Experience with Bar Sto customer service?
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ladywarrior
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I've used their services many times. I've always gotten excellent service.
It has been two days since my last communication with Irv at Bar Sto, so I'm confident they are not going to reply. So I'll post my situation with them.
Here is my email to them: Dear Bar Sto Customer Service --
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> On 6/19 I ordered a Semi-drop in barrel for my Browning hi Power through your web site. On 7/10 I received it. It didn't drop in at all. So I gladly sent your company a money order for 15 dollars to cover the cost of fitting the barrel to my slide. Yesterday (7/24), I received the barrel fitted to my slide. However, now the slide won't go in the frame. It seems that the barrel's feed ramp is hanging up on the frame. So, instead of paying even more money to ship my entire gun, I am requesting a full refund, including all shipping costs. The original invoice was for 185 plus 10 for shipping. Sending the barrel back for fitting cost another 15 plus 7.85 for priority shipping and insurance. Plus whatever it will cost to ship the barrel back to you. So we're looking at a refund for roughly $220. I expect the charges to my credit card to be taken off and I want a check for the remainder. I expect a prompt reply in this matter. Thank you.
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> A very unsatisfied customer
And here was Bar Sto's response:
I am sorry that your barrel doesn't fit your firearm. We do not make the gun so we cannot control the quality or tolerance of the gun. The barrel & slide fit our 3 frames that we have here at the shop. I will not refund you in full. I will refund the price of the barrel less the 5% credit card fee after I receive the barrel back. If I do not receive the barrel back then I cannot give you a refund.
Irving O. Stone III
The same day I emailed this reply: Dear Barsto:
I understand that there are manufacturing differences among pistols. And I am sorry your barrel doesn't fit my gun. Your company has a reputation for producing the very best. When the barrel and slide was tried on the 3 frames in your shop, did they slide on easily? Did it take some force? If it took some force, please let me know. I didn't try to force the slide into position. I can't even see where you fitted the barrel. All I can see is a copper-colored line on the face of the barrel hood. What's the line for anyway?
Also, I can't believe you're only going to refund me for the price of the barrel less 5%? That is outrageous. So I'm out 9.75 because I used my Visa? Plus, I have to spend an additional 5-6 bucks to ship the barrel back to you. This barrel, which doesn't even fit, is costing me in the neighborhood of 240 bucks after you include shipping and penalties. For that price, I'm better off having a local gunsmith finish the work.
Let's work this out. You can email me or feel free to call me at... I believe I'm an hour ahead of you.
That was two days ago. And I haven't heard a thing from Bar Sto. (Guys, I know my math is a bit off, I was a little angry when I wrote that email.) I'm not upset that barrel didn't fit. You can't expect everything to be drop-in fit. But after I sent the barrel back for fitting and it still doesn't fit. Admittedly, I didn't check the barrel and slide fit on the frame when I first received the barrel prior to sending it back for fitting. But why should I have? It didn't fit the slide perfectly. So why should it have fir the frame? What really makes me mad is that they are charging me a fee for using a credit card. Bar Sto may make great barrels, but their customer service blows. So today, I'm sending back the barrel to Bar Sto and I'll take the loss. Guess, I'm taking my business to another barrel maker who appreciates their customers. Bar Sto sure doesn't.
Here is my email to them: Dear Bar Sto Customer Service --
>
> On 6/19 I ordered a Semi-drop in barrel for my Browning hi Power through your web site. On 7/10 I received it. It didn't drop in at all. So I gladly sent your company a money order for 15 dollars to cover the cost of fitting the barrel to my slide. Yesterday (7/24), I received the barrel fitted to my slide. However, now the slide won't go in the frame. It seems that the barrel's feed ramp is hanging up on the frame. So, instead of paying even more money to ship my entire gun, I am requesting a full refund, including all shipping costs. The original invoice was for 185 plus 10 for shipping. Sending the barrel back for fitting cost another 15 plus 7.85 for priority shipping and insurance. Plus whatever it will cost to ship the barrel back to you. So we're looking at a refund for roughly $220. I expect the charges to my credit card to be taken off and I want a check for the remainder. I expect a prompt reply in this matter. Thank you.
>
>
> A very unsatisfied customer
And here was Bar Sto's response:
I am sorry that your barrel doesn't fit your firearm. We do not make the gun so we cannot control the quality or tolerance of the gun. The barrel & slide fit our 3 frames that we have here at the shop. I will not refund you in full. I will refund the price of the barrel less the 5% credit card fee after I receive the barrel back. If I do not receive the barrel back then I cannot give you a refund.
