Did I just read that? AMMO registration?

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MicroBalrog

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California proposes requiring bullet ID numbers

Tue Apr 26, 2005 9:25 PM BST
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By Adam Tanner

SAN FRANCISCO (Reuters) - California's attorney general introduced pioneering legislation on Tuesday that would require all bullets sold in the nation's most populous state to bear tiny identification numbers.

The bill, aimed at helping investigators solve crime, would require ammunition vendors to submit sales records to a state registry starting in 2007. Anyone bringing bullets into the state not bearing the tiny serial number etched by laser could be punished for up to a year in prison.

"We are losing too many of our young people to seemingly random shootings and anonymous killers," California Attorney General Bill Lockyer said in a statement. The bill "will strip criminals of their anonymity and give law enforcement evidence it can use to quickly and effectively solve more gun crimes."

The legislation -- which could become the first of its kind nationwide -- calls for California to assess fees not to exceed one-half of one cent per bullet to fund the program.

The controversial proposal could spark another major gun control debate in California, a state with some of the toughest U.S. gun control laws. Gun rights groups oppose the idea, saying criminals could easily obtain unmarked ammunition and say the plan would require a costly bureaucracy.

Ravensforge, a Seattle company which has developed a bullet coding system, says bullet engraving machines cost $300,000 (127,000 ponds) to $500,000 each. But the firm says that because the United States sells ten billion bullets a year, the per bullet cost will be very low.

Ammunition manufacturers disagree.

"Although I understand the good intent behind the bill, from a manufacturing perspective it's virtually impossible, both from a cost perspective and keeping the bullet serialization in tact," said Gary Svendsen, a Federal Cartridge Company official who earlier testified at a legislative hearing in Sacramento, California.

"It would virtually obsolete tens of millions of dollars of existing manufacturing equipment," said Svendsen, who is director of quality and product service at the Anoka, Minnesota-based company.
 
There is one purpose for this proposed legislation: to make it virtually impossible for ammunition manufacturers to sell their product in CA, which is tantamount to a gun ban. And I though Illinois was bad.

I think I am going to be sick. :barf:
 
Why is it spokespersons for the ammo companies insist on maintaining composure and decorum. Lockyear is a certifiable nut. The man has no concept of technology. He thinks he can wave his hand and what every he dreams up can be done. Nevermind that pesky freedom and rule of law stuff. Never mind the constitutional thingy. Technology may not be able to deliver. . . . then so what. Ballistic fingerprinting was the last great dream and it is a failure. NJ's personalized handguns will be the next failure. So let's add engraved ammo to the list. It is a bad thing when government begins harassing its citizens through legislation; and this is harassment.

I think it is time for ammo execs to go into a red-faced bulging neck rant over the incredible stoopidity of CA's elected reps. What you say? Yelling will not advanced the cause of the second amendment? Hey, it is already dead in places like CA, MD, NY, and IL. Not yelling will gain you nothing.

<Breathes deeply>
 
This is unbelievable. I hope Kommifornia gets to its senses or its gun owners will be left helpless. Driving ammo prices wild....only in the left coast.

All I know is that for 10 years living in Virginia, I was wanting to come home to Kommifornia, but after getting my CC permit here, and reading about these crazy laws I am glad I moved, and I am not moving back. :(

A cold winter is better than perfect weather and being unarmed.
 
We are fighting this and other bizarre legislation as hard as we can here in California, but sometimes I think it would help if shooters from outside the state wrote a few letters too. It's in your interests to do so, since California seems to be a proving ground for leftist anti-gun legislation. How many of you are facing statewide "assault weapon" bans and 50 cal bans?

Tim
 
Hawaii is almost the same way. You have to register every box of ammo you buy. People wonder why there are rumors of a massive earthquake in Cali that will cause the state in sink into the ocean.
 
The legislation calls for California to assess fees not to exceed one-half of one cent per bullet to fund the program.
Click to expand...

