Custom Carry Worth $ ?
- Thread starter longshank
- Start date
Onward Allusion
New member
Personally, carry gun...less rounds and more weight? Um, I would not, but hey if you really want an expensive carry piece, I'd say go for it! [look at my sig . . .] 
Yes, carrying a Wilson 5" protector model, all stainless, is worth it to me ...because they are great guns, well built, well tuned to run 100% right out of the box...for many thousands of rounds. My 9mm has over 120,000 rds thru it now...and is about 8 yrs old - it's been a great gun.
I can't recommend a Baer...I have a 9mm Monolith model...fit and finish is average, it took at least 2,500 rds of breaking in before it would run .....so I never thought I would ever trust it. In hindsight, I think he makes his guns too tight - excessively tight ....so i'll never buy another one. It's a decent gun - not a great gun, so I gave it to my adult son.
I do have a 2nd wilson, 5" CQB in .45acp / I carried it for many yrs....but about 2 yrs ago I switched to the 9mm. Both guns are almost identical, except in caliber .... but in my 60's now and some arthritis in my hands ...and a little less recoil in the 9mm and my follow up shots are about 0.1 of a sec faster in 9mm...
The 9mm wilson is my primary range gun too -- and in my weekly tactical drills with my buddies. I won't buy another 1911, except a wilson ...they'really worth every penny in my view.
2 of my shooting buddies - have also purchased wilson 9mm's in last 2 yrs...because of my experience with their durability, accuracy and smoothness...and fit & finish. Both of theirs are CQB 5" models in 9mm.... ( and they could both afford to buy whatever they wanted ( Wilson, Brown, Cabot, Nighthawk, Baer, etc.....and between us, we all own a few Kimbers, Springfields, etc....but we all shoot the Wilson's --- and 2 of us carry wilsons, mine in 9mm, other guy in .45acp....but he's close to ordering a new 4" wilson in 9mm....I'm wearing him down.
Capacity is not an issue to me in a carry gum / 10 + 1 is plenty / and an extra mag or two.../ I have double stack guns ( sig 226's ).....but I carry the gun I shoot the best -- and for me that will always be a full sized 1911....not too heavy, great trigger, great feel, great features...
I can't recommend a Baer...I have a 9mm Monolith model...fit and finish is average, it took at least 2,500 rds of breaking in before it would run .....so I never thought I would ever trust it. In hindsight, I think he makes his guns too tight - excessively tight ....so i'll never buy another one. It's a decent gun - not a great gun, so I gave it to my adult son.
I do have a 2nd wilson, 5" CQB in .45acp / I carried it for many yrs....but about 2 yrs ago I switched to the 9mm. Both guns are almost identical, except in caliber .... but in my 60's now and some arthritis in my hands ...and a little less recoil in the 9mm and my follow up shots are about 0.1 of a sec faster in 9mm...
The 9mm wilson is my primary range gun too -- and in my weekly tactical drills with my buddies. I won't buy another 1911, except a wilson ...they'really worth every penny in my view.
2 of my shooting buddies - have also purchased wilson 9mm's in last 2 yrs...because of my experience with their durability, accuracy and smoothness...and fit & finish. Both of theirs are CQB 5" models in 9mm.... ( and they could both afford to buy whatever they wanted ( Wilson, Brown, Cabot, Nighthawk, Baer, etc.....and between us, we all own a few Kimbers, Springfields, etc....but we all shoot the Wilson's --- and 2 of us carry wilsons, mine in 9mm, other guy in .45acp....but he's close to ordering a new 4" wilson in 9mm....I'm wearing him down.
Capacity is not an issue to me in a carry gum / 10 + 1 is plenty / and an extra mag or two.../ I have double stack guns ( sig 226's ).....but I carry the gun I shoot the best -- and for me that will always be a full sized 1911....not too heavy, great trigger, great feel, great features...
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For me personally, no. There are many excellent pistols that can be had for a fraction of the price of either of those pistols. You have, again imo, one of those pistols. I don't have the disposable income for a Wilson, and if I had a windfall there are things I could use that money for my family other than a pistol when I already have ones I trust. But I'm not you, and you're not me. Only you can answer the question of what something is worth to you personally.
