Decided to try a scout rifle

M

Madball6

New member
Recently had money to blow and decided to try out a scout rifle setup. Picked up a Ruger Gunsite Scout and put a Burris 2-7 ler scope on it. I have to say I wasn't to sure going in how I was going to feel about it, but hey, something different to play with right? Turns out I really like how it feels and totally get the advantages this setup has. She shoots pretty good too, guess i'll keep her around.

Sub MOA right out the box. Groups start to open up a bit after 8-10 shots. I prefer a heavier barrel, but lighter rifle is part of the idea i guess right?

-Madball
 

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Well if you wanted a TRUE scout rifle, the Ruger is not the place to start.

It is a scout rifle in name only. Yes, I know, they someone managed to put the Gunsite stamp of approval on it, but if Jeff Cooper was around I think he'd have other things to say about it.

Not saying it's a bad rifle, it certainly is not, but you would do well to do research on what makes a scout rifle a scout rifle.
 
Model12Win said:
Well if you wanted a TRUE scout rifle, the Ruger is not the place to start.

It is a scout rifle in name only. Yes, I know, they someone managed to put the Gunsite stamp of approval on it, but if Jeff Cooper was around I think he'd have other things to say about it.

Not saying it's a bad rifle, it certainly is not, but you would do well to do research on what makes a scout rifle a scout rifle.
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So why don't you tell us?
 
If you really care, there are plenty of resources that you can read.

http://www.donath.org/Rants/ScoutRifleTaxonomy/

http://jeffcoopersscoutrifles.blogspot.com/

The thing is, very few people actually care about Jeff Cooper's original concept or his specifications. But, he is the one you coined the term, and the term "scout rifle" is one of the most overused and abused terms in the modern rifleman's dictionary.

Again, I am in no way saying the Ruger Gunsite Scout isn't a fine rifle. They seem to be very nice, but they are not actually a scout rifle. Semantics? Absolutely. But worth discussing nonetheless.
 
lighter

Yes, light and portable is indeed one of the concepts of the scout rifle, and typically the area where the current production scouts (did I just coin a new phrase?) fall short....typically to long and to heavy to pass Coopers specs. And has has been pointed out, there are other aspects that a scout needs to meet to make grade.

I'm not certain, but I think I once read a Cooper comment that even the Steyer Scout that he conspired on, did not quite make grade in some aspect, though it was the closest a production rifle ever came. Problem was, they cost a fortune, were a funky blue/gray color, .....I not so sure they are even still in production.

I've got a Savage Scout, and that model was in production when Cooper was still living and writng. He had a few things to say about the Savage, but was not totally condeming either, as I recall. I'd like to believe he'd come across the same way on the Ruger.
 
I always wanted a Styer Scout, but being a working stiff could not afford one. I did pick up a Styer SBS lightweight in 308 and it was the most accurate rifle in my safe for years.

Although the current crop of "Scouts rifles" does not live up to Col Coppers vision, they are still fine field rifles......Scout on!!
 
Looks like a good shooter. I wonder why you have the scope set so high though? Cheek weld would be a lot better with just running the scope in rings attached to the rail. Low rings, if doable, but that scope may require mediums with the larger objective.

I run the Leupold 2.5X set in rings so low I don't have room for covers, if I wanted them. Granted, it is a different rifle, but I think you'll like that Ruger running the scope a bit lower too.
:)
 
Yeah, I may get a different mount. I had that mount left over from one of my AR builds. I put a cheekpad on it after that picture was taken because as you pointed out, it did sit a bit too high. I didn't initially want to spend on a new mount until I had decided if i was even going to keep the rifle. but since I enjoy shooting it, I guess i'll have to look for a lower mount.

-Madball

Edit: That mount also has quick disconnect levers so in a bind its easy to switch to the iron sight in the field.
 
Model12Win,
Rather than discourage all other scout inspired rifles, I think your links have inspired me to believe that Jeff Cooper would approve of many of the Scout inspired rifles.
Hell the Styer was only an 88% effort. He did seem to value Weight, Length, and Common cartridge that could dump an elk as the most key ingredients, though minor fudging could be tolerated.

A "Lever Scout" on a BLR lightweight would likely be approved of, as would a semi-auto Scout IF an action could be four d that was both light and accurate enough.


Let's face it, what we loved about Col. Cooper was his intelligence, eloquence, and eccentric whimsey. WONDERFUL combination, but not the sort to sweat the minutest details, only the flagrant violations...unless he felt like it on a whim. He could, of course, be a stickler where the English written word was concerned, but then he was fluent enough to hold this over most anyone.
 
rings

Yeah, I noted the odd rings too, but withheld comment.

One of the points of the scoutscope was that it was to be mounted as low as possible, to aid in pointability. Another was quick detach mounts, with backup irons. Having to add a cheek rest is counter productive, its adding weight and bulk as well, which is to be avoided on a scout.

Leupold's quick release levers have worked for me, and I hear good things about Warne's as well. The levers are funky, and take some getting used to, hanging off the side of the rifle, but I have not really had a problem with them afield snagging me, brush or other gear.

But, I have not had a lick of trouble out of the Leupold IER scoutscope either, so no need to detach the scope.

I think the Ruger is an interesting variation on the scout theme. The big box mag would let me shoot it in 3gun a bit more effectively (not near enough to be competitive, but good practice) than my Savages old style 4 rd mag. The big box would get in the way the rest of the time, so I'd opt for the flush mount option. The Ruger is longer and heavier than Cooper said it should be, but so is most any other factory attempt. The flash hider is in current vogue, but one could loose that and gain some shorter length. The controlled feed is considered a plus by most folks.

