DA trigger questions, advice

O

OhioGuy

New member
I've been shooting a CZ P07 for about 3 weeks, and have 400 rounds through it (guess I'm a little enthusiastic!) The gun handles and shoots so well for me that I'm determined to master it. For my first few forays I actually shot the DA trigger quite well, and have had surprisingly little trouble landing the first SA shot. The transition isn't too tough. But my DA shooting is actually worse than before and I think it's because I'm thinking about it too much!

At least 300 rounds have been shot DA.

So here's a question. A lot of people advise using the crease of the trigger finger joint first knuckle to pull the double action trigger, because it gives you more leverage. I think I find that this is true, and it also seems to make it easier for me to control the gun and not pull it off Target. But then I seem to have trouble with that first single action shot, because I am not used to put ever positioning my finger at the Joint. I've always use the pad, but I've never shot with anything heavier than probably a seven pound Striker trigger. Below is one source I've read and it concurs with Ernest Langdon videos.

www.luckygunner.com/lounge/learning-double-action-trigger/amp/

So for those of you who are used to shooting these kinds of pistols, do you position your trigger finger at the Joint of the first knuckle? And if you do, do you then fire every single action shot exactly the same way? Has anyone found it easier to just use the pad of the finger on all shots?

I appreciate it Vice from anyone who's able to give it. So far, even on my bad days, I'm really not all that bad. I think I just need a little bit of work to close the gap and be able to shoot this gun as well as I can shoot the striker guns I use

Oh, and preemptively I will ask that nobody please tell me to go buy a Glock :)
 
Use whatever part of the finger allows you to press the trigger straight to the rear without disturbing your sight picture. What works best varies by the person. I mainly use the pad with my smaller hands but I know plenty that use the crease just fine with larger hands.
 
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The reknown shooter and .45 gunsmith, Bob Chow taught me this method for trigger finger control:

take a wood dowel and cut it to the correct pull length. Place one end of the dowel in your web, where the backstrap would hit. The forwand tip of the dowel goes where you place your finger on the trigger, be it the pad or the crease.

Then practice pulling that dowel straight back into the web. You will be able to see what muscle control you need, or knuckle placement or pivot point to get a perfectly straight back pull. Keep practicing that straight back action so it becomes muscle memory.

Then when you are shooting, focus on the front sight, and think about how you got the dowel to move straight back and "pull" the front sight through the rear sight notch.

Nice thing about this exercise is that you can do it anywhere and at any time. But practice in the shooting position you are going to use it, be it one handed bullseye or two handed combat.
 
Good question that I have also pondered in the past. I have not seen the issue of whether or not to reposition the trigger finger on the trigger shoe addressed by the DA/SA gurus.

I own several different makes and models of DA/SA pistols as well as two DAO hammer-fired pistols and one double action revolver. I think how much trigger one needs to apply to the trigger for the DA trigger pull is going to vary a lot from shooter to shooter depending on hand size, trigger reach for the DA trigger, pistol grip size, and trigger pull weight. Shooters with small hands and a pistol with a fat grip, like a Beretta 92, May not be able to apply the “power crease” of the finger to the trigger while maintaining proper grip alignment. My practice is to apply as much, but no more, of the finger to the trigger as required by the trigger pull weight for the DA trigger pull, and maintain that same finger position on the trigger shoe for subsequent SA shots, For me and my pistols that often winds up being an intermediate location between the finger pad and joint crease.
 
Interesting reading , I agree with all above . Talking of muscle memory , just like walking up a stair case , if one step is off your brain will pick it up . l practice point shooting with a 1911 , with out seeing the firearm or counting your rounds , the feel is different when the slide slams toward or locks back , If your just blasting away you might not know your empty without seeing an press the trigger. You have to train yourself for the feel. The brain is 80% of the problems I'll put 20 on the firearm .
 
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The "crease" method that is being described is fine for DAO guns like a Glock, DAO S&W Gen 3 or DAO revolver. The trigger pull is always the same. The amount of pressure needed to get the gun to fire is always the same. The additional leverage the method provides may or may not be necessary but it will work.

I however would not and do not use that method for 2 reasons.

#1: I do not want to have to reposition my finger when shooting a DA/SA gun when transitioning from the DA to SA shot. It is introducing another failure point into my mechanics. For me the crease method does not work for me in SA. So I have chosen to shoot DA/SA with the front part or pad of my finger. I use the exact same pull motion to accomplish both shots.

#2: I do not change how I shoot from pistol to pistol. I shoot a 1911 the same way I shoot a DAO or a DA/SA gun. Clean smooth trigger press to the rear. Some guns require more pressure but I do not change how I apply that pressure. If you need to develop more strength then work on that but dry firing or squeezing a stress ball etc...

I see no need to change the technique. I do not buy guns that do not fit my hands. I grip every gun the same and pull the trigger to the rear in the same manner. If the gun does not fit me or cannot be modified to fit me I don't buy it. There are two many great guns on the market that fit me vs me changing my shooting technique to fit a gun.
 
I use the pad FWIW. I EDC a p226 Legion 9mm.

I have found that the double to single transition is not something that has to be feared at all. For me, to master the trigger transition, you have to master your grip first and trigger pull second.

If you have a good grip and sight picture, the weight of the trigger pull will be a non issue.
 
I use the pad of my finger, on all my handguns, regardless of trigger type. I have read and heard people say that they do better placing the knuckle crease on the trigger. I don't recall anyone recommending changing the finger placement on the transition from DA to SA, and I can't imagine that working well.
 
A good way to train is to just load two rounds at a time over and over and over again until the transition becomes natural. The more you do this the more you'll discover the one position of your finger that works best for you in both DA and SA. It's actually a lot easier than most people think, it just takes practice like any other learned skill.
 
WVsig said:
The "crease" method that is being described is fine for DAO guns like a Glock, DAO S&W Gen 3 or DAO revolver. The trigger pull is always the same. The amount of pressure needed to get the gun to fire is always the same. The additional leverage the method provides may or may not be necessary but it will work.

I however would not and do not use that method for 2 reasons.

#1: I do not want to have to reposition my finger when shooting a DA/SA gun when transitioning from the DA to SA shot. It is introducing another failure point into my mechanics. For me the crease method does not work for me in SA. So I have chosen to shoot DA/SA with the front part or pad of my finger. I use the exact same pull motion to accomplish both shots.

#2: I do not change how I shoot from pistol to pistol. I shoot a 1911 the same way I shoot a DAO or a DA/SA gun. Clean smooth trigger press to the rear. Some guns require more pressure but I do not change how I apply that pressure. If you need to develop more strength then work on that but dry firing or squeezing a stress ball etc...

I see no need to change the technique. I do not buy guns that do not fit my hands. I grip every gun the same and pull the trigger to the rear in the same manner. If the gun does not fit me or cannot be modified to fit me I don't buy it. There are two many great guns on the market that fit me vs me changing my shooting technique to fit a gun.
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Everything you've said here makes sense. I've been shooting striker guns for a while and pulling the trigger with my knuckle crease is awkward to do. So I've chosen to just learn to pull the DA the way I pull every other trigger.

Grip is definitely critical. It's easier to pull off target in DA shot if I let my grip get wimpy.
 
OhioGuy said:
Everything you've said here makes sense. I've been shooting striker guns for a while and pulling the trigger with my knuckle crease is awkward to do. So I've chosen to just learn to pull the DA the way I pull every other trigger.

Grip is definitely critical. It's easier to pull off target in DA shot if I let my grip get wimpy.
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IMHO people do not shoot enough DA shots from DA/SA pistols. People load a mag shoot one DA shot empty the mag and then reload and again shoot one DA shot and the rest SA. So people are shooting 14+ to 1.

Early on shooting learning to shoot DA/SA I would load 3 rounds. Draw shoot the DA and then fire 2 SA shots. Not necessarily a double tap but at a good pace. Then load 3 more and rinse and repeat.

I would also load a full mag. Fire the DA shot then follow up with the SA shot. Decock the pistol and rinse and repeat until the mag was empty.

Make yourself shoot the DA shot. As you get better you can learn to "prep the trigger" as you push out from the draw. This allows you to make a smoother more consistent pull on the DA trigger.

I am a big proponent of "hard prepping" DA and DAO triggers.
 
One good thing about a DA trigger... Dry fire practice is easy.


I find that proper/safe dry fire practice, on a regular basis, really helps with getting trigger pull right.

Learn to keep the sights aligned during the trigger pull, and practice repeatedly.

Once you get to the range, you just repeat that. Don't worry about recoil, and concentrate on making the trigger pull right every time. Is it a decocker? Then decock the pistol and shoot DA for every shot.

First you practice doing it right, and speed will come with practice. A lot of people feel they need to rush... And that leads to bad habits and poor shooting.
 
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