Cops writing other Cops tickets.. Part 2
- Thread starter 12-34hom
- Start date
Belasarius
New member
Radar detectors are legal pieces of equipment, all that crap about it being suspicious is really really bad.
I also have to respond to Prosouth's message. I find evidence in it for all of my criticisms of police.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>
However, you people go nuts when we turn on the lights. I also have to drive the Ambulance on occasion. People respond to an ambulance much better than they do a Police car. Why? I figure they assume it is an emergency to get someone to the Hospital.
They are unsure about a Police car though.I don't understand how you arrive at that mentality? Or what gives you the right to judge what we do in the course of our serving you.Afterall you don't even know the nature of our call.[/quote]
I think this is pretty wrong. If you don't have an emergency,a nd you are driving 90 miles an hour in a 40 with your lights blaring, well you shouldn't be driving 90 in a 40 with your lights blaring. The worst part of this paragraph is "what gives you the right to judge what we do in the course of our serving you" hold on there buddy that is pretty crazy talk right there. I hope if you re-read that you will realize how crazy it sounds. Where did you become holier than thou?
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>
You are worried about me hitting you in the backend ? Well so am I, that's why I'm afraid to turn on the lights is because I don't want to spook y'all and watch you go crazy. [/quote]
THis is also pretty crazy, it sounds to me like this. "I am a Cop, and I do not want "y'all" (non-cops) to be scared and afraid by us Cops, so I won't turn on my lights and scare the wildlife." Again this sounds pretty crazy I hope you realize that when you reread this. Since when were Cops higher orders of life than other men? The rest of your message contains even more "you" and "us" type ideas. What the hell is up with that?
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR> After all you work for me, I'm a taxpayer." God I'm sick of that one too. [/quote] You m ay be sick of it but it is true.
Your entire post displays a double standard. On one hand you want non-police to respect you, yet you do not even respect your own job because you do not follow the policies of your own job. I hate to put it this way, but you aren't paid to come up with your own job description. You are paid to enforce the laws and to protect society. You are not paid to enforce the laws and to protect society at the expense of the laws and society. But in fact many cops hurt what they seek to protect. You are not supposed to come up with your own policies and laws that apply to you because you thinkt hey are good ideas. Personally I think it is a good idea for me to go about 20mph over the speed limit in most situations, unfortunately most police officers do not agree with me. you think it is a good idea for you to go 20-30mph over the speed limit with your lights off. Unfortunately your EMPLOYERS as well as your BOSS probably disagree with you. Get off your holier than thou wagon and read the crazy stuff you have been saying./
I also have to respond to Prosouth's message. I find evidence in it for all of my criticisms of police.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>
However, you people go nuts when we turn on the lights. I also have to drive the Ambulance on occasion. People respond to an ambulance much better than they do a Police car. Why? I figure they assume it is an emergency to get someone to the Hospital.
They are unsure about a Police car though.I don't understand how you arrive at that mentality? Or what gives you the right to judge what we do in the course of our serving you.Afterall you don't even know the nature of our call.[/quote]
I think this is pretty wrong. If you don't have an emergency,a nd you are driving 90 miles an hour in a 40 with your lights blaring, well you shouldn't be driving 90 in a 40 with your lights blaring. The worst part of this paragraph is "what gives you the right to judge what we do in the course of our serving you" hold on there buddy that is pretty crazy talk right there. I hope if you re-read that you will realize how crazy it sounds. Where did you become holier than thou?
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>
You are worried about me hitting you in the backend ? Well so am I, that's why I'm afraid to turn on the lights is because I don't want to spook y'all and watch you go crazy. [/quote]
THis is also pretty crazy, it sounds to me like this. "I am a Cop, and I do not want "y'all" (non-cops) to be scared and afraid by us Cops, so I won't turn on my lights and scare the wildlife." Again this sounds pretty crazy I hope you realize that when you reread this. Since when were Cops higher orders of life than other men? The rest of your message contains even more "you" and "us" type ideas. What the hell is up with that?
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR> After all you work for me, I'm a taxpayer." God I'm sick of that one too. [/quote] You m ay be sick of it but it is true.
Your entire post displays a double standard. On one hand you want non-police to respect you, yet you do not even respect your own job because you do not follow the policies of your own job. I hate to put it this way, but you aren't paid to come up with your own job description. You are paid to enforce the laws and to protect society. You are not paid to enforce the laws and to protect society at the expense of the laws and society. But in fact many cops hurt what they seek to protect. You are not supposed to come up with your own policies and laws that apply to you because you thinkt hey are good ideas. Personally I think it is a good idea for me to go about 20mph over the speed limit in most situations, unfortunately most police officers do not agree with me. you think it is a good idea for you to go 20-30mph over the speed limit with your lights off. Unfortunately your EMPLOYERS as well as your BOSS probably disagree with you. Get off your holier than thou wagon and read the crazy stuff you have been saying./
12-34hom,
“Former” police officer? So what? Even if he were a LEO right now, he
overstepped the bounds of propriety.