Irving O. Stone III
The same day I emailed this reply: Dear Barsto:
I understand that there are manufacturing differences among pistols. And I am sorry your barrel doesn't fit my gun. Your company has a reputation for producing the very best. When the barrel and slide was tried on the 3 frames in your shop, did they slide on easily? Did it take some force? If it took some force, please let me know. I didn't try to force the slide into position. I can't even see where you fitted the barrel. All I can see is a copper-colored line on the face of the barrel hood. What's the line for anyway?
Also, I can't believe you're only going to refund me for the price of the barrel less 5%? That is outrageous. So I'm out 9.75 because I used my Visa? Plus, I have to spend an additional 5-6 bucks to ship the barrel back to you. This barrel, which doesn't even fit, is costing me in the neighborhood of 240 bucks after you include shipping and penalties. For that price, I'm better off having a local gunsmith finish the work.
Let's work this out. You can email me or feel free to call me at... I believe I'm an hour ahead of you.
That was two days ago. And I haven't heard a thing from Bar Sto. (Guys, I know my math is a bit off, I was a little angry when I wrote that email.) I'm not upset that barrel didn't fit. You can't expect everything to be drop-in fit. But after I sent the barrel back for fitting and it still doesn't fit. Admittedly, I didn't check the barrel and slide fit on the frame when I first received the barrel prior to sending it back for fitting. But why should I have? It didn't fit the slide perfectly. So why should it have fir the frame? What really makes me mad is that they are charging me a fee for using a credit card. Bar Sto may make great barrels, but their customer service blows. So today, I'm sending back the barrel to Bar Sto and I'll take the loss. Guess, I'm taking my business to another barrel maker who appreciates their customers. Bar Sto sure doesn't.
Icopy:
Both sides are in a bad position. Looks like everyone will lose a little. Maybe a local smith can be of use without spending a lot of money. It isn't worth the frustration. Take the 5%, or go to a smith. Whenever I use the mail I'm aware that things may go wrong. I just went through three scanners. I had to return two and was out the shipping costs both ways for two scanners. I ended up purchasing locally. It wasn't the vendors fault. As it turned out, I had something defective with my software driving my USB port. Something like your situation. They didn't charge me the 5%. Talk to a smith and see what your options might be.
Both sides are in a bad position. Looks like everyone will lose a little. Maybe a local smith can be of use without spending a lot of money. It isn't worth the frustration. Take the 5%, or go to a smith. Whenever I use the mail I'm aware that things may go wrong. I just went through three scanners. I had to return two and was out the shipping costs both ways for two scanners. I ended up purchasing locally. It wasn't the vendors fault. As it turned out, I had something defective with my software driving my USB port. Something like your situation. They didn't charge me the 5%. Talk to a smith and see what your options might be.
I talked to a very well-respected and local Smith about fitting the barrel. It could be done for a minimal cost. However, when you add in all the cost so far and the cost of the additional fitting, it would have been the more than the cost of having the "gunsmith fit" barrel fitted by the gunsmith from the start. Live and learn. Bar Sto isn't out a thing. They will probally polish that barrel and sent it to the next guy. On the bright side, I can use the money to have my gun refinised and still have cash left over for ammo.
VictorLouis
New member
I am quite surprised that BS would even ACCEPT a barrel for fitting with the slide alone. I've always been taught that you must have the frame to fit a barrel properly to a 1911. Since they are so close in design, it seems as though that should be a given with the BHP also.
As to the credit card fee, I agree with the merchants on principle. The card company charges the merchant for every purchase using their card. The merchant "loses" profit on such sales, OR has to raise prices to absorb them. This, in effect, penalizes the cash/check paying customers. Plus, there is added paperwork and mail costs with the card companies. OTOH, how many impulse purchases would be lost every month were it not for the readily available plastic?
Now, IIRC, Visa/MC/Discover SHOULD be at, or near the 3% range, NOT 5%. AmEx is at 5-7.5%, which is why many merchants can't even afford to accept their cards. Now, if a purchase made on their card is REFUNDED to the customer, WHY would the fee not also be refunded to the merchant? Perhaps a business owner here may be able to explain?
As to S&H, that is indeed a risk that you take when mail ordering. If it were me, I would eat the barrel entirely, and your second set of S&H charges, but not the inital one to ship it to you in the first place. Afterall, this WWW can burn you quickly.
