some questions. Since you have pshycic abilities and can talk with the dead I need the help!

I am sad to see that we have reached such a sorry state in this nation as to where character assasination and talking heads have so much sway over folks.

I have pretty much run the gamut listening to these talking heads on radio and tv and opinion writers. I know which cheek I am going to turn to all of them when I do an about face and drop my trousers, includes those on the left and right.

nuff said.
 
Talking heads are a dime a dozen and usually either journalists or book authors. In fact the entire talking head genre seems like a book club to me.

However, the talking heads aren't relevent here. The fact that a very left newpaper in a very left city runs so many of these conservative or factual editorials is interesting to me.
 
Their circulation has been plummetting and they're probably just trying to win back at least some of the California conservatives that they've spent decades alienating, having finally realized that conservative money is also green. Check out http://www.chronwatch.com/ for details.
 
Eghad:

Her adult son voluntarily enlisted - obviously, against her wishes. He then voluntarily re-enlisted after his hitch was up, knowing that he would be sent back to Iraq.

Even though he was in a non-combat role, as a truck mechanic, he volunteered for a combat mission during which he earned his Bronze Star. The mission on which he lost his life was also one on which he was not required to go - he volunteered for that one as well.

So as a courageous and proud soldier of the United States Army and a bona-fide, government-certified hero, it is certainly reasonable to guess that he would probably not appreciate his mother using his flag-draped coffin as a soap box.

And it sounds like none of Casey's other relatives appreciate it either, as they've disclosed in the divorce papers and the open letter to the media.
 
So as a courageous and proud soldier of the United States Army and a bona-fide, government-certified hero, it is certainly reasonable to guess that he would probably not appreciate his mother using his flag-draped coffin as a soap box.
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Let me understand this. You, mvpel, are saying that you know what her son would say if he had the chance to speak now?

I am guessing that you never met him, or any of his family. That you have absolutely no personal knowledge of him at all. True? Based on the thinnest amount of information gleaned from his service record, you can put the words in his mouth that he would speak now if he could?

You act as though he was a one dimensional cardboard cut out, not
the complex person that he most surely was, as we all are. Based on what little you know, which is too little to waste an adjective on, you can state that he would not appreciate his own mother's actions?

I think you presume too much.
 
Let me understand this. You, mvpel, are saying that you know what her son would say if he had the chance to speak now?
Click to expand...
If you had actually read what I wrote, you wouldn't be asking this stupid question.


Guy Meredith - here's the letter with the link to the Drudge Report on the subject, one of the first, if not the first, place where it was diseminated.

http://www.drudgereport.com/flashcs.htm
Our family has been so distressed by the recent activities of Cindy we are breaking our silence and we have collectively written a statement for release. Feel free to distribute it as you wish.

Thanks, Cherie

In response to questions regarding the Cindy Sheehan/Crawford Texas issue: Sheehan Family Statement:

The Sheehan Family lost our beloved Casey in the Iraq War and we have been silently, respectfully grieving. We do not agree with the political motivations and publicity tactics of Cindy Sheehan. She now appears to be promoting her own personal agenda and notoriety at the the expense of her son's good name and reputation. The rest of the Sheehan Family supports the troops, our country, and our President, silently, with prayer and respect.

Sincerely,

Casey Sheehan's grandparents, aunts, uncles and numerous cousins.
Click to expand...
 
So as a courageous and proud soldier of the United States Army and a bona-fide, government-certified hero, it is certainly reasonable to guess that he would probably not appreciate his mother using his flag-draped coffin as a soap box.

And it sounds like none of Casey's other relatives appreciate it either, as they've disclosed in the divorce papers and the open letter to the media.
Click to expand...

most relatives suck....

Too bad about the divorce.

you said the magic word guess..........

Like I said me and my mom dont see eye to eye on this war..... However she diapered my ass and took care of me when I was sick and as a divorced Mom kept my feet on the straight and narrow and I turned out to be a decent human being. If my Mom was out toting a sign, even if I disagreed with her...
shes my Mom...and if some guy who I agreed with on the war got in her face and started demeaning her character because he disagreed with her.. we are going to have a situation.

If I had a relative who was out protesting for or against the war, I wouldnt be making statements for my 5 mins of fame on TV or in the print. I would kindly show them the door and suggest they go ask my relative.

but I guess the realtives just could resist..........

As for her and her husband...thats thier biz.


FYI as far as I know there are no FEBAs in Iraq...... so no matter what your MOS is your six is always in danger. Guys have been killed eating in the chow hall or going to the PX.
 
"Actually I read it, and quoted it, what did I miss? Please enlighten me."

What you missed, evidently, is that mvpel said that it is "reasonable to guess" these things. You know, just like you said:

"I am guessing that you never met him, or any of his family. That you have absolutely no personal knowledge of him at all."