-----
Bad Medicine,
“I'll get out of my car whenever I feel like it. You're out of yours. And if you pull your gun because you feel it's a "situation", I'll pull mine, and it may turn out to be one.”
“If you feel jumpy and wanna pull your side arm, I sure as hell am gonna pull
mine. I don't like having guns pointed at me and I trust me alot more than I
trust any "stranger" in a blue suit.”
Foolish beyond belief. I hope you’re just pulling our chain, but I’ll respond
as though you’re serious.
In my experience, most cops will be as nice as you let them be. Get tough -
you lose.
- At a minimum, you lose your chance to get a warning instead of a ticket.
- Escalate and the officer can conduct a roadside safety inspection that can
take up a lot of time - especially if he decides something is questionable and
he calls for his supervisor (who is “busy at the moment”) and you must sit
there and wait......
- Draw on an officer? Friend, that won’t stand on TFL: 1) I don’t know any
officer who would point his weapon at you for stepping out of your car,
although I know a couple who would slap the snot out of you if you resisted.
2) If you draw, AFTER the LEO has drawn, you’ll be found dead with your
handgun half out of your holster. 3) If you were to say that in my CHL class,
I’d return your check and tell you to leave. Right then. Period. Your
comment does not reflect the attitude or intelligence to carry a concealed
handgun in Texas.
- Even if you win the shootin’ match with the first officer, remember he’s
already told the dispatcher where you are, the description of your car, your
license plate number, and maybe the number of people in your car. If a
law-abiding CHL holder or off-duty cop doesn’t shoot you where you stand,
the LEO cavalry will be along directly. How dead would you like to be today?
-----
More Bad Medicine,
“If you come speeding up on us without them (emergency lights) on you are
endangering yourself, and are putting us at risk.”
100% correct. However, at least in Texas, (Transportation Code Sec
547.701(b), “The operator of an authorized emergency vehicle shall use the
siren, whistle, or bell when necessary to warn other vehicle operators
or pedestrians of the approach of the emergency vehicle.” (stress added)
- It becomes your opinion v. LEO’s opinion whether or not the lights were
necessary at the time.
- I believe law enforcement has the option of turning off emergency lights
and sirens IF using them might exacerbate a (potentially) violent situation.
There’s more, but I hope you get the picture.
-----
All,
Radar detectors?
- The very use of a radar detector implies the driver breaks (at least) speed
limit laws.
- When speed limit laws become sensible, I’ll throw my radar detector away.
-----
Ivanhoe,
“... everyone pulls over for a funeral procession, even if they're on the other
side of the road, but won't do a damn thing for an ambulance. Now, I hate to
be harsh, but the guy in the casket has all the time in the world, but the guy
in the ambulance has a bit of a time crunch.”
As a former firefighter and EMS driver, you’ve won a Shiner from me!
-----
PROSOUTH,
(Cool handle!)
“People respond to an ambulance much better than they do a Police car.”
It depends. I once needed a Deputy to get a car to let me pass. When the
Deputy stopped him the driver said, “But I don’t have to move over for him
(my ambulance)! He’s not a fire truck or a cop!”
------
Belasarius,
“Get off your holier than thou wagon and read the crazy stuff you have been
saying.”
Hmm. Some perhaps. But I recommend you read the appropriate laws for
your state to see what legal grounds you have for your comments. As I said
above, the LEO determines whether or not emergency lights are necessary.
And, as was pointed out, call DO get cancelled.
------
Well! I guess that about does it! Is there anyone left whom I have not
offended??
“Former” police officer? So what? Even if he were a LEO right now, he
overstepped the bounds of propriety.
-----
Bad Medicine,
“I'll get out of my car whenever I feel like it. You're out of yours. And if you pull your gun because you feel it's a "situation", I'll pull mine, and it may turn out to be one.”
“If you feel jumpy and wanna pull your side arm, I sure as hell am gonna pull
mine. I don't like having guns pointed at me and I trust me alot more than I
trust any "stranger" in a blue suit.”
Foolish beyond belief. I hope you’re just pulling our chain, but I’ll respond
as though you’re serious.
In my experience, most cops will be as nice as you let them be. Get tough -
you lose.
- At a minimum, you lose your chance to get a warning instead of a ticket.
- Escalate and the officer can conduct a roadside safety inspection that can
take up a lot of time - especially if he decides something is questionable and
he calls for his supervisor (who is “busy at the moment”) and you must sit
there and wait......
- Draw on an officer? Friend, that won’t stand on TFL: 1) I don’t know any
officer who would point his weapon at you for stepping out of your car,
although I know a couple who would slap the snot out of you if you resisted.
2) If you draw, AFTER the LEO has drawn, you’ll be found dead with your
handgun half out of your holster. 3) If you were to say that in my CHL class,
I’d return your check and tell you to leave. Right then. Period. Your
comment does not reflect the attitude or intelligence to carry a concealed
handgun in Texas.
