Close Call.....

D

Duxman

New member
Anybody ever had a situation where they ALMOST had to clear leather? Such an event occurred yesterday. Glad it was a non-event.

Driving home from a long day at work, and it being a cool night - I decided to roll down my windows and enjoy the evening....it was around 8:30 pm. Part of the road that I take turns into 1 lane where traffic has to merge, and then extends back into 2 lanes at a light.

While @ the light, I noticed through the right rearview mirror that a rather well built 6' plus man opened his car door and started walking towards me with his hands flailing, screaming obscene words.

For the 1st time in over 6 months of CC, I felt a real danger. Reached into glove compartment and put my pistol underneath my leg ready to draw if he reached into my car or opened the door. At the same time, I kept an open space in front of me so I could drive off if necessary, while looking around to make sure there was no accomplice sneaking up on the other side. :mad:

Fortunately, the individual must have been angry at some other driver as a car beside me made a quick right turn, and the angry man walked back to his car - still cursing. :eek:

Traffic light turned green and I drove home - still checking the rear to make sure car was not following me. Got home safe, and ate a steak dinner, knowing full well - that it was a great thing that nothing happened, but if something did - the ex-boy scout was prepared.

Thank you TFL for your tips on situational awareness, driving tactics, and most of all restraint.

Hope all your close calls went as well: Tell us about them. :D
 
Preclusion

Duxman, remember in Virginia you must do everything possible to avoid deadly force, as long as you can do it safely. That means that if you could have safely driven off, you should have. If you were boxed-in with no where to go, that would have been a different story. This is not a flame, but I wanted you to remember when you can use deadly force. Ability, opportunity, manifest and preclusion (in VA) must be present.

It seems from your post that you were aware of your surroundings. Thats good since you can avoid alot of confrontations that way.

Stay safe.
 
Nug,

At the same time, I kept an open space in front of me so I could drive off if necessary, while looking around to make sure there was no accomplice sneaking up on the other side.

(My first priority is safety - mine / SO / loved ones / friends) - hence read line in my post. Not looking for a fight.

At the same time - remember VA does not have a "forced" retreat law.
 
Do you habitually leave room, or did you when you thought something might be up? Good for you paying attention to what was going on around you.

I always try to leave a space to move in, even if it's not enough to go around. Figure that at least I can go back and forth if someone tried to open the door ar break a window, and if their vehicle was behind me, could crunch their car if needed to make room and cause a distraction in a worse case situation.

Try to never ever sit in neutral either. I'll take the extra wear on the clutch throwout bearing. Got about 180 K on the last one.
 
Duxman -

Great situational awareness and +1 for swivel-headedness to check for other possible threats. Another +1 for getting your weapon out of the glove compartment, but gotta give you a [COLOR=Red[SIZE=3]]-1[/SIZE][/COLOR] for having it there instead of on body. (OK, I'm reading into this that you do have a VA CHP & were leagally carrying concealed by having it in the glove compartment.)

Been there, done that & worn a few holes in the souvenier T-shirt. It sure is nice to know you got home OK.

Duxman, remember in Virginia you must do everything possible to avoid deadly force, as long as you can do it safely. That means that if you could have safely driven off, you should have. If you were boxed-in with no where to go, that would have been a different story. This is not a flame, but I wanted you to remember when you can use deadly force. Ability, opportunity, manifest and preclusion (in VA) must be present.
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Nug,

IANAL, do not play one on TV or radio, and did not stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night. That being said (meaning I could be wrong), I think you ought to check here: www.virginia1774.org/Page5.html

Virginia holds that you cannot instigate the affray and claim an affirmative defense of excusable homicide. There is nothing I can find that says you have to retreat. If you know more, please share the citation.

stay safe.

skidmark
 
M -

Yes I habitually leave room in front so I can peel off if necessary.

Skidmark-

I wear seatbelts in my car - and have yet to find a holster that I can draw from and be comfortable sitting in the car (sport bucket seats - body hugging) while not completely discamboobulating myself (when drawing).

The best alternative I came up with is carry in the glove box, as in a sports car - not much space in the middle between front and driver seats, nor is it feasable to mount a holster in the driver's side - no space.

When I am outside my car (and not at work - I carry on my person).

Yes - I have a VA CC permit. :D
 
About a year and a half ago I went to the local Wal-Mart with my then eight year old daughter. She had been saving her money for a Game Boy. We went straight to the locked display case and bought the toy, and left the store.

