Cold barrel shots to different point of impact in M1A?

R

Ruben Nasser

New member
I have an annoying problem with my M1A: the first 4-6 shots from a cold barrel shoot to a different point of impact. On a typical series first shot goes about 4" high and 2" left, the second 3" high and 1" right (100 yards), and so on until gradually settling in the warm barrel zero. From that point it stays on zero and is very accurate (3 shots in less than 1"). It is a normal model M1A fitted with a Fulton laminated stock (no custom bedding), Spring. 3rd. Gen. mount and a Tasco SS10x42. I have checked everything and seems to be tight and in perfect condition. Have any of you ever experienced this kind of problem, and what can be done to solve it?
 
I had a similar problem with my 98 Mauser built gun. I had great sucess fire-lapping (with the NECO kit) my bore. It went from CCB shot 3" high 2" left to CCB dead center of group. The rifle now shoots about 1/2 minute of angle every time (unless I screw up). It's also easier to clean. I also noticed a difference in my FAL going from standard copper-jacket to Moly-coated. Try the moly first, then the fire-lapping---but BE CAREFUL AND FOLLOW INSTRUCTIONS!!!!
 
Not with my M14, but with my Garand. The M14 got the full match treatment fresh out of the box.

The first thing I try is getting the rifle "built" by an armorer who is familier with building the M14/M1A for match use. There are a LOT of little tricks in getting the M14 to shoot accurately.

My Garand "wandered" all over the paper, so I had it built (No new parts, just cleaned up and bedded) by the armorer who builds the rifles for out State Rifle Team. Now, @200 yds. it shoots a 7 @ 7 O"Clock the first shot out of a cold barrel. Then an 8 @ 7 O'Clock. Then a 9 @ 7 O'Clock. All the following shots will be 10s. We have concluded that there is some stress in the GI barrel which is effected by the temperature. My next step would be to get a decent match (Douglas probably) barrel.

Good luck with yours.

Yr. Obt. Svnt.

------------------
Fred J. Drumheller
NRA Life
NRA Golden Eagle
 
4 to 6 shots is a long way from a cold barrel. To me, going from a cold barrel to a working rig is 1 fouling shot.
Ruben, There is something going on in your M1A that is very good you will just have to find it. What you have going on now would not make me a happy camper. I would start with a good bedding job and go from there.
Good Luck in Your Quest!
 
Do you take the action out of the stock when cleaning it between range sessions? That's been known to result in group drift as non-bedded actions settle back into the wood.

I personally theorize about off-center pressure from the stock and roughness in the forward stock metal/barrel band "hook" interface. The barrel grows a tiny bit longer as it heats, and inconsistent fore-end pressure *may* cause group drift.

Then there's internal stresses in the barrel metal. According to reports, cryo-treatment can help that a lot.

When I had an M1A, the only group drift was straight up, only 1 MOA, and it took a few shots for that to start.
 
Thanks guys!! The M1A is a little tricky to bed for a beginner like me, as far as I can understand the barrel/action unit is pulled into the front stock ferrule, the trigger group providing the pulling force and locking rearwards, am I right? Is there a way you can free float the barrel with this setup, or is it always under traction between this two points? Maybe this barrel has some stresses that tend to move the POI too, but it is such a good shooter after warming up.
I've been postponing my subscription to Tactical Shooter (and Precision Shooting) for a long while now, maybe is time for me to get this two mags and some other literature, they seem oriented to the precision rifle aficionado, very different from the typical 100% commercial gun rags, what do you think?
Cheapo, thanks for your tip on cleaning, now I realize I was dissasembling my rifle way too often.
Another question, my gas cilinder plug is stuck in place, how can I take it apart? I do have the proper wrench, but I don't want to force it.
Sorry from the long post, but I live in Paraguay, south america, and this type of know-how is not available here, and I can't send it to the US to a good gunsmith.
Muchas gracias por todo!!
 
Bad news. Tactical shooter is shutting down and being redone as "The Accurate Rifle." Some of us are howling but they're losing money (should have marketed at military bases where it would have done well).

Back to the cold barrel shot, that's not unusual and that's why barrelmaker Boots Obermeyer prefers cyrogenically treated heavy fluted barrels. He feels the fluting helps cools the barrel faster and helps reduce the shifting of the point of impact as it warms.
 
If I rember right the FM on the M-14 rifle calls for 3 warmup shots before zeroing the rifle. If you want I will look again?
 
Alan and Catman: I know most rifles change the POI a little when cold and clean, but this POA change in my M1A is just too much. I guess a POA change of 1.5" max for the first one or two shots would be OK.
Probably the advice in the FM is a must for military rifles that could be abused and disassembled coutless times, with irregular bedding.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top