- Even if you win the shootin’ match with the first officer, remember he’s
already told the dispatcher where you are, the description of your car, your
license plate number, and maybe the number of people in your car. If a
law-abiding CHL holder or off-duty cop doesn’t shoot you where you stand,
the LEO cavalry will be along directly. How dead would you like to be today?
-----
More Bad Medicine,
“If you come speeding up on us without them (emergency lights) on you are
endangering yourself, and are putting us at risk.”
100% correct. However, at least in Texas, (Transportation Code Sec
547.701(b), “The operator of an authorized emergency vehicle shall use the
siren, whistle, or bell when necessary to warn other vehicle operators
or pedestrians of the approach of the emergency vehicle.” (stress added)
- It becomes your opinion v. LEO’s opinion whether or not the lights were
necessary at the time.
- I believe law enforcement has the option of turning off emergency lights
and sirens IF using them might exacerbate a (potentially) violent situation.
There’s more, but I hope you get the picture.
-----
All,
Radar detectors?
- The very use of a radar detector implies the driver breaks (at least) speed
limit laws.
- When speed limit laws become sensible, I’ll throw my radar detector away.
-----
Ivanhoe,
“... everyone pulls over for a funeral procession, even if they're on the other
side of the road, but won't do a damn thing for an ambulance. Now, I hate to
be harsh, but the guy in the casket has all the time in the world, but the guy
in the ambulance has a bit of a time crunch.”
As a former firefighter and EMS driver, you’ve won a Shiner from me!
-----
PROSOUTH,
(Cool handle!)
“People respond to an ambulance much better than they do a Police car.”
It depends. I once needed a Deputy to get a car to let me pass. When the
Deputy stopped him the driver said, “But I don’t have to move over for him
(my ambulance)! He’s not a fire truck or a cop!”
------
Belasarius,
“Get off your holier than thou wagon and read the crazy stuff you have been
saying.”
Hmm. Some perhaps. But I recommend you read the appropriate laws for
your state to see what legal grounds you have for your comments. As I said
above, the LEO determines whether or not emergency lights are necessary.
And, as was pointed out, call DO get cancelled.
------
Well! I guess that about does it! Is there anyone left whom I have not
offended??
Mike in VA
New member
I still think 12-34hom did good. I' am polite, cooperative and respectful to the officers i encounter in any circumstance, and I get out of the way of any overtaking vehicle, But as this is turning into a discourse on speeding, radar detectors, etc, I'll offer a few additional comments -
First, the FHA (Federal Highway Administration) itsdamnself published a report back in `94 thta approx. 80-85% of public highways were underposted, that is, the speed limit was set artifically low for conditions and volume. Why do you suppose that is? My opinion is that it is more a local revenue enhancemnet issue/scam than one of public safety. Then there's the Insurance Institute of Highway Safety - they have a very vested interest in keeping limits low, they make a lot of money off the increased rates they charge those with moving violations (including the chickensh!t ones). Most interstates were designed for safte travel at speeds of 70-75 mph with 1950-60's technology (no ABS brakes, primitive suspensions, no airbags, no interior padding, etc., hell, seat belts weren't even mandatory until `64) Today's cars are an order of magnitude better in both roadworthiness and safety.
In my experience and observation, cops set up radar traps where it is easy to catch speeders (i.e. good cover & concealment), not so much were it's dangerous to speed (they don't want to be sitting there writing a cite in a blind corner, etc any more than you'd wanna be sitting there with them-) My speeding tickets (not hat there have been that many) have been out in the middle of no where, in good weather, with light traffic. Getting jumped from the bushes for no reason beyond the fact that I was motoring briskly (10-15 over) adds to the chickensh!t factor. I don't think you're stupid, Officer, why do you think I am? Don't get me wrong, there's a time and palce for everythin, e.g. if you're speeding in school zone or residentaiol neighborhood you should get two tickets - one for speeding, one for felony stupid, but out in the country, leave me alone.
Radar detectors - well, if you're going to watch me electronically, I have a right to know that. It goes back to a pre-revolutionalry days tradition, heralding the presence of armed authority. The FCC Act of 1934 says there are no 'reserved' frequencies - a citizen can receive any frequency he can tune in. Often, the beeping is a good reminder to behave. The statement that the mere possession of a detector is evidence of intent is an insult.
Anyway, I never did get an answer to my question - are you guys & gals in blue subject to the same traffic laws as the rest of us when not responding to an emergency/in pursuit/controling a traffic control situation?
y'all stay safe in any event. M2
First, the FHA (Federal Highway Administration) itsdamnself published a report back in `94 thta approx. 80-85% of public highways were underposted, that is, the speed limit was set artifically low for conditions and volume. Why do you suppose that is? My opinion is that it is more a local revenue enhancemnet issue/scam than one of public safety. Then there's the Insurance Institute of Highway Safety - they have a very vested interest in keeping limits low, they make a lot of money off the increased rates they charge those with moving violations (including the chickensh!t ones). Most interstates were designed for safte travel at speeds of 70-75 mph with 1950-60's technology (no ABS brakes, primitive suspensions, no airbags, no interior padding, etc., hell, seat belts weren't even mandatory until `64) Today's cars are an order of magnitude better in both roadworthiness and safety.