Once we were outside the doors and into the parking lot, I realized that we were being followed by two athletic men about 20 years of age. We had bought nothing but the Game Boy, and we were to far from the doors to turn and go back in without confronting these two people. I jigged left between the cars, and they did the same splitting up to effectively herd us. I jigged right and they followed using hand signals. My car was about a quarter of the way into the lot. I used my remote to unlock my car doors and told my little girl to get to it, get inside, and lock the doors. I did not know what these two wanted, but it was something.

My little girl, bless her, did as she was told. I took a shopping cart and jammed it between two cars and one of the young men. I spun to the other one, the apparent leader, and swept back my jacket to get my hand on my 1911. I do not know if they ever saw the gun. The leader was about 15 feet away when he immediately changed his mind. He turned and went the other way, as did his accomplice. Not a word was spoken. I didn't have a chance. Thier response was that quick. I did a 360 degree scan, and went to my car and drove away shaking. I got on the cellphone and reported the incident. An officer took the report at a nearby carwash, agreed that they definitely wanted something, and sent me on my way. I still did not know what they wanted. I could only give a vague description, a grey and yellow hoody, and two black guys. I was keying in on the movements, not the fashion statement they were making.

Once home, I turned on the Boob Tube, and there, on Judge Judy was two idiots arguing over a Game Boy like it was the Key to Solomon's Gold. Bingo. I then realized these ruffians wanted to steal a Game Boy, but they could not steal one out of the locked case. They had to wait until someone bought one, then jack them up outside the store. It was then, to, that I realized that they had followed me from the Electronics Department, waited in the Foyer for us to get past the cashier, then moved away from a video game to follow us outside. Strange that it did not register until I knew what they wanted.

Nothing ever came of the incident. My daughter stopped playing with the Game Boy about two weeks later. :rolleyes:
 
I do the same, leave distance between my car and the one in front of me, check out what I can or can't do, and firstly though, I bought an alarm that locks my doors as soon as I turn the key and they stay locked untill I turn off the car.

You mentioned that the guy may have "opened the door", that is why you should keep it locked.

You done good :). Since I now carry on me almost 24/7, I've gotten over the "cursing angry dude or dudette" that thinks that I've done something to them. 99.9999% of the time, they did it to me (cut me off, pulled out in front of me, almost ran me over on a 600lb motorcycle while they were driving a 2000lb+ automobile).

And when I get I cut off, almost run over, etc.., as long as it didn't cause an accident my moment of anger is just that, a moment.

The most scary thing of XB's post is that the bg's may not have been going just after the game boy. With all the crap that has been happening with more and more devients stealing, raping, and killing children, they may well have had that in mind. Which just proves why a father, of a girl or boy, should be very well armed.

Glad everything worked out for both of you.

Wayne
 
I wear seatbelts in my car - and have yet to find a holster that I can draw from and be comfortable sitting in the car (sport bucket seats - body hugging) while not completely discamboobulating myself (when drawing).
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There are shoulder rigs, or a clip-on crossdraw holsters that may work for you as a car-only setup. You may also look at the Wilderness Safe-Packer www.thewilderness.com as a hook-to-the-seatbelt rig.

All that fancy spending of your money being said, I admit up-front that there are a lot of times that my CCW is placed in the center console with the lid kept up. (My console lid goes backwards into the rear seat area & since all there ever is there is junk - I am NOT a neat freak, OK? - it does not get in anybody's way.)

Main point is, you were prepared and mindful. That is always +2.

stay safe.

skidmark
 
The most scary thing of XB's post is that the bg's may not have been going just after the game boy. With all the crap that has been happening with more and more devients stealing, raping, and killing children, they may well have had that in mind. Which just proves why a father, of a girl or boy, should be very well armed.
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At the time, USP, that is what I thought. Worst possible scenerio. If we had not been so near the car, and if she had not of had a straight shot to it, I never would have let her go. Perhaps I would have told her to get under a car or truck, I don't know. That is why I was ready to clear leather though. I was dead certain these guys were not security, and dead certain they were actively herding us.

Would I have killed over a Game Boy or my wallet? No way. Would I have killed over my daughter? Without hesitation. I am glad they turned. It was everyone's lucky day.
 
Uh.... guys i must say that im happy to live in Norway. Its a safe country where nuthin much ever happens. I still take my precautions though. Mace (teargas), maglite, knife and a bat in the car within easy reach.
 
Uhh, Mikkel?

According to this page: http://www.nationmaster.com/country/no/Crime

You had in 2000:

14,727 assaults (3.23 per thousand),
49 murders (0.01 per thousand),