A motorcyclist ordered a custom part for his YR2000 model bike. He was told that the 99 model fit w/o hassle. Wrong. After several trips back and forth to the supplier, he tried to quash the whole deal, and asked for all $ back less the initial S&H. After the dealer refused to accomadate him AT ALL, the cyclist posted about it on one of the motorcycle forums. AFTER the dealer lost two day's worth of business due to his fax machine being bombarded, he relented with the customer-in full. Anyone have the number to BS?
As to the credit card fee, I agree with the merchants on principle. The card company charges the merchant for every purchase using their card. The merchant "loses" profit on such sales, OR has to raise prices to absorb them. This, in effect, penalizes the cash/check paying customers. Plus, there is added paperwork and mail costs with the card companies. OTOH, how many impulse purchases would be lost every month were it not for the readily available plastic?
Now, IIRC, Visa/MC/Discover SHOULD be at, or near the 3% range, NOT 5%. AmEx is at 5-7.5%, which is why many merchants can't even afford to accept their cards. Now, if a purchase made on their card is REFUNDED to the customer, WHY would the fee not also be refunded to the merchant? Perhaps a business owner here may be able to explain?
As to S&H, that is indeed a risk that you take when mail ordering. If it were me, I would eat the barrel entirely, and your second set of S&H charges, but not the inital one to ship it to you in the first place. Afterall, this WWW can burn you quickly.
A motorcyclist ordered a custom part for his YR2000 model bike. He was told that the 99 model fit w/o hassle. Wrong. After several trips back and forth to the supplier, he tried to quash the whole deal, and asked for all $ back less the initial S&H. After the dealer refused to accomadate him AT ALL, the cyclist posted about it on one of the motorcycle forums. AFTER the dealer lost two day's worth of business due to his fax machine being bombarded, he relented with the customer-in full. Anyone have the number to BS?
VictorLouis -
Nice reply. You brought up some very interesting views. Let me clarify one thing. On the bar Sto web site, all they require for final fitting to their drop-in barrels is the slide. You can send them entire gun, if you want. Maybe I should have from the start, but that would add $40 to the price of the barrel. When you think about it, that's pretty close to the wasted money I have into this barrel. $9.25 return penalty, initial $10 shipping charge, $6 to ship the barrel and slide for fitting, $15 return shipping charge and $4 to ship the barrel back to them. Guys, I'm out 44 bucks. For a product that they're probally going to resell!
Nice reply. You brought up some very interesting views. Let me clarify one thing. On the bar Sto web site, all they require for final fitting to their drop-in barrels is the slide. You can send them entire gun, if you want. Maybe I should have from the start, but that would add $40 to the price of the barrel. When you think about it, that's pretty close to the wasted money I have into this barrel. $9.25 return penalty, initial $10 shipping charge, $6 to ship the barrel and slide for fitting, $15 return shipping charge and $4 to ship the barrel back to them. Guys, I'm out 44 bucks. For a product that they're probally going to resell!
Icopy:
I bet you know what you are going to do.
I loaned a friend ten thousand dollars and never saw him again. I've been in so many deals where, with hindsight, I would have acted differently. You can't always come out on top. Use your time to make the extra money to get things right and enjoy your gun. I hope that we can all keep our guns as the anti's ramp up their campaign. In life's experience, this is an easy goof. It can be rectified with little time, or money.
I bet you know what you are going to do.
I loaned a friend ten thousand dollars and never saw him again. I've been in so many deals where, with hindsight, I would have acted differently. You can't always come out on top. Use your time to make the extra money to get things right and enjoy your gun. I hope that we can all keep our guns as the anti's ramp up their campaign. In life's experience, this is an easy goof. It can be rectified with little time, or money.
About a year ago, I purchased a Bar-Sto .40 S&W barrel for my Sig P226. The "drop in" didn't; however, they fitted the barrel to the semiautomatic in days. The quality of the barrel (manufacture and material) and the fit tolerances are excellent. I would definitely buy from Bar-Sto again.
I suggest sending in the entire gun, I didn't for my extended Glock 32C ported barrel. The barrel came, amazing quality- but it was too short and had a tight fit. I called and complained, they said to send the gun in with the barrel- got the gun back a week later with a perfectly fitting new barrel.
I have no issues with BS
I have no issues with BS
I ordered a semi-drop-in barrel for my Glock and it didn't quite drop in. If you'll notice, Bar-Sto calls them "semi drop-in", meaning there is a good chance that they won't fit with out some machining. I then called them to discuss it BEFORE returning it to them. After explaining to them exactly how the barrel didn't fit the slide, they told me it wouldn't be necessary to send in the entire gun, just the slide. Perhaps a phone call on your part before you returned it for fitting would have prevented the problem.