In my experience and observation, cops set up radar traps where it is easy to catch speeders (i.e. good cover & concealment), not so much were it's dangerous to speed (they don't want to be sitting there writing a cite in a blind corner, etc any more than you'd wanna be sitting there with them-) My speeding tickets (not hat there have been that many) have been out in the middle of no where, in good weather, with light traffic. Getting jumped from the bushes for no reason beyond the fact that I was motoring briskly (10-15 over) adds to the chickensh!t factor. I don't think you're stupid, Officer, why do you think I am? Don't get me wrong, there's a time and palce for everythin, e.g. if you're speeding in school zone or residentaiol neighborhood you should get two tickets - one for speeding, one for felony stupid, but out in the country, leave me alone.
Radar detectors - well, if you're going to watch me electronically, I have a right to know that. It goes back to a pre-revolutionalry days tradition, heralding the presence of armed authority. The FCC Act of 1934 says there are no 'reserved' frequencies - a citizen can receive any frequency he can tune in. Often, the beeping is a good reminder to behave. The statement that the mere possession of a detector is evidence of intent is an insult.
Anyway, I never did get an answer to my question - are you guys & gals in blue subject to the same traffic laws as the rest of us when not responding to an emergency/in pursuit/controling a traffic control situation?
y'all stay safe in any event. M2
THANKS Denis, Now Mr. Belasarius, go back and read what you wrote and what I have written. I never said go 90 mph everywhere all of the time or anything else Holier than thou. I will admit being aggravated at the post though.
"I also have to respond to Prosouth's message. I find evidence in it for all of my criticisms of police."
I figured you always had criticisms of Police
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If you don't have an emergency, and you are driving 90 miles an hour in a 40 with your lights blaring, well you shouldn't be driving 90 in a 40 with your lights blaring. The worst part of this paragraph is "what gives you the right to judge what we do in the course of our serving you" hold on there buddy that is pretty crazy talk right there. I hope if you re-read that you will realize how crazy it sounds. Where did you become holier than thou?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Where did all this above come from? I didn't say any of what you state except the quote and I still stand by it? ” What gives you the right? “ You are the one that stated "I also have to respond to Prosouth's message. I find evidence in it for all of my criticisms of police." I see you too make an effort to dislike Police. It seems that you also think we should consult with you before we go over the limit or turn on the lights. Well it doesn't work that way my friend.
As far as making up my own policies, this is the policy. My job is to get from on crisis to another the best and safest way I can. I even said only on primary roads and not neighborhoods or secondary roads. I didn't say 90 or 100 mph, I said 15 or 20 mph and I also said that most wouldn't even notice as they are already going that fast themselves. 10-33 traffic is used when necessary. I never said that I didn’t use it. I only stated that it seems to be more dangerous because of public reaction to it. If the “Wildlife” isn’t disturbed they are a whole lot more stable.
"..so I won't turn on my lights and scare the wildlife." Pretty true statement, what would you suggest we do? I do know what the book says about lights and siren and it does say ” When Necessary ”. I also know what is necessary to get where I'm going safely as possible for me and the public. I suggest you find someone to ride with and experience the safe way to do things. You will see what I speak of real quick.
The double standard is in your mind and the mindset you have will apparently not even allow you to read with any comprehension what is written. I agree that we do not need to run above the speed limit unless it is necessary, and then only when it is on a road or area that is safe to do so. This I have already stated but you didn't want to see it, you wanted to spew your hate and discontent with LEOs. Yes, I do work for the taxpayers and my job is to protect and to serve all taxpayers. I do my job and I do it a whole lot better without interference from some of you who think you are our Supervisor. Big difference between Taxpayer and Supervisor.
Attitude? Yes it goes a long way with me. If you are a good citizen, rich or poor, and I stop you for something being polite makes things a lot simpler for both of us. If you are nice, I’m nice. If you have an attitude, well I can show you mine as much as I dislike to.
I’m sorry that someone taught you to dispise us and I’m sorry that some of you teach your children to do the same.
I have to say that many of you do respect and support what we do and try to move to the right so we may address a call. I know you understand what is at stake, After all it may be your family member we are trying to reach.
The original question of would I give another officer a ticket? I think this is what brought out the flames. I do understand why it brings out hard feelings. Professional Courtesy within reason is the usual answer to this question, However, I would not hesitate to bust any fellow officer for DUI or Felony Offense.
Oh yes, My partner did write his mother in law a speeding ticket the other day. It didn’t do him any good though. His wife paid it with his money. So much for that.
