Effects of .375H&H on deer

416Rigby

New member
I have just come back from 2 weeks of uninterrupted hunting (first in MT, then in AL), where I took several heads of deer (mulie and whitetail). The rifle I brought was a Sako 75 in .375 H&H and I was surprised to see what different effect this caliber had on deer depending on the bullet used and the conditions.

In the past, I have had pretty uniform results with this cartridge, but for some reason this time I had some very bizarre experiences.

On a MT mulie, a Nosler Partition that shattered the shoulder on a quartering shot (thus missing the lungs) gave me a long, testing, uphill follow-up chase where only a lucky running shot at the deer's hindquarters prevented the animal from escaping. He then spun around, facing me, sitting, and I had to give him another one behind the shoulder before he finally piled up.

On a MT whitetail, a behind-the-shoulder shot with a RN softpoint produced the effect of a wild run for the thick stuff, in the middle of which the deer just collapsed, as if suddenly recollecting the .375's ballistic charts!

On another animal, instead, a Winchester-Nosler Failsafe hollowpoint produced the most impressive kill I ever remember. At about 170 yards, the deer was strolling around a pasture when I decided to take it. As the scope came down from the recoil a split second after the shot, it refocused on a perfectly still, totally dead deer, where not even the slightest twitch betrayed any form of life.

It was virtually impossible to find an entry hole. The exit hole, about the size of a 25-cent coin, concealed effectively the real internal damage this bullet had made. The hydrostatic shock had destroyed the lungs, the heart and most of the meat inside the shoulders. Strangely enough, though, the amount of blood outside was practically nonexistant.

The lessons I derived from this experience:

1 - Shot placement is paramount. A bigger bullet is not any more forgiving than a small cartridge, if the vitals are missed even by a small amount.

2 - If I were strictly hunting for meat, the Nosler Partition is the bullet to use. Its controlled expansion translates itself into minimal meat damage and excellent penetration.

3 - In my future trophy hunts, where a lost animal is a double regret, I will definitely use that awesome (yet destructive!) Winchester-Nosler Supreme Failsafe. If the animal is taken fair and square, he won't get away!
 
ditto lesson 1

There is just no substitue for good shot placement. Almost any caliber will work if it hits in the right place.
 
Personally, I can't imagine using the .375H&H on game animals the size of deer! Almost all the deer I ever shot were taken with a 30-30 from about 40 to 125 yards, and I never chased any of them for more than about 100 yards or so. As you noted, you destroyed half the meat with one of the shots...
 
I have also taken several deer with the 375 HH Mag with sometimes bazare and unexpected results.I was using a 235 grain Speer at a little over 2900 feet per second. The first deer I shot was a running shot on the first morning I ever took it hunting.I made a bad shot. The deer was jumping a lot and I hit it in the lower guts almost missed it.Range about 100yds.MY first impression was that the 375 might be too much for deer because it was gutted like a fish.The deer only went about 30yds after the hit.The second deer, a large buck, again moving but not too fast,range about 200yds.I did not lead this animal enough again.The shot was hurried because he was almost into the timber when spotted.I hit the deer right in front of the hindquarters.It was a gut shot again.That big buck didn't take a single step.He was dead when reached.This was my second biggest buck ever taken. I also shot a doe with the 375.Perfect lung shot.The deer run off.It went about 100yds and ended up in the bottom of a revine.The bullet never expanded.Wound was typical of the action I have seen with the 270Win with 130grain bullets on ocasion.I have decided that the 235 grain Speer is eratic at best when it comes to deer.I have since worked up some very accurate loads with the 220 grain Horanady.But I have not taken any game yet with it.I think the 235grain Speer would make a great Elk load though.By the way I usually shoot straighter than noted here,but I was hunting that year where it seamed that running shots were the norm if you wanted to kill deer in that area.The standing shot seamed to be the exception that year.
 
What bullet weight were you using on whitetails?

235 grains is pretty darn heavy. I think that is what your problem may have been. I know that is probably one of the lighter bullets for a .375 H&H.

I think the problem with the "runners" is that your bullets are too heavy.

Here in PA I'd say a 150 grain bullet weight in .30 cal is about as heavy as you want to go. I use the Nosler 150 grain ballistic tips in my .30-06' the deer have never gone more than 10 yards. This year he just dropped dead in his tracks:)

Now I know the whitetails get bigger as you go up north but man.

A friend was using the Nosler 180 grain ballistic tip in a .300 Savage He hit one squarly in the front shoulder at about 25 yards, and he had to track the dang deer about 1/2 mile!!

