Don't Bring a Knife to a Gunfight...Actually it is all relative

R

Rachen

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to the skills being used in deploying the weapons and the determination that the weapons' wielders have, whether it is defending a loved one's life or showing off and trying to look tough.


Take a look at the video below. It shows footage from the 1969 Altamont Rolling Stones concert where a group of Hell's Angels bikers were hired as security.
Things started going rough when the crowd, by this time obviously high as weather balloons started trashing the HA's motorcycles, which is a big no-no. At a certain point, one man named Meredith Hunter pulled out a handgun and tried to shoot Mick Jagger. That is when one of the Hell's Angels, Alan Passaro, jumped him and (probably) stabbed him too. Hunter's death was officially listed as stab wounds.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0qTKsylrpsg
 
Moral of the story is if you are going to shoot Mic Jagger, you'd better be wearin a Level III vest.

With groin protector !
 
The overall protection was good, gun was seen, looked like a fixed blade overhead stab to the neck, most likely hit an artery.

The Hells Angels who were close protection, they stayed in position, did a fair job. Kept their eyes on the ball, hope they got paid. That knife got boiled!
 
If you have time to pull a knife from your pocket you have time to pull a gun (say a snubby) from that pocket. And you don't have to worry about opening anything like you would a folder.

And if you are close enough to stick someone you are close enough to put that gun in their ear before firing.

Everytime I've seen these knife demos showing their supposed superiority, the gun guy has his gun holstered and has to draw it while the knife guy as his in hand.

At touching distance a gun can be used just as well as a knife. Just pull it back to retention and fire or if struggling just bend your wrist and fire into the ribs, legs, armpit, etc...

That guy who stuck the one shooting at Mick could have just pulled a gun at that range and brained him.

Deaf
 
I'd still rather take my chances with a gun. Luckily for me I have 2 (maybe 3, still deciding on this one) guns and a knife on me.

Point is, dont mess with biker gangs.
 
Deaf Smith, guns aren't always legal. Some states have laws disallowing the concealed carry option for civilians. The Hell's Angels in particular shouldn't be carrying.

Guns are not the be all, end all of possible weapons. People who seem to think that fail to realize how effective an impact or edged weapon can be. I look at it this way, a bullet, or three, will not magically stop a man in his tracks and stop him from aiming and firing. A person in front of him, with a contact weapon can stop his movement, disrupt his aim, and effectively cause enough damage to stop the threat in one moment.
 
Another important thing: that Hell's Angel's knife didn't go in one side of the guy's head, out the other, and into the lung of an innocent concert-going standing in the wrong place at the wrong time. Yeah, the Angel could have blown his brains out, but what was the backstop going to be if he'd have shot him instead of stabbing him?
 
A knife wont run out of cut. Felons cant own guns......

Hells Angels are instructed to run to the aid of a "brother" in other words you fight one you fight everyone that is there and the ones show up while you are being stomped into the ground. No fair play from them in any way shape or form.


Gee, I remember seeing this on the news :( must be getting old, mick sure did :)
 
BlackFeather,

Knives ain't legal either in lots of places. Happily I live in Texas.

Guns are not the be all, end all of possible weapons. People who seem to think that fail to realize how effective an impact or edged weapon can be. I look at it this way, a bullet, or three, will not magically stop a man in his tracks and stop him from aiming and firing. A person in front of him, with a contact weapon can stop his movement, disrupt his aim, and effectively cause enough damage to stop the threat in one moment.
Click to expand...

Well I happen to be a 5th dan, plus Krav Maga. I know a wee bit about impact weapons and knives. I'd still rather have a good J .38.

A knife wont run out of cut. Felons cant own guns.....
Click to expand...

markj,

They can't own guns? Why? Oh, it's against the law. And by definition, what is a felon?

BTW, felons on parole can't touch knives either or any other kind of weapon... at least if they obey the laws...

Run out of cut? No, but they sure can run out of range fast. Like a few inches past your arm reach.

Guys,

If all I had was a knife or a short stick like a Joongbong, well I fight with what I have, be it a beer bottle, car antenna, rock, book, base ball bat, etc... or my hands and feet.

But I'd rather have a gun.

Even the Mississippi gamblers in the 1830s went to guns once they became multi-shot.

Deaf
 
I normally use my knife to cut hay bale twine.



I've been in a knife fight before, Its ugly, bloody, and quick, if you don't think your going to walk away without bleeding, then think again. He whom cuts the most wins; ie: he who's not bleeding out first

wins.


Edit:

I'll use my handgun before a knife, but if have to, I know what to expect.
 
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Open carry of fixed blade knives is legal in most places, especially back then. Even in California, I know, I'm there half the year.

I own no belts, no sashes, and claim no schools personally.

As you said, if all you have is a knife, or anything else, that's what you use. That's all I have, I don't feel that I need a gun.

As for "knife fighting", it's a myth. Knife on knife shouldn't happen, it's easier to get away. If you have a knife, and they do, why are you there? Run. If they attack, run. I've been attacked with a knife too, it sucks. I ended it fast, because I knew I had to stop the knife hand and strike the head as much as possible. I'm alive, with a small scar. But like most edged weapon attacks it was sudden, and barely left me with time to react. Had he been behind me, I'd likely have had worse injuries, if not be dead.

I make knives as well.

As for knife use, I'd suggest IET from Modern Combative Systems. I like the simplicity, and effectiveness. Google them and there is a teaser for the video. It's not knife fighting, to make that clear.
 
Here's and idea. Don't make Hell's Angels angry, especially when there are drugs and booze around. Hire some real body guards, not Merc's.
 
There is somthing known as the 21 ft rule that needs to be looked at. It say that a man with a edged weapon will defeat a man if a fire arm 9 times out of 10 if the engagment is within 21 ft. Reasons 1 you dont really have to aim a knife 2 it is hard to hit a target running at you even if you do get your gun out. 3 after being hit properly by a knife it is near impossiable to get a shot off.

I have actually had this prove true a couple of times. (All in down rang Mil settings) More men have died from a blade then a gun through out history.
 
markj,

They can't own guns? Why? Oh, it's against the law.
Click to expand...

Most HAs carry a blade. Last time I was in sturgis some of them were camping in custer park a few from another gang show up and shoot a few, later the HAs were on every street corner with blades under their vests, not guns, waiting for the other gang to show up. I noticed a lack of police of any kind so Ileft before the battle.

So if you dont know about them, you may not understand why they like blades. A knife is quite, sneaky. A gun makes a lot of noise and flash.

When the gun runs dry that knife will still cut and some can be thrown.
I respect any implement that can harm me in any way, I scoff at none, I been cut real bad once in the neck. Shouldnt even be alive...from a knife.

I was shot once too, but that knife is what Iremember vividly.
 
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