PROSOUTH
------------------
To swallow and follow, whether old doctrine or new propaganda, is a weakness still dominating the human mind. (C.P.Gillman)
"I also have to respond to Prosouth's message. I find evidence in it for all of my criticisms of police."
I figured you always had criticisms of Police
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
If you don't have an emergency, and you are driving 90 miles an hour in a 40 with your lights blaring, well you shouldn't be driving 90 in a 40 with your lights blaring. The worst part of this paragraph is "what gives you the right to judge what we do in the course of our serving you" hold on there buddy that is pretty crazy talk right there. I hope if you re-read that you will realize how crazy it sounds. Where did you become holier than thou?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Where did all this above come from? I didn't say any of what you state except the quote and I still stand by it? ” What gives you the right? “ You are the one that stated "I also have to respond to Prosouth's message. I find evidence in it for all of my criticisms of police." I see you too make an effort to dislike Police. It seems that you also think we should consult with you before we go over the limit or turn on the lights. Well it doesn't work that way my friend.
As far as making up my own policies, this is the policy. My job is to get from on crisis to another the best and safest way I can. I even said only on primary roads and not neighborhoods or secondary roads. I didn't say 90 or 100 mph, I said 15 or 20 mph and I also said that most wouldn't even notice as they are already going that fast themselves. 10-33 traffic is used when necessary. I never said that I didn’t use it. I only stated that it seems to be more dangerous because of public reaction to it. If the “Wildlife” isn’t disturbed they are a whole lot more stable.
"..so I won't turn on my lights and scare the wildlife." Pretty true statement, what would you suggest we do? I do know what the book says about lights and siren and it does say ” When Necessary ”. I also know what is necessary to get where I'm going safely as possible for me and the public. I suggest you find someone to ride with and experience the safe way to do things. You will see what I speak of real quick.
The double standard is in your mind and the mindset you have will apparently not even allow you to read with any comprehension what is written. I agree that we do not need to run above the speed limit unless it is necessary, and then only when it is on a road or area that is safe to do so. This I have already stated but you didn't want to see it, you wanted to spew your hate and discontent with LEOs. Yes, I do work for the taxpayers and my job is to protect and to serve all taxpayers. I do my job and I do it a whole lot better without interference from some of you who think you are our Supervisor. Big difference between Taxpayer and Supervisor.
Attitude? Yes it goes a long way with me. If you are a good citizen, rich or poor, and I stop you for something being polite makes things a lot simpler for both of us. If you are nice, I’m nice. If you have an attitude, well I can show you mine as much as I dislike to.
I’m sorry that someone taught you to dispise us and I’m sorry that some of you teach your children to do the same.
I have to say that many of you do respect and support what we do and try to move to the right so we may address a call. I know you understand what is at stake, After all it may be your family member we are trying to reach.
The original question of would I give another officer a ticket? I think this is what brought out the flames. I do understand why it brings out hard feelings. Professional Courtesy within reason is the usual answer to this question, However, I would not hesitate to bust any fellow officer for DUI or Felony Offense.
Oh yes, My partner did write his mother in law a speeding ticket the other day. It didn’t do him any good though. His wife paid it with his money. So much for that.
PROSOUTH
------------------
To swallow and follow, whether old doctrine or new propaganda, is a weakness still dominating the human mind. (C.P.Gillman)
There is an excellent paper written by Peter Kasler on the subject of police protection of individuals that some of you LEOs need to read at http://www.shadeslanding.com/firearms/kasler-protection.html
I think it helps to explain the anger people with a healthy streak of self-reliance feel towards LEOs. I for one am tired of hearing the "Protect and Serve" dictim from law enforcement because it illustrates what we as a people have become in this country - sheep.
You don't protect me and you sure as heII don't serve me. I grew up with LEOs, both my father and brother are retired now and they each represented one of the two reasons why I think people choose a career in law enforcement. One was for the great benefits, a good retirement and a chain of command structured like the military because you like being told when you can take a sh!t. The other reason is for a person who gets their rocks off from the adrenalin rush they can get by being a hero for putting their life on the line for the sheep in their flock. It's also a great job for the control freak. If one of the sheep causes a POP - well, you know how it works - you may not do the time, but you ain't gonna avoid the ride.
Oh yeah, and as far as tickets go - the uniform comes with a "get out of jail free" card, professional courtesy, and chicks who dig guys in a uniform.
I think it helps to explain the anger people with a healthy streak of self-reliance feel towards LEOs. I for one am tired of hearing the "Protect and Serve" dictim from law enforcement because it illustrates what we as a people have become in this country - sheep.
You don't protect me and you sure as heII don't serve me. I grew up with LEOs, both my father and brother are retired now and they each represented one of the two reasons why I think people choose a career in law enforcement. One was for the great benefits, a good retirement and a chain of command structured like the military because you like being told when you can take a sh!t. The other reason is for a person who gets their rocks off from the adrenalin rush they can get by being a hero for putting their life on the line for the sheep in their flock. It's also a great job for the control freak. If one of the sheep causes a POP - well, you know how it works - you may not do the time, but you ain't gonna avoid the ride.