SOunds like you had some great hunting though. I'm jealous.



He called nosler and they said lighten the bullet.
 
On a whitetail you can never tell what will happen. Some years ago I shot a small doe on opening day (yes it was a doe day :D)with my 25-06. I was using Winchester factory 120 grain "PowerPoint" loads. The noses of these bullets in the .25 look like a .22 "ratshot". Like a folded up hollow point. Well the first shot was at about 20 feet, yes that close. All I could see in the scope was brown so I shot. The deer cut a complete flip and ran about 75 feet away stopped and looked at me, kinda of quartering away. I fired this time and she ran off with her tail up and "flagged" down into the creek bottom and around a curve. I stood there with my mouth open not believing that I could have missed. I walked to where she stood and behind where she was standing the entire ground, trees, and vines were covered with blood, meat, hair etc. The blood trail looked like an interstate highway. She had made about 30 feet behind the curve in the creek and was piled up there. The bullet entered on the left side the 3rd rib from the back, and exited the right front shoulder, or rather where the right front shoulder used to be. The only thingleft there was the big bone! Seriously all the meat was gone. The chest cavity was nothing but jelly. The heart, lungs, etc. were all jelly, yet this small deer (80 pounds or so) gave NO INDICATION of being hit, and covered about 75 yards, with half of the deer blown away. Go figure.
 
It's the bullet type more than the caliber

I have come to the conclusion that a few thousandths of an inch diameter do not really make the difference in killing power, but it is the combination between bullet weight, expansion and velocity that makes or breaks the success of a cartridge on deer or any other animal.

On paper, the 300gr .375 bullet I was using (in 3 different configurations) is smack dab in between a 150-grainer in the .300WBY and the .300WIN in terms of muzzle energy. Both of them harvest countless deer in America every year.

So, I don't think it is the extra .067 of an inch that makes the .375 "formidable" or "unsuitable". It is the expansion coefficient, coupled with the brawny weight of the cartridge that makes a particular bullet ideal or disastrous.

That is why I stay away from anything lighter than a 270-grain bullet when I hunt with my .375, and, ideally, I stay with the 300 grain slug. The 235-grainer is too light and expands too violently at close to 3000f/s, and it may indeed lack penetration for the more difficult quartering shots. The 270-grainer is a tossup, better if one of the premium, controlled-expansion types. But the 300 is versatile, it flies far thanks to its aerodynamics, it penetrates; it is excellent.

The reason why my last deer was butchered on the hoof using the 300-gr Winchester-Nosler failsafe is because this bullet is nothing more than a "ballistic tip with a paint job", as a friend of mine put it. It is designed to (and indeed it does) impart a huge amount of hydrostatic shock while expanding, but it still penetrates reliably. Yet, the hide of the deer was pretty much intact, and, save from the area between shoulders, some very good venison was still carved out of the animal.

The 300-gr Nosler Partition, instead, offers excellent fare for meat hunting. Small wound channel, good-size exit hole (about the size of a quarter), a very dead animal and still plenty power to make you confident in the case of a "Texas neck shot".

From now on, I will bring along only these 2 bullets - the first one, as I said, for trophy hunting (that animal ain't goin' nowhere :D) and the second for general meat hunting.
 
416Rigby: Have you used the 270 grain failsafe or 270 grain Speer [the boat tail bullet] in the 375? I have been thinking that when I get a 375 H&H that the 270 failsafe or the new 270 Swift would be a good choice for Bear and Moose. But for deer the 270 Speer might make more sense?

I know you said you like the 300 grain bullet better but with the 270's you get the same trajectory as 308/150's [more or less].

Have you used the solids on anything? I noticed in an artical by Seyfreid not to long ago he mentions using his 416 Rigby to take a big bull elk. He had his gun loaded like he was hunting buffalo [he might have been testing loads before heading to Africa?] with a 400 Swift in the Chamber and Trophy Bonded Sledgehamers [the solids] in the mag. It took two almost lengthwise shots to put the elk down.
 
I don't think you have to worry about penetration with the 375 on deer, no matter what bullet you use. The problem with the 235grain is that it is unperdictable in its action.If something solid is hit it expands fast, I think, but if there is little resistance like a broad side lung shot it won't expand. As far as penetration is concerned I have never recovered a bullet yet, out of about 6 hits on deer. I think my 350 Remington Mag. is more consistant and reliable in its action on deer than the 375 or anything else I have used on deer.The 35 cal. bullets I have used are lighter constructed than most 375cal bullets and so far they always open up fast, and I can still get good velosity out of the 350 with 180 or 200 grain bullets.
 
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