This, and only this...
IF YOU EVER USE IT, YOU MIGHT NOT GET IT BACK.
At the very least it is held until the investigation/court case is complete.
So if you can afford to throw away a grand or two, feel free.
Otherwise, get some plastic fantastic, or some 3rd Gen S&W semi-auto for under $500,
and enjoy knowing you can quickly and easily replace either inexpensively
should you have to use them in defense of family or friend.
IF YOU EVER USE IT, YOU MIGHT NOT GET IT BACK.
At the very least it is held until the investigation/court case is complete.
So if you can afford to throw away a grand or two, feel free.
Otherwise, get some plastic fantastic, or some 3rd Gen S&W semi-auto for under $500,
and enjoy knowing you can quickly and easily replace either inexpensively
should you have to use them in defense of family or friend.
noonesshowmonkey
New member
This is a question akin to asking if, when about to go for a hike, you should trade your hiking pack for a Prada handbag.
The Glock 19 is essentially the best deal coming or going in a carry handgun. And, as another user noted, you can just buy three more of them instead of a 'carry' gun with some fancy name. Better yet, spend that cash on a few bricks of 9mm ammo to train with, and sign up for some serious training classes.
Hardware is rarely a solution.
The Glock 19 is essentially the best deal coming or going in a carry handgun. And, as another user noted, you can just buy three more of them instead of a 'carry' gun with some fancy name. Better yet, spend that cash on a few bricks of 9mm ammo to train with, and sign up for some serious training classes.
Hardware is rarely a solution.
If it will not hurt or damage you any way financially, i say go for it. For the people who say the Glock 19 is thr end all, be all, ultimate carry gun, that is simply your opinion. My opinion is that a high quality 1911 such as that wilson, is a much better pistol to carry than such a glock. The wilson 1911 will have a much nicer trigger, so follow up shots will be faster and the nice trigger attributes to ease of accuracy. The 1911 is much slimmer and trimmer than the glock, it carries so much nicer. Sure its a little heavy but in a decent holster you will forget you are carrying it. The 1911 carries less in its magazine, but that is what extra magazines or for, and if you cant take out 1-3 guys with 10rds, you need more training.
Double Naught Spy
New member
This is among the poorest of logic for making your carry decision unless you are destitute, which you apparently are not if you are looking at a custom gun. First, the chances of it happening are quite low. Second, at the time of a crisis, you will use whatever you have at your disposal, whether it is a $30,000 vehicle or a $189 NAA mini revolver or a $4.95 hammer from China.
Think of it this way, do you live in a trailer home because you don't want to live in a regular house that might be wiped out by a fire? Do you only buy clunker cars because a nice care might get damaged in an accident?
I carry a Wilson Combat CQB. It is a fine gun. It has been a great shooter. As noted, you can find a lot of good shooters for less money. If you heart is set on a 1911, you could buy multiple nice production 1911s for the price of a Les Baer or Wilson Combat and figure out which one you like best. If you find one on the first try, then you could buy a spare or two that are exactly like it so that if something happens to your carry gun (broken, stolen, used in self defense), you have a spare carry gun that will be exactly like the one that is lost.
Since you obviously have the money to spend, your carry considerations should really only be what is reliable, has the capacity you want, and what shoots well for you. Your Glock is already a good choice (although I personally dislike Glocks because I can't get used to the grip angle, they are fine guns).
My personal favorite is a Springfield EMP 9mm. It is an outstanding shooter, reliable, slim, downsized from a regular-sized 1911, but operates just like a regular 1911 (controls). It is a very nice production gun and if I was going the 1911 route for another carry gun, I would choose it over a Wilson Combat.