Oh yeah, and as far as tickets go - the uniform comes with a "get out of jail free" card, professional courtesy, and chicks who dig guys in a uniform.
Here's a theory why some folks may drive erratically when LE vehicles are running their lights but not when FD/EMS vehicles run their lights. I was driving along on the interstate one rainy night on a stretch where there was a lane closed for repaving. The interstate was narrowed down to one lane, with traffic cones and whatnot. There was a disabled car pulled over, and a state patrol cruiser was parked behind it with his lights on. The state patrol has the new blue bar with strobe-type lights. Those friggin' lights completely blinded me as I passed the cruiser. Had there been someone on foot encroaching into my lane they would have been squashed like a bug. Now imagine driving at night and having a cruiser behind you turn its blues on; depending on your mirror situation, it could be rather blinding. Not hard to imagine drivers getting so distracted and/or blinded they don't respond well.
Plus, I believe FD/EMS vehicles are more predictable; LE vehicles sometimes do some fairly aggressive moves, so he may zig when I zig.
Plus, I believe FD/EMS vehicles are more predictable; LE vehicles sometimes do some fairly aggressive moves, so he may zig when I zig.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by NAD:
I grew up with LEOs, both my father and brother are retired now and they each represented one of the two reasons why I think people choose a career in law enforcement. One was for the great benefits, a good retirement and a chain of command structured like the military because you like being told when you can take a sh!t. The other reason is for a person who gets their rocks off from the adrenalin rush they can get by being a hero for putting their life on the line for the sheep in their flock. It's also a great job for the control freak. If one of the sheep causes a POP - well, you know how it works - you may not do the time, but you ain't gonna avoid the ride.
Oh yeah, and as far as tickets go - the uniform comes with a "get out of jail free" card, professional courtesy, and chicks who dig guys in a uniform. [/quote]
NAD-- You can't have it both ways, man. Either I joined the cops to be told what to do every second of my life, or I joined to be in control of what EVERONE else does every second they're around me.
Funny thing is, the command structure is really pretty "flat" in most departments. There's just too many possible situations that could occur to be told exactly what to do during ALL of them. Thus, cops are expected to be able to act independently, within policy.
I spend the better part of my shift trying to be responsive to the needs of my community. I'm married, so the chicks digging my uniform is kind of a moot issue. I haven't yet issued a POP ticket, nor even seen one issued. I know that it happens, and often; I just never seem to be there when it does.
Huh. I must be in it for the retirement benefits.
=============
As to warnings to cops-- I issue warnings to average Joes widely. Why would I not feel as likely to issue a warning to a cop under the same circumstances? On my watch, you're probably getting a warning if you're not over about 14 over. I have written warnings to civilians for up to 20 over. Discretion can be very effective in "Community Policing." The point is not to write tickets; it's to get people to slow down. Most cops are ashamed at getting stopped, and WILL actually slow down after another cop pulls them over and enjoins them to slow it down.
Would I write a cop? Oh, my heavens, but YES!
FYI: In Texas, the Traffic Code specifically allows for police vehicles to desregard any traffic law. Although it would be HIGHLY unethical to do so, I could legally patrol my city at 90 mph. Not a real good way to lead by example, huh?
Y'all play nice, now.
L.P.
I grew up with LEOs, both my father and brother are retired now and they each represented one of the two reasons why I think people choose a career in law enforcement. One was for the great benefits, a good retirement and a chain of command structured like the military because you like being told when you can take a sh!t. The other reason is for a person who gets their rocks off from the adrenalin rush they can get by being a hero for putting their life on the line for the sheep in their flock. It's also a great job for the control freak. If one of the sheep causes a POP - well, you know how it works - you may not do the time, but you ain't gonna avoid the ride.
Oh yeah, and as far as tickets go - the uniform comes with a "get out of jail free" card, professional courtesy, and chicks who dig guys in a uniform. [/quote]
NAD-- You can't have it both ways, man. Either I joined the cops to be told what to do every second of my life, or I joined to be in control of what EVERONE else does every second they're around me.
Funny thing is, the command structure is really pretty "flat" in most departments. There's just too many possible situations that could occur to be told exactly what to do during ALL of them. Thus, cops are expected to be able to act independently, within policy.
I spend the better part of my shift trying to be responsive to the needs of my community. I'm married, so the chicks digging my uniform is kind of a moot issue. I haven't yet issued a POP ticket, nor even seen one issued. I know that it happens, and often; I just never seem to be there when it does.
Huh. I must be in it for the retirement benefits.
=============
As to warnings to cops-- I issue warnings to average Joes widely. Why would I not feel as likely to issue a warning to a cop under the same circumstances? On my watch, you're probably getting a warning if you're not over about 14 over. I have written warnings to civilians for up to 20 over. Discretion can be very effective in "Community Policing." The point is not to write tickets; it's to get people to slow down. Most cops are ashamed at getting stopped, and WILL actually slow down after another cop pulls them over and enjoins them to slow it down.