Since I have an older Savage, and a history with it, I'm not running out and getting a Ruger, but I don't have anything against them..
 
Congrats on the new Ruger, Madball. :cool:

I'm sure you'll like that rifle a lot. The laminate stock is solid and well made, not for scout purists, but that doesn't matter to most GSR owners. You'll really like your GSR more once you change out that AR scope mount.

The GSR is a good all purpose short rifle that can be adapted to how the owner wants to configure it. Change the mag capacity, change the LOP, change or remove the muzzle device, change the optics for forward or receiver mounting, etc.

Now only if they made a takedown model. :D
 
BTW, for those that like the GSR but think it weighs too much, Ruger did come out with a polymer stocked version recently that lowers the weight by just over 3/4 pound.

Plus, the only GSRs over 39" are the ones with the listed 18" barrel. My particular older 16.5" GSR (with true barrel of 17.25") is just over 36.5" with the muzzle device removed and one butt spacer installed (which is how I use mine).

:)
 
I like the rifle myself, but see no use for the scout / long eye relief scope, unless the receiver were machined for stripper clips, so I opted for a conventional mounted scope

the teflon coated stainless double stack aftermarket magazines cut down on the bulk of the Ruger factory mags, hold the same amount of rounds & mine have worked flawlessly...

bear in mind, my rifle was not built on the premis of building a scout...

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http://www.alphaindmfg.com/store/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=51

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I mounted a 3x9 Leupold over the action and love my Ruger. It has become one of my favorite woods guns and I carry it with me a lot. Shoots tiny little groups too!
 
Well if you wanted a TRUE scout rifle, the Ruger is not the place to start.
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Bull puckey. Cooper's requirements for a scout were as follows:

-Chambered in .308, 7mm-08, or for recoil shy shooters .243
No problem - the Ruger is in .308
-Weight of 6.6 lbs, and as an absolute max 7.7 lbs with everything but ammo
My Ruger #6830 with 3 round synthetic mag, all 3 stock spacers, the brake, Warne detachable rings, a Leupold 2.5x scout scope, and a RifleCraft safari Ching sling is 7.6 lbs unloaded so it just sneaks in under the line. Note that Cooper's approved scout, the Steyer, is 4 oz heavier for the base gun and the Savage is even worse. AFAIK the accessories I chose are the lightest currently available that meet the other scout requirements, so if you use one of the other scout rifles as a base, yours will be heavier than mine. The wood stock Rugers are a bit heavier - I guess you could argue they're pseudo scouts
-No longer than 39 inches
No problem - the Ruger is shorter than that even with all the stock spacers in.
-Capable of reloading via detachable box magazines or stripper clips (or both)
The Ruger takes detachable box magazines.
-Mount a fixed low magnification long eye relief optic forward of the ejection port
The Ruger comes with appropriate mounting hardware. Obviously it's up to the user to buy and mount the right scope.
-Mount additional ghost ring iron sights as a backup with a means of accessing them in the field.
The Ruger comes with ghost ring iron sights. If you use the Warne or similar rings, getting to the irons is no problem.
-Mount a Ching or CW type shooting sling
The Ruger has no problem with a safari-type Ching sling, and the stock has a spot for an extra stud if you want to go old school (which I can't see any reason for - the safari version is superior IMO).
-Capable of 2 minute of angle accuracy
Every Ruger scout I've ever shot managed this.

There's really nothing to debate - the new synthetic stock Ruger scouts meet the requirements. They ARE scouts (assuming you buy the obvious accessories). Furthermore, I believe they're the only way to bolt together commercially available parts to make a gun that meets the scout specs. You could potentially go lighter using say a Kimber Adirondack as a base gun, but that would require a custom scope base, custom bottom metal, and custom installed iron sights.
 
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A "scout" rifle is a lot like a "sniper" rifle. Either can be whatever the owner chooses. Just because it may, or may not meet Coopers definition does not make it not a scout rifle. The original specs called for no more than 6.6 lbs and the Ruger didn't meet Coopers original specs. At some point someone decided 7.6 lbs was OK. If you actually read Coopers writings he was pretty flexible with definition and recommended several options that did not meet his strict definition. At any rate the Ruger is close enough for me.

Jeff Cooper declares "The Steyr Scout is about 88 percent of ideal." While he frequently promotes it, "I get not one cent in royalties from the Steyr Mannlicher corporation."
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If the Styer is only 88% ideal and Cooper liked it, the Ruger is at least as close.

And just because Cooper said it, doesn't make it right. Cooper wrote a lot of stuff that has since been proven to be wrong. And the forward mounted scope is just one example. Unless you are trying to load with stripper clips a low powered variable mounted conventionally does everything better from close and fast to distance shooting.

Personally I consider most any shorter barreled bolt gun such as a Rem 7, Ruger Predator, Savage Hog Hunter, etc. with a conventional mounted scope a perfectly acceptable Scout rifle. Back up irons were always optional according to Cooper anyway. The only thing that prevents this rifle from meeting the criteria is the forward scope mount. Which is a poor place to put a scope anyway. This is my "Scout" rifle.

 
The forward scope mount is the most ingenious aspect of the entire design (closely followed by the loop sling). It combines the peripheral vision offered by iron sights with the speed and range extension of a telescope.
 
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