My barrel now fits perfectly. If I were you I would call them back and negotiate something else. Maybe they would be willing to refund the $15 you originally paid for fitting as well as give you free return shipping if you send in the whole gun. There is no way you are going to get back every penny you spent so I would just chalk it up as a lesson learned and get on with enjoying your gun.
Bill
My barrel now fits perfectly. If I were you I would call them back and negotiate something else. Maybe they would be willing to refund the $15 you originally paid for fitting as well as give you free return shipping if you send in the whole gun. There is no way you are going to get back every penny you spent so I would just chalk it up as a lesson learned and get on with enjoying your gun.
Bill
I'm in the same boat Icopy! A few months ago I had BarSto send me a 40Super bbl for my 1911, It didn't fit. So I send the whole gun in.
Irving couldn't get the gun to run with the 40Super barrel a gave up on the project.
So, let's see. As a customer looking for a barrel I choose BarSto as the manufacturer. They tell me I can have a 40Super barrel fit to my gun, Great! I say.
What is the outcome? Me paying the price shipping the barrel originally, paying the price for shipping the entire gun (including insurance) to them, & paying the price for them to ship the abortion back to me! What a deal!!
BarSto also tweaked my $30 Chip McKormick 10rd mag beyond working condition trying to get the gun to work. The mag wasn't shipped back with the gun, but a letter stating "replace at later date" was. That was 4 (four) months ago!! I called two weeks ago, she said he "just" ordered it and will ship it to me soon.
Talk about a lesson learned. NEVER again!
Irving couldn't get the gun to run with the 40Super barrel a gave up on the project.
So, let's see. As a customer looking for a barrel I choose BarSto as the manufacturer. They tell me I can have a 40Super barrel fit to my gun, Great! I say.
What is the outcome? Me paying the price shipping the barrel originally, paying the price for shipping the entire gun (including insurance) to them, & paying the price for them to ship the abortion back to me! What a deal!!
BarSto also tweaked my $30 Chip McKormick 10rd mag beyond working condition trying to get the gun to work. The mag wasn't shipped back with the gun, but a letter stating "replace at later date" was. That was 4 (four) months ago!! I called two weeks ago, she said he "just" ordered it and will ship it to me soon.
Talk about a lesson learned. NEVER again!
To MR. Dean,
If you would tell the whole story it might help. We talked and I told you that the Para firearm doesnt feed any bottle neck cases so you said i have a single stack conversion installed. I said well ok lets try I have had no problems with the single stacks feeding. I tried did not work I refunded everthing I think, and yes I forgot to order the mag but it is on the way.You talked to me and said that you understood. I also told you this was the first one, you know I really dislike half the story. I will answer the other to people soon so I hope that you tell the (REST OF THE STORY NEXT TIME YOU JUMP ON THE BAD WAGON)
Irv III
If you would tell the whole story it might help. We talked and I told you that the Para firearm doesnt feed any bottle neck cases so you said i have a single stack conversion installed. I said well ok lets try I have had no problems with the single stacks feeding. I tried did not work I refunded everthing I think, and yes I forgot to order the mag but it is on the way.You talked to me and said that you understood. I also told you this was the first one, you know I really dislike half the story. I will answer the other to people soon so I hope that you tell the (REST OF THE STORY NEXT TIME YOU JUMP ON THE BAD WAGON)
Irv III
TO ICOPY,
I really am sorry that your BHP is not even close on the specs. I have fit over 500 hundred of them and with that data we have about 85 % drop in rate with no problems. You ask about the 5% well the credit card company charged me 5.55 so that leaves me with 3.70 left over. Well I had to pay my guy to refit the brl to your slide that takes a minumum of 15 min. so lets be cheap and say 20.00. Now I make nothing on the shipping I lose money most of the time so you and I lose money. I cannot resell the barrel in your case because it was worked on for your firearm and is below our specs for a drop in. Now you blame me ?? I did not make the pistol how can this be my fault ? I lose money and have to deal with your attitude, how am I coming out on this ?? I am not a wal-mart or something like that. Me and 4 others work there making the barrels. I cannot afford to give you money I did not make or have. If you are complaining about the shipping I lose at least 10.00 per firearm normally. I do not know really what to do in general. I do not like semi drop in stuff it is not really worth the 1/10 of 1% THAT ARE A PROBLEM LIKE THIS BUT EVERYBODY WANTS A DROP IN AND ALSO UPS COST ARE OVER PRICED.My dad did not do drop in ever!!!! I did to help people with out a gunsmith close and also the do it your selfer. If you want a drop in that is sloppy and is just that a drop in then I may not be your choice. I am the choice if you want the most consitant and the most honest and accurate product. I also feel we are the best but I am a little Biased. I have been busy with personal matters the past few days but if you would like to call me I might work with you but I get from reading here that you are finished with us. Fine so be it but You should know I made no money and lost money because The firearm is not within our spec that we have used for over 8 years.I really do not like having to post this stuff but you really leave me no choice. No one wins in this and we both look like high school kids in stead of adults.