Would I write a cop? Oh, my heavens, but YES!
FYI: In Texas, the Traffic Code specifically allows for police vehicles to desregard any traffic law. Although it would be HIGHLY unethical to do so, I could legally patrol my city at 90 mph. Not a real good way to lead by example, huh?
Y'all play nice, now.
L.P.
oberkommando
New member
Longpath would that include dirving on the wrong side of the interstate?
I've finally got to perk up and add my two cents.
Disclaimer: I have the upmost respect for officers.
[RANT]
That being said.. I have refused to respect an officer or two who as first failed to show me proper respect. Under these circumstances.. I was cited for NOTHING, but kept for an excruciating amount of time. I have since then learned my lesson.. but if the po-po wants to keep you there for whatever reason.. its there, you're gonna sit.
[/RANT]
I have recently aquired a speeding ticket while driving through rural Tennessee on my way to a mini-vacation in North Carolina. During this trip, I had my trusty radar detector. Well, as many times as it has "saved me" before.. it didn't this time. I was clocked going 82mph in 70. I accept the responsibility that I was speeding.. No matter how much I disagree with TSP's monitoring tactics.. Hiding behind bushes, trees and the backside of bridges will surely give a State Trooper better results, but if we're all gonna play "this game," I'd like to have every tool at my disposal.
To make the story short, I got a ticket (big surprise). I doubt it was the fact that I was speeding.. or driving a large SUV.. but that I had a radar detector. I have never had another opinion of a person that drives with a radar detector (including myself), than that they intend on breaking the speed limit. (duh) So I have hereby removed my radar detector (and continue to speed.. but slightly slower) in hopes that it will not automatically grant me a ticket if I am pulled over again.
To further my position on speeding.. Try driving 55mph through or around Atlanta sometime. You will experience one of two things.
1. Never arriving at your destination in a suitable amount of time.
2. Get killed by everyone else that disobeys such a low speed limit.
[FLAME ON]
------------------
God, Guns and Guts made this country a great country!
oberkommando sez:
"We lost the first and third and now they are after the Second!(no pun intended)"
[This message has been edited by KaMaKaZe (edited September 08, 2000).]
Disclaimer: I have the upmost respect for officers.
[RANT]
That being said.. I have refused to respect an officer or two who as first failed to show me proper respect. Under these circumstances.. I was cited for NOTHING, but kept for an excruciating amount of time. I have since then learned my lesson.. but if the po-po wants to keep you there for whatever reason.. its there, you're gonna sit.
[/RANT]
I have recently aquired a speeding ticket while driving through rural Tennessee on my way to a mini-vacation in North Carolina. During this trip, I had my trusty radar detector. Well, as many times as it has "saved me" before.. it didn't this time. I was clocked going 82mph in 70. I accept the responsibility that I was speeding.. No matter how much I disagree with TSP's monitoring tactics.. Hiding behind bushes, trees and the backside of bridges will surely give a State Trooper better results
, but if we're all gonna play "this game," I'd like to have every tool at my disposal.To make the story short, I got a ticket (big surprise). I doubt it was the fact that I was speeding.. or driving a large SUV.. but that I had a radar detector. I have never had another opinion of a person that drives with a radar detector (including myself), than that they intend on breaking the speed limit. (duh) So I have hereby removed my radar detector (and continue to speed.. but slightly slower) in hopes that it will not automatically grant me a ticket if I am pulled over again.
To further my position on speeding.. Try driving 55mph through or around Atlanta sometime. You will experience one of two things.
1. Never arriving at your destination in a suitable amount of time.
2. Get killed by everyone else that disobeys such a low speed limit.
[FLAME ON]
------------------
God, Guns and Guts made this country a great country!
oberkommando sez:
"We lost the first and third and now they are after the Second!(no pun intended)"
[This message has been edited by KaMaKaZe (edited September 08, 2000).]
Danger Dave
New member
Hey, I have a few points...
#1 - as a non-cop, I totally agree with what the officers say about the dangers of running with lights. In Georgia, the standard speed of travel is 10-15 mph above the speed limit on the highways. You have to be going crazy fast or generally being an idiot to get a ticket in most jurisdictions (there are exceptions) for doing less than 15 mph over the posted speed. As I understand it, to control the speed traps, only the State Patrol is allowed to write speeding tickets on the interstates for less than 10 mph above the limit. So basically, everyone is speeding at any given time, so they all think, "He's caught me!". When an officer turns on his lights, or just turns onto the roadway, the brake lights light up the highway like an overdecorated Christmas tree. Traffic slows down instantly, and all the gaps close, leaving nowhere to go to get out of the way (or just exit). It's dangerous to everyone, not just the officer.