Errp, hold up a sec. "Assess fees"?!? The bill, as described, is *already* putting the cost burden onto the *manufacturer*, by requiring laser etching on each bullet, a highly burdensome cost. This would ostensibly allow the *normal* investigative channels/programs/techniques/budgets to then solve crimes faster, right? So why, praytell, does ANY fee need to be assessed on ANYONE, be it the manufacturer', sellers, or taxpayers, over and above the overwhelming financial burden already imposed by this bill onto the manufacturers, which of course must be passed on to the ammo consumers? What the hell 'program' is there? Is the gov't gonna actually etch each bullet themselves? Of course not; there is no need for any *program*, even if the bill is a good idea (which it's not). The normal investigative budgets would handle it; if ANYTHING, since it's supposed to help solve crimes quickly, there needs to be LESS taxes/fees imposed on consumers & taxpayers, not more, since crimes will be solved quicker, relieving in part the normal LEO investigative budgets. This is just an end run around the old idea of "taxing ammo" which was shot down time and time again before. It amounts to an instant double taxation; (1) the 1/2 of a cent per round which goes mostly into the pockets of beaurocrats; of course they'll max that limitation out, and (2) the 10 cents per round, give or take, over and above the 1/2 of one cent, that the manufacturers must add and pass on to the consumer, to cover their costs tooling up the whole thing just for commiefornia sales; and that's just among the major ammo companies; the small ones will simply quit selling there, as they will be unable to afford the etching process at all.

As the man said, some of us out-of-staters need to write some letters to help these hapless calif. gun owners out a little - give this dirtbags like Lockyar a piece of our minds.

In any event, stupid stupid nonsense - how is this going to work supposedly anyway - last time I checked, bullets become highly deformed after firing and entering a target, which would obliterate any etching, no?
 
Unless they start making slugs out of solid steel, but then there will be "evil cop killing bullets" brought on by the devil. Since the country is becomming poor because of the War on Terrorism, why don't we just try to sell Commiefornia to another country to recoop what funds we lost.
 
Just like the car companies should, the ammo makers should tell the CA senate that they will not comply and stop sales there, completely, including LE. Only they can underline that this is an effort to tax ammo out of existence.
 
SAN FRANCISCO (Reuters) - California's attorney general introduced more jackass legislation on Tuesday that would require all bullets sold in the nation's most populous state to bear tiny identification numbers.

The bill, aimed at helping advance the fight to ban all privately owned weapons in California, would require ammunition vendors to submit sales records to a state registry starting in 2007. Law abiding citizens bringing bullets into the state not bearing the tiny serial number etched by laser could be punished for up to a year in prison.

"We are losing too many of our vicious gang members to seemingly random shootings and anonymous killers," California Attorney General Bill Lockyer said in a statement. The bill "will strip criminals stupid enough to buy ammo in gun stores and other retail outlets of their anonymity and give law enforcement evidence that will be virtually worthless in solving more gun crimes."

The legislation -- which could become the first of its kind nationwide -- calls for California to assess fees not to exceed one-half of one cent per bullet to fund further efforts to disarm law abiding Californians.

This assinine proposal could spark another major gun control debate in California, a state with some of the most insane U.S. gun control laws. Gun rights groups naturally oppose the idea, saying criminals could easily obtain unmarked ammunition and say the plan would require a costly bureaucracy.

Ravensforge, a Seattle company that has developed a bullet coding system and which stands the most to gain if this legislation is passed, says bullet engraving machines cost $300,000 (127,000 ponds) to $500,000 each. But the firm says that because the United States sells ten billion bullets a year, the per bullet cost will be very low.

Ammunition manufacturers disagree.

"I can understand the real intent behind the bill, but from a manufacturing perspective it's virtually impossible, both from a cost perspective and keeping the bullet serialization in tact," said Gary Svendsen, a Federal Cartridge Company official who earlier testified at a hostile legislative hearing in Sacramento, California.

"It would virtually obsolete tens of millions of dollars of existing manufacturing equipment, and make it even more expensive for Califonians to buy the equipment they need to defend themselves" said Svendsen, who is director of quality and product service at the Anoka, Minnesota-based company.
 
Like I said lets just sell the few anti-gun states to recoop all the money Bush spent on the War of Terrorism. California want's to be anti-gun then lets sell the state to Austrailia.
 
No, you sell California to Switzerland. That way, every Californian is required to keep a full-auto rifle in their closet. It will make the pro-gun Californians happy and cause the antis to collapse into the fetal position and start to cry.
 
20 numerically engraved cartridges, $10.
Cheap file from the hardware store, $5.
Gas for trip to other side of town, $10.

Knowing nobody can trace the "anonymity-stripping" shells you left behind during that drive-by... Priceless.
 
Manufacturers should follow the lead of Mr. Ronnie Barrett. In the May issue of SWAT magazine, I pleasantly read this "disclaimer" in the Barrett Firearms ad on page 34:

"The California Legislature has banned the .50BMG from the good citizens of the state of California violating their rights and the constitution of our republic. Therefore, Barrett will not sell or service any California government agencies."
 
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