Irv III
I really am sorry that your BHP is not even close on the specs. I have fit over 500 hundred of them and with that data we have about 85 % drop in rate with no problems. You ask about the 5% well the credit card company charged me 5.55 so that leaves me with 3.70 left over. Well I had to pay my guy to refit the brl to your slide that takes a minumum of 15 min. so lets be cheap and say 20.00. Now I make nothing on the shipping I lose money most of the time so you and I lose money. I cannot resell the barrel in your case because it was worked on for your firearm and is below our specs for a drop in. Now you blame me ?? I did not make the pistol how can this be my fault ? I lose money and have to deal with your attitude, how am I coming out on this ?? I am not a wal-mart or something like that. Me and 4 others work there making the barrels. I cannot afford to give you money I did not make or have. If you are complaining about the shipping I lose at least 10.00 per firearm normally. I do not know really what to do in general. I do not like semi drop in stuff it is not really worth the 1/10 of 1% THAT ARE A PROBLEM LIKE THIS BUT EVERYBODY WANTS A DROP IN AND ALSO UPS COST ARE OVER PRICED.My dad did not do drop in ever!!!! I did to help people with out a gunsmith close and also the do it your selfer. If you want a drop in that is sloppy and is just that a drop in then I may not be your choice. I am the choice if you want the most consitant and the most honest and accurate product. I also feel we are the best but I am a little Biased. I have been busy with personal matters the past few days but if you would like to call me I might work with you but I get from reading here that you are finished with us. Fine so be it but You should know I made no money and lost money because The firearm is not within our spec that we have used for over 8 years.I really do not like having to post this stuff but you really leave me no choice. No one wins in this and we both look like high school kids in stead of adults.
Irv III
Irv, I know this was the first attempt at converting a Para to 40Super, so this was untested water. I appreciate your attempt.
What I didn't appreciate was the shipping costs I had to eat.
We both knew this was a test, if it worked, then I would be touting the accuracy and reliability of my Bar-Sto equipped P14-40Super, this would no doubt generate sales for you.
Unfortunately, it did not work. I guess what really chapped my hide was the fact that you guys used my $25 check I sent with the gun for "Gunsmith fitting" of the barrel, as a source for payment for shipping the barrel-less gun back to me.
I didn't tell the whole story you're right.
So here it is. I don't know if you personally look at every gun before it is sent back, but when I got my 1911 back it had filings of metal left over from trying to fit the barrel throughout the frame and slide. There were also 3-4 scuffs on the blued slide that were not there when it was sent in. This in addition to being out $75 in total for shipping costs for a barrel I don't own just rubbed me the wrong way.
I know from what 99% of your customers have said that you are the best barrel maker out there. I guess I'm that one percent?
Cointinued success to you.
What I didn't appreciate was the shipping costs I had to eat.
We both knew this was a test, if it worked, then I would be touting the accuracy and reliability of my Bar-Sto equipped P14-40Super, this would no doubt generate sales for you.
Unfortunately, it did not work. I guess what really chapped my hide was the fact that you guys used my $25 check I sent with the gun for "Gunsmith fitting" of the barrel, as a source for payment for shipping the barrel-less gun back to me.
I didn't tell the whole story you're right.
So here it is. I don't know if you personally look at every gun before it is sent back, but when I got my 1911 back it had filings of metal left over from trying to fit the barrel throughout the frame and slide. There were also 3-4 scuffs on the blued slide that were not there when it was sent in. This in addition to being out $75 in total for shipping costs for a barrel I don't own just rubbed me the wrong way.
I know from what 99% of your customers have said that you are the best barrel maker out there. I guess I'm that one percent?
Cointinued success to you.
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