#2 - From LEO's I know, there's a pretty wide set of rules about getting a ticket if you get pulled over. There's also a pretty wide range for us non-LEO's - it just depends on who pulls you over and where. I've been pulled over for nearly running an officer off the road (I was suffering from exhaustion, it was a sharp curve), doing 75 in a 45 zone, and a few others and not ticketed. I've also gotten tickets for lesser offenses, like 52 in a 45 zone, illegal U-turn (didn't see the sign, I turned out perpindicular to it), 51 in a 35 on a 5 lane road about 500 yds from a 45 zone (see #1 about the normal speeds in Ga.). It just depends on who pulls you over and who they work for (hint: Virginia is bad).
As far as being an LEO getting you out of a ticket or other trouble, I've seen that work both ways too - One LEO told me he was written a ticket by an officer who told him, "if anybody ought to know the law, you should." I've known an officer that was turned by another officer for abusing a suspect (in his defense, the suspect had fought with a female officer, grabbed her, and drove off with her hanging by her arm through the window - it happened to be the abusive officer's girlfriend). But generally, officers don't like writing tickets to anyone for minor stuff, and they try to avoid doing it to family, friends, fellow officers, EMT's, etc. That's just the way it works. One of the tickets I got out of, it turned out I went to high school with the officer - he knew me, he let me go.
#3 - Last but not least, I would like to point out something that was said to me by a now retired LEO - "the public isn't trained in what to do when they're pulled over - we are."
#1 - as a non-cop, I totally agree with what the officers say about the dangers of running with lights. In Georgia, the standard speed of travel is 10-15 mph above the speed limit on the highways. You have to be going crazy fast or generally being an idiot to get a ticket in most jurisdictions (there are exceptions) for doing less than 15 mph over the posted speed. As I understand it, to control the speed traps, only the State Patrol is allowed to write speeding tickets on the interstates for less than 10 mph above the limit. So basically, everyone is speeding at any given time, so they all think, "He's caught me!". When an officer turns on his lights, or just turns onto the roadway, the brake lights light up the highway like an overdecorated Christmas tree. Traffic slows down instantly, and all the gaps close, leaving nowhere to go to get out of the way (or just exit). It's dangerous to everyone, not just the officer.
#2 - From LEO's I know, there's a pretty wide set of rules about getting a ticket if you get pulled over. There's also a pretty wide range for us non-LEO's - it just depends on who pulls you over and where. I've been pulled over for nearly running an officer off the road (I was suffering from exhaustion, it was a sharp curve), doing 75 in a 45 zone, and a few others and not ticketed. I've also gotten tickets for lesser offenses, like 52 in a 45 zone, illegal U-turn (didn't see the sign, I turned out perpindicular to it), 51 in a 35 on a 5 lane road about 500 yds from a 45 zone (see #1 about the normal speeds in Ga.). It just depends on who pulls you over and who they work for (hint: Virginia is bad).
As far as being an LEO getting you out of a ticket or other trouble, I've seen that work both ways too - One LEO told me he was written a ticket by an officer who told him, "if anybody ought to know the law, you should." I've known an officer that was turned by another officer for abusing a suspect (in his defense, the suspect had fought with a female officer, grabbed her, and drove off with her hanging by her arm through the window - it happened to be the abusive officer's girlfriend). But generally, officers don't like writing tickets to anyone for minor stuff, and they try to avoid doing it to family, friends, fellow officers, EMT's, etc. That's just the way it works. One of the tickets I got out of, it turned out I went to high school with the officer - he knew me, he let me go.
#3 - Last but not least, I would like to point out something that was said to me by a now retired LEO - "the public isn't trained in what to do when they're pulled over - we are."
Every cop has a radar detector story, here's mine. It was a early Thursday morning, I was driving around the north part of the patrol area, waiting for the morning alarm calls to start, when I saw a Dodge Omni approaching in the distance at an incredible rate of speed. (30 mph residential zone) it was apparent that he was going to crest a hill in front of me, so I slowed down to watch. When he topped the hill, several things happened together. He saw me, I saw daylight under all four tires, and he hit the brakes while still airborne. When he touched down it was pure brake and smoke, with 157 feet of skidmarks. As I turned around on him, I saw him rip his radar detector off the dash, hurl it out the drivers window, jump out and stomp repeatedly upon it with both feet. His statements, (from the recommended 25 feet minimum distance) went something like; "*&^^%%$##@ Piece of SH$%!!!! It didn't even light up once!!! Didn't do a damn thing!" after calming him down, I explained to him that (1)I didn't have a radar unit on the vehicle. (2) I was not writing him for speed. (3) He really did need to clean up his mess from the roadway. I was also quite happy to call him a wrecker since his Omni transmission had locked into "Drive" and the car wouldn't start. Guess what I did write him for. Hint: it's mandatory court. Cost of this whole mess ran 272$ for the detector, 125$ for the tow, Heaven knows how much for the transmission repair, and somewhere in the vicinity of 1,000$ in fines, Which doubled since he didn't show up for court.