Dangerous ordnance?

[skeeter1]

I found this on the State of Ohio website:

§ 2923.12. Carrying concealed weapons.

(A) No person shall knowingly carry or have, concealed on the person's person or concealed ready at hand, any of the following:
(1) A deadly weapon other than a handgun;
(2) A handgun other than a dangerous ordnance;
(3) A dangerous ordnance.

Sooo... I guess handguns aren't really deadly weapons? If anyone can explain this paragraph to me, I'd appreciate it.

 

[croyance]

1.) Seems to say that you can't conceal carry a dangerous weapon other than a handgun. So that means handguns are dangerous.

2.) Says no other handguns that aren't a dangerous ordnance. So you must keep it deadly, otherwise it canno be legally conceal carried.
but 3.) says no dangerous ordnance at all, which contradicts 2.) That is, if a handgun is dangerous ordnance and no dangerous ordnances are allowed to be conceal carried, then no handguns are allowed to be conceal carried.

 

[TheBluesMan]

First of all, here is the link to the entire statute. Looking at only one section is like taking Bible verses out of context. You just shouldn't do it if you want know what it really says.

My interpretation (accept it at your own risk as IANAL):

Basically, (A)(1),(2)&(3) Break down the definition of a handgun to exclude Dangerous Ordnance and to exclude all other deadly weapons. Your license to carry is for a handgun only, not a long-gun, not a switchblade, not an automatic, etc.


(A)(1) You may not carry any deadly weapon concealed, other than a handgun. You have to go to § 2923.11. Definitions to find this definition:

(A) "Deadly weapon" means any instrument, device, or thing capable of inflicting death, and designed or specially adapted for use as a weapon, or possessed, carried, or used as a weapon.

Which means anything from a suitcase nuke to a medium-sized rock.


(A)(2) This does not apply to you if you have a CHL. Look at § 2912 (C)(2)(b) for this section of the law. This means you can conceal a handgun that isn't considered Dangerous Ordnance. You have to go to Section (K) of § 2911 Definitions to find what this means:

(K) "Dangerous ordnance" means any of the following, except as provided in division (L) of this section:

(1) Any automatic or sawed-off firearm, zip-gun, or ballistic knife;

(2) Any explosive device or incendiary device;

(3) Nitroglycerin, nitrocellulose, nitrostarch, PETN, cyclonite, TNT, picric acid, and other high explosives; amatol, tritonal, tetrytol, pentolite, pecretol, cyclotol, and other high explosive compositions; plastic explosives; dynamite, blasting gelatin, gelatin dynamite, sensitized ammonium nitrate, liquid-oxygen blasting explosives, blasting powder, and other blasting agents; and any other explosive substance having sufficient brisance or power to be particularly suitable for use as a military explosive, or for use in mining, quarrying, excavating, or demolitions;

(4) Any firearm, rocket launcher, mortar, artillery piece, grenade, mine, bomb, torpedo, or similar weapon, designed and manufactured for military purposes, and the ammunition for that weapon;

(5) Any firearm muffler or silencer;

(6) Any combination of parts that is intended by the owner for use in converting any firearm or other device into a dangerous ordnance.

(A)(3) Basically says you can't carry Dangerous Ordnance as defined above.

Clear as mud?
Glad I could help.

-Dave

 

[TheBluesMan]

I received a question via PM regarding dangerous ordnance and the definition of an "automatic" firearm in the Ohio Revised Code.

Thought I'd make my reply public as it contains a lot of information and may be helpful to others.

"Automatic firearm" also means any semi-automatic firearm designed or specially adapted to fire more than thirty-one cartridges without reloading, other than a firearm chambering only .22...

My understanding of the law regarding the 31 round limit:

1. Technically, they could ban all AR-15s, AK-47s, Mini-14s, etc. because they could argue that they are designed to fire more than 31 cartridges without reloading. (ie. 40 round magazines exist for these firearms.) This isn't likely, but I'd still like to see the words, "designed or" removed from the law. (Hell, I'd like to see the whole section repealed!)

2. If one were to attach a 40 rd. magazine to a Mini-14 or a 75rd. drum magazine to an AK-47, the firearm would be considered an "Automatic firearm" under the law. If you look at § 2923.11. Definitions (K)(1) it says that all automatic firearms are considered Dangerous Ordnance. Now you have to go look at § 2923.17. Unlawful possession of dangerous ordnance; to see the penalties for breaking this law (it is a felony).

3. Now technically, one could argue that mere possession of an AR-15 and a 40 rd. magazine for it doesn't constitute possession of an automatic firearm unless the magazine is inserted into the mag well. In practice, I believe that mere possession of both would likely be grounds to prosecute someone under this section of the law.

4. From § 2923.11: "Firearm" includes an unloaded firearm, and any firearm that is inoperable but that can readily be rendered operable. One can infer that an unloaded AR-15 and a loaded 40 rd. magazine would be considered an "Automatic firearm" because it could readily be rendered operable.

Conclusion: One can possess 40 rd. magazines, drum magazines, etc, or one can possess the firearms these magazines fit, but if you are in possession of both, you are in violation of the law.

I see these high-capacity magazines for sale at every gun show I attend. I see switchblades for sale also. Technically these are illegal, but there they are...

-Dave