Guesswork makes for interesting, if pointless, argument.

Tim
 
Well, guesses are all we have on this point, since we can't ask Casey - he willingly risked his life so that Iraqi mothers would no longer have to lose their sons to the meat-grinder of Saddam Hussein's brutal regime and discover their dessicated corpses stacked in a mass grave...

56.jpg


Like Maureen Dowd said, "the moral authority of a grieving mother is absolute." Apparently, unless that mother is Iraqi.
 
I dont begrudge the Iraqi mothers thier right to grieve.

there is irony in life

Saddam was killing the sons of Iraqi mothers when Donald Rumsfeld was pressing the flesh with him in a meeting in 1983 in Baghdad..but it was ok then *wink**wink**nod**nod* was in charge of this while Iraq actually used WMD against folks

Isnt it ironic that 20 years later this is the same guy running the war against Iraq to liberate it and protects those sons and to find and destroy the WMD?

However I find myself confused once again by this :confused:

I thought we invaded Iraq because of WMD :confused:

but wait Iran and N Korea are developing nuclear weapons and we didnt find any in Iraq :confused:

maybe its this confusion that drives folks like Mrs. Sheehan to protest when thier sons die?

Maybe the talking heads and opinon writers should write and talk about this?
 
Mvpel:

The point that you are missing is that your are projecting your beliefes onto a blank screen, but calling that screen by another name to lend it validity. You don't know what his thoughts would be, and your assumption that you can make a reasonable guess is completely invalid. You do not have sufficient information to make a reasonable guess.

Your acerbic responses are failing to cover your lack of reasonableness or logic. Oldest story in the book, if you get called out into the open, try to create a distraction. Vituperative comments are your attempt at distraction, older than dirt, but ineffective.
 
Back to the topic...

The liberal/left are basically cutting and running from Sheehan, the cynical attempt to use a mother's grief as a propaganda tool has backfired. Fact is, she had already met with Bush and said complimentary things about him, and her subsequent rediculous anti-semitic comments, makes her seem both a hypocrite and a racist moonbat.

Now that a counter-protest has formed and the MSM has to be "fair" and show both sides, this story will drop out of sight. Only the liberal/left blogs and forums will maintain this farce, places that even pretend to be a news organization like the SF Chronicle will distance or even diss her.
 
Rebar you better do a press check there...pardner

Seems like more demonstrations are scheduled

Sheehan's group is also airing television ads in Salt Lake City accusing Bush of having lied about Iraq. One station, an ABC affiliate, is refusing to air the ads.

At a park near the VFW venue, Celeste Zappala, 58, the Philadelphia mother of a National Guardsman killed in Iraq, plans to lead a protest. Her son Sherwood Baker was killed in Iraq last year and she is part of anti-war mother Cindy Sheehan's group, Gold Star Families for Peace.

Baker was killed while assigned to the Iraq Survey Group, which was on the hunt for stockpiles of illicit weapons but concluded they were never there.

"We all know that noble cause for war that Bush talks about has changed several times," Zappala said.

dont see much cutting and running going on........

seems like Bro Bush needs to grow some hair on the cajones and communicate with the American People honestly.

not only is discontent growing amongst the antiwar folks but among other Americans also

from Zogby:

President Bush’s televised address to the nation produced no noticeable bounce in his approval numbers, with his job approval rating slipping a point from a week ago, to 43%, in the latest Zogby International poll.

In a more significant sign of the weakness of the President’s numbers, more “Red State” voters—that is, voters living in the states that cast their ballots for the Bush-Cheney ticket in 2004—now rate his job performance unfavorably, with 50% holding a negative impression of the President’s handling of his duties, and 48% holding a favorable view. The President also gets negative marks from one-in-four (25%) Republicans—as well as 86% of Democrats and 58% of independents. (Bush nets favorable marks from 75% of Republicans, 13% of Democrats and 40% of independents.)

Its time for Mr. Bush to step up to the plate..........and stop giving the canned speeches.

Islamic Fundamentalists using Uncle Ho's playbook.....1
Bush and Co.......................................................0
 
Sure, the left wingers are frothing at the mouth thinking they finally have an issue to bash Bush with, that resonates with the "average" American.

But like so all of these issues, it's already fizzled. She is plain just not credible, and the only people who are still on her bandwagon, are the true believers who hated Bush to begin with. You'll see the MSM back away, as the loony left wing propaganda organs take over, which will further delegitimize her in the eyes of normal people.

In a month, the only people who'll remember Cindy Sheehan are the DU/Moveon/DNC moonbats.
 
you mean the fuze is fizzling.........for the big bang.

Bush is letting the rope get longer to hang himself with.......

the longer this war goes on without any definite progress against the terrorists is another shovel deeper.

couple that with the price of gas hitting people in the pocketbooks and at the stores...it aint looking good.
 
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