If we're talking bullseye shooting at 25 yds or from a rest on a bench, I agree. For practical shooting at the distances involved for most defensive shootings, I seriously doubt you'll notice the accuracy difference. I compare it to a car that can go 200 mph versus a car that can go 150 mph. If I'll never drive over 100, does it matter either way? For that matter there are plenty of folks that can shoot Glocks well. I don't think the Glock is the end all be all, but when I see people bemoan the trigger I feel like this guy:
.This is the same sort of logic gun control advocates spout. Stress and adrenaline, multiple bad guys, movement (the real world isn't a square range), barriers, these are all things that can take up more shots. I don't have any delusions of grandeur and I don't expect a gunfight at the O.K. Corral, but dropping from 15 to 10 rounds is a substantial difference and shouldn't be disregarded quickly. The whole point of carrying is it is better to have it and not need it, then need it and not have it. The same is true, imo, for capacity. And in this case we are talking only a slight reduction in width, notably more weight, the same or greater height, and 2/3 the capacity. I'll drop capacity for smaller sizes/weights, but that's not the case here.
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First, Baer and Wilson, like Brown, Nighthawk, and similar higher end 1911 manufacturers are selling high end production guns, not custom guns. Nothing wrong with that, I love my Baer Boss 45, but it's not a custom piece.
That said, I don't have a problem carrying my Baer or any of my custom 1911s because I carry what I like, shoot best, and am comfortable with. As far as I'm concerned they are worth the money and the "buy a Glock" or "don't carry anything worth over $500 because they'll take it" arguments are BS. Should I have to use my gun in a self defense situation and it's taken as evidence, so be it, if I'm still around to bitch about it then whatever it cost me was money well spent.
If you want to buy a higher end 1911, Les Baer's guns are bargains for what you get as far as build quality and components, though most of them lack a bit in the aesthetics department compared to a Wilson or Brown and I'm okay with that, especially if it's going to be carried and used. The problem I have with stepping up to Wilson money from Baer money is the law of diminishing returns. Is a $3000-$4000 production gun worth it when I can buy a Colt and have it customized and finished exactly the way I want it for the same amount or LESS? No, not for me. And, IMO, if you are a 1911 aficionado, you owe it to yourself to have one built just for you.
So, that's my $.02 - if you're going to carry it and use it and you want the most 1911 for your money, buy a Baer - if you want something nicer and have the money and time, buy a Colt (the best base gun out there) and have it built by the 'smith or shop of your choice.
So, the answer to your question is, YES they are worth the money, with those caveats.
That said, I don't have a problem carrying my Baer or any of my custom 1911s because I carry what I like, shoot best, and am comfortable with. As far as I'm concerned they are worth the money and the "buy a Glock" or "don't carry anything worth over $500 because they'll take it" arguments are BS. Should I have to use my gun in a self defense situation and it's taken as evidence, so be it, if I'm still around to bitch about it then whatever it cost me was money well spent.
If you want to buy a higher end 1911, Les Baer's guns are bargains for what you get as far as build quality and components, though most of them lack a bit in the aesthetics department compared to a Wilson or Brown and I'm okay with that, especially if it's going to be carried and used. The problem I have with stepping up to Wilson money from Baer money is the law of diminishing returns. Is a $3000-$4000 production gun worth it when I can buy a Colt and have it customized and finished exactly the way I want it for the same amount or LESS? No, not for me. And, IMO, if you are a 1911 aficionado, you owe it to yourself to have one built just for you.
So, that's my $.02 - if you're going to carry it and use it and you want the most 1911 for your money, buy a Baer - if you want something nicer and have the money and time, buy a Colt (the best base gun out there) and have it built by the 'smith or shop of your choice.
So, the answer to your question is, YES they are worth the money, with those caveats.
noonesshowmonkey
New member
If spending 3-5x the cost of a glock 19 for another firearm with half to two thirds the capacity, greater weight, and almost negligible difference in girth is your kind of thing, then have at it.
The whole "if you need more than X rounds, you're doing it wrong" is a ludicrous argument with handguns.
The real world answer for handguns is the most hits you can make, in the most important places you can land them, as fast as you can. This rewards capacity and controllability.
Frankly, I don't buy into the 1911 swagger, and I'd rather spend my money on ammo and training. I am the actual weapon. There's a lot of guns I'd like to own, but 9mm by the 1000 is almost always the right answer.
