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Colt 1911 in .38 Super
- Thread starter MrBlonde
- Start date
The Government Model (1911 type) Colts chambered for the .38 Super are fairly accurate, although the .38 Super has not had the accuracy work done with it that the .38 Special and .45 ACP have.
The cartridge is semi-rimmed, though most ammo is loaded so that it can stop either on the rim or on the case mouth. The rim, though, gives some leeway in reloading, since the crimp is not critical as it is in cartridges that are supported on the case mouth.
When worked on the same way as target .45s, the guns are quite accurate.
One point, do not use .38 Super ammo or loading data for the old double link guns chambered for the .38 ACP. The latter is dimensionally identical to the .38 Super, but nowhere near as powerful and the .38 Super will destroy the old guns.
Jim
The cartridge is semi-rimmed, though most ammo is loaded so that it can stop either on the rim or on the case mouth. The rim, though, gives some leeway in reloading, since the crimp is not critical as it is in cartridges that are supported on the case mouth.
When worked on the same way as target .45s, the guns are quite accurate.
One point, do not use .38 Super ammo or loading data for the old double link guns chambered for the .38 ACP. The latter is dimensionally identical to the .38 Super, but nowhere near as powerful and the .38 Super will destroy the old guns.
Jim
I have a friend that has a nice Colt 1911 in .38 Super (I REALLY WANT THAT PISTOL!!! There, I feel better now.) that he replaced the barrel with one that headspaces on the case mouth and it is a tack driver. I really think most 1911's headspace on the extractor hook and breech face tho.
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Ne Conjuge Nobiscum
"If there be treachery, let there be jehad!"
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Ne Conjuge Nobiscum
"If there be treachery, let there be jehad!"
Most .38 supers made in the last 10 years or so headspace on the case mouth. Older models headspaced on the rim. The newer models are much better as far as accuracy is concerned. If you are buying a new pistol I would suggest you buy a 9X23. This cartride has the advantage on being rimless and is beefed up to handle higher pressures.
Don't know about the new ones, but I've owned 3 .38 Supers. Two Colt and one Sig Saur P 220. The Colts were great guns - but the ones I had were very sensitive to ammo. Basically FMJ. (I still have an upper end for .38 Super Colt and will probably try to find a good frame one of these days.)
The Sig 220 will feed anything I can find.
I really like the cartridge. I'd add to Mr. Keenan's comment about the .38 ACP - also you can'r use .38 ACP brass to reload for the .38 Super. It splits like mad.
If you have a .45 ACP you can get the top end for a .38 Super (with mags) and sometimes it'll work as a conversion kit. The ejector for the .38 Super is slightly different and sometimes (depending on the gun) the ejector for the .45 will work - sometimes not.
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Jim Fox
The Sig 220 will feed anything I can find.
I really like the cartridge. I'd add to Mr. Keenan's comment about the .38 ACP - also you can'r use .38 ACP brass to reload for the .38 Super. It splits like mad.
If you have a .45 ACP you can get the top end for a .38 Super (with mags) and sometimes it'll work as a conversion kit. The ejector for the .38 Super is slightly different and sometimes (depending on the gun) the ejector for the .45 will work - sometimes not.
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Jim Fox
Hi, guys,
I have not been keeping up with all developments in the .38 Super, but the ammo is still semi-rimmed even though it is not crimped and could support on the case mouth if the counterbore was deep enough.
Hi, Jim V.,
Someone started the silly idea that the .45 ACP "headspaces" on the extractor, and is even designed to do so. This is absurd. If forward motion of the round is stopped by the extractor rather than the case mouth seating against the barrel shoulder, headspace is very excessive and there will be problems.
I suggest simply removing the barrel and slide, looking at the lockup, and using a few cut down cases to put this idea to rest.
Jim
P.S. There is one case where this does happen and perhaps that is where the idea got started. If a .45 ACP cartridge is loaded into a barrel chambered for the .455 Webley Automatic (not the revolver) cartridge, it will be stopped by the extractor hook, because the .455 Webley Auto is semi-rimmed and there is no sharp shoulder in the chamber as there is in a .45ACP chamber.
JEK
I have not been keeping up with all developments in the .38 Super, but the ammo is still semi-rimmed even though it is not crimped and could support on the case mouth if the counterbore was deep enough.
Hi, Jim V.,
Someone started the silly idea that the .45 ACP "headspaces" on the extractor, and is even designed to do so. This is absurd. If forward motion of the round is stopped by the extractor rather than the case mouth seating against the barrel shoulder, headspace is very excessive and there will be problems.
I suggest simply removing the barrel and slide, looking at the lockup, and using a few cut down cases to put this idea to rest.
Jim
P.S. There is one case where this does happen and perhaps that is where the idea got started. If a .45 ACP cartridge is loaded into a barrel chambered for the .455 Webley Automatic (not the revolver) cartridge, it will be stopped by the extractor hook, because the .455 Webley Auto is semi-rimmed and there is no sharp shoulder in the chamber as there is in a .45ACP chamber.
JEK
This caliber is very interesting. But in the standard loads I have read in an old reloading manual the ballistics isn't impressively higher than the 9X19. I have a friend(it seems like we all have friends with guns in this caliber) who has a custom 1911 racegun with compensator that runs off a very light Wolff spring. He reloads for this piece and pushes a 125gr bullet at 1500fps!!
This is at 357 magnum levels and yet he says with the compensator the sights hardly move off the target! The only problem in buying it off him is that I already reload and shoot 4 calibers, so I'm reluctant to get into a 5th caliber.
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This is at 357 magnum levels and yet he says with the compensator the sights hardly move off the target! The only problem in buying it off him is that I already reload and shoot 4 calibers, so I'm reluctant to get into a 5th caliber.
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Ron Ankeny
New member
I have been toying around with the notion of getting a .38 Super or 9X23 as a fun gun for blasting plates and maybe for IDPA.
Tell me, how is the felt recoil of a .38 super or 9X23 (min. for IDPA) compared to the .45 ACP (also loaded to min. level for IDPA)? Assume identical pistols without porting or compensators.
Tell me, how is the felt recoil of a .38 super or 9X23 (min. for IDPA) compared to the .45 ACP (also loaded to min. level for IDPA)? Assume identical pistols without porting or compensators.