droping to a knee while reloading from empty???

T

trlrnr

New member
I'm new to "The Firing Line" so hello everyone. I did do a search for this question first and really couldn't find it.

my question is... If you are still in a fight and have to reload from empty, should you drop to a knee to do the reload? If so, should you pivot your feet so that you would be rotating you body presenting your profile (ie. smaller target). this is assuming that you are not wearing body armor.

Further more, would it be better to begin moving for the reload,as in change locations? (moving target is harder to hit).

I know that there's a lot of "what ifs" so I am going to give this a big "IN GENERAL"

essentially what is the accepted practice for a reload from empty during a fire fight?

I thank you in advance for any information and opinions. if anybody has disagreements on this post please be respectful, we are all on the same team here and life is to short to be pissy

Thank you
 
Welcome to the club. I do not think there is any universal technique. As I'm sure you'll find many different people have many different views. All give good input though. I think anything you can do to make yourself less of a target is a good thing. Especially during a reload when BG (bad guy) doesn't have lead headed his way, he could get off a cleaner shot at you. Terribly situation dependent. Best idea is to move to cover before hitting empty, then you can duck behind cover while reloading. Of course that may not work for all situations. Just do what you can to make yourself less of a target. Also get more amo in your gun ASAP. More pressure you put on BG, less chance of him getting a good shot at you. Practice practice practice for any situation you can weather it be kneeling, turning, or moving. Get smooth with your reload then you'll be able to return fire faster no matter what your legs and feet are doing.
 
double lung shot

Remember that turning sideways exposes you to being shot through both lungs, which doesn't have a good prognosis.

My vote would be: if you're not shooting, you should be moving to cover, manuevering for advantage, or retreating. Should I shoot to slidelock while far from cover, I'd stay up and reload on the move....either towards cover or to create distance. Actually, I'm all about moving while shooting, too (in absence of cover/concealment)....

Welcome aboard!:D
 
keep moving!

Years ago a bunch of guys that I work with went to an indoor paintball range. After we had played a while one of the employees introduced us to a new game. He called it 'Kill Mike" His name was Mike. He had a better paintball gun than the rentals that we all had but there were about 20 of us, all we had to do was hit mike once before he took all of us out. Mike ran and shot, he never allowed us to pin him down. Mike won, it was a valuable lesson for me.
 
Cover and distance are your friends. That being said, your best bet would be to practice accuracy from cover, on the move, etc so you can end the fight with less than one mag.
 
I think you're better off moving while reloading from empty. It doesn't take very long to reload, if you're practiced, so kneeling would only slow you down much more than needbe. If you're kneeling behind cover, well that's the exception.
 
Kneeling simply to reload does nothing but takes time and introduces the potential for being off balance or losing target acquisition when going down on or getting up under stress. You can easily reload while standing or (preferably) moving while keeping the target visible. With practice, you should be able to keep the weapon on target while performing any necessary task beyond malfunction clearance.
 
Cover is critical, do not stay in one place, do not reload in the open unless you absolutely have to.

I have some training drills on my brothers website with video for training at movement, firing from cover, and different positions.
 
I say moving is best. Some say if you're not shooting you should be moving. While I agree with that, I would add to it and say you should be shooting and moving. ( if you are able ) FOF training will show that the "stand and deliver" method generally does not work out well. Good luck.
 
In the absence of cover, there is no reason to kneel to complete the reload of a pistol. It offers no more stability than standing and it limits your mobility. Furthermore, the closer you are to the ground, the more of a chance of riccochet into your vitals.

If you find yourself in the open and out of bullets, it's best to move quickly to the nearest point of cover to reload.
 
in general, I would not give up my mobility by dropping to one knee.

If there's cover and a LOT of distance (like 25 yards), then I might consider it. Otherwise, I'd haul ass for cover and reload. I could probably drop the empty mag on the way, but even sloped feed ramps might be bouncing too much to reload on the run.
 
Seems like to me that, if you reload properly, you'd be done before you got all the way down. Or at least close enough to done that the entire motion would be a waste.
 
Cover and motion are your best friends. Move while shooting, take cover to reload.

FWIW, if you need to reload, you're in a gunfight you don't need to be in or you need more practice at the range.
 
I wouldnt kneel while reloading. If the mag is in your pocket it would be impossible or if it was on you belt it would at least be a little more challenging than normal. I would put more emphasis on getting to cover before I need to reload.
 
Are you kneeling to take cover or just to kneel because this is something you saw on the History Channel on the Marines, SAS or SBS?:confused:

Marines have other people covering them when they sing out "Malfunction, malfunction, malfunction" and take a knee. I will not.

I feel the need, the need for speed (and something very thick between me and the threat).:D
 
If you are not shooting you had better be moving. random paths to cover, harder to hit a moving target.


ALWAYS BE TALKING.

"STOP SHOOTING" "CALL POLICE" "HELP ME, HE"S IS TRYING TO KILL ME"
 
Kneeling while reloading, kneeling while clearing malfunctions and shooting from the kneeling position after accomplishing these tasks is a perfectly viable option in a firefight.

Of course the best option is always to find cover but that is not always a viable option. Sometimes you simply must make yourself a smaller target (by kneeling) and you can return fire from the kneeling position as well.

If you CAN shoot and move to a better location that offers protection against incoming rounds, then do so. If not, your best option is to kneel while changing mags and then re-engage the threat either from the kneeling position or from the standing/crouching position (or charge the threat head on).

People talk about how they "shoot while running towards cover". Doing this will certainly accomplish 2 things; 1) You will not have any ammo left when you need it and 2) you will kill innocents in the vicinity.
You will simply empty your firearm of ammunition and not hit a damn thing shooting while running laterally towards cover, most likely 1 handed.

It is nice and cushy on a square range where the target is static. You might hit the target a few times with practice. But, at a full out run towards cover, you wont hit anything but other people (not your intended target).

Again, you have 2 options. You can run to cover, change your magazine and return fire, or you can kneel in place while you are changing your magazine and engage from the kneeling position and then transition to the standing, moving position.
It depends on your surrounding environment, the position of your target(s) (because you sure would feel like a schmuck when you run towards cover with an empty firearm and it turns out that another 'target' is in the cover area you chose to run towards...) and your flight-fight reaction at the moment.
 
If you are kneeling behind cover maybe.

Otherwise, everything else being equal, I am for reloading on the move and making tracks. Its much harder to hit a target that is running as fast as he can out of the area, as opposed to a kneeling stationary target.
 
Generally speaking

I work in an indoor range and I see lots of inexperienced people shoot. Most poor shooters and many average shooters under stress pull low and left on the target. As a general rule, assuming most people are right handed, you are better off moving to your left (and maybe jumping up in the air:D) than kneeling.
 
This is a tactic Ive seen taught to a lot of Air Force personnel. The assumption is that you're defending yourself in an ambush, and you're kneeling behind your humvee to take cover while you reload.

I have also seen it taught to airmen who keep fumbling or dropping their mags while standing. The instructors have them kneel down because otherwise some genius will try to bend over to grab the mag and end up with his muzzle somewhere other than downrange.

As for doing this in a civilian setting, speed and accuracy is the better answer (both in real fire fights and in paintball).
 
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