The whole "if you need more than X rounds, you're doing it wrong" is a ludicrous argument with handguns.
The real world answer for handguns is the most hits you can make, in the most important places you can land them, as fast as you can. This rewards capacity and controllability.
Frankly, I don't buy into the 1911 swagger, and I'd rather spend my money on ammo and training. I am the actual weapon. There's a lot of guns I'd like to own, but 9mm by the 1000 is almost always the right answer.
The first question you should be asking is what type of handgun do I want carry. If you decide it's a 1911, then maybe a Wilson or Baer is the way to go. 1911s aren't for everyone, I love mine but they are heavy by comparison, mostly single stacks with less capacity (though I have 4 para high caps- too heavy) and can be expensive. Great guns, but figure out what you want to carry before spending the money on a Baer or Wilson. If you decide the 1911 is what you, then do the research on what features you want. Wilsons are very nice, but I'm not spending that much for a carry gun. You can find something just as reliable, with all the features you want for much less, including Baer's. To be honest, you can find a dw or a colt for even less.
How much training have you had? As has been said, bullseye shooting is not the same as typical defensive situations. I once thought I was pretty good too; then I started learning how to use a pistol in self-defense, and realized just how much I didn't know. Taking out three committed, armed bad guys with ten rounds happens all the time in the movies, far less often in real life.
With all that said, if you want to carry a high-end 1911, more power to ya!
Bartholomew Roberts
Moderator
As someone who carried a $2,000 custom Hi-Power for 15 years plus, there is no way to practically justify the expense. It is just one of those things you do because of intangibles. A Glock 19 will do everything you need a defensive sidearm to do - and probably have a better service life to boot.
On the other hand, the small joys of owning a nice pistol you really want are amortized pretty well over 15 years
On the other hand, the small joys of owning a nice pistol you really want are amortized pretty well over 15 years
Model12Win
Moderator
While a Glock 19 will probably do, you'll never have the same reliability or accuracy as a Wilson or Nighthawk.
It's hard to put a dollar value on the price of your life or the life of your families. That's up for you to decide, but for me, yes it is worth the cost because I want the best. Myself and my family deserve that.
YMMV.
It's hard to put a dollar value on the price of your life or the life of your families. That's up for you to decide, but for me, yes it is worth the cost because I want the best. Myself and my family deserve that.
YMMV.
While I am not a Glock fanboy, and think a good 1911 is a joy to shoot , I would take the G19 for a carry gun every time.
For combat accuracy and reliability in all conditions, the Glock is going to be very hard to beat at any price.
To imply that you value your life and the lives of your family more than I do mine because you spent more on your handgun than I did, is as insulting as it is inappropriate. There are countless choices of handguns available, that cover the price spectrum and are perfectly fine choices for self-defense. That sort of patronizing comment adds nothing to this discussion.
For combat accuracy and reliability in all conditions, the Glock is going to be very hard to beat at any price.
To imply that you value your life and the lives of your family more than I do mine because you spent more on your handgun than I did, is as insulting as it is inappropriate. There are countless choices of handguns available, that cover the price spectrum and are perfectly fine choices for self-defense. That sort of patronizing comment adds nothing to this discussion.
I've taken full day and multi-day courses with hundreds of rounds fired, ~ 500 per day, along with a fellow I know that has a Wilson 1911 in 45 ACP . My Glock 19 has hung in there round for round in terms of reliability, and to its credit the Wilson was solid. As for accuracy, my eyes are younger and allow me to shoot better in most instances.
While I have no problem with people using expensive pistols for self defense (no matter the cost if it ends up saving your life it'll be the best money you ever spent), the way this is phrased is a bit much. It makes it seem like, for comparison, that unless I buy a Volvo I don't care about my family's safety, when the reality is there are a number of cars with 5 star crash ratings and any manufacturer can make a lemon. For that matter we can't all afford Volvos. I'd love to own a Wilson, but I'm not going months without a pistol while I try to save up the money. If you have the money rock on, but the idea that I love my wife less than you love your family is, as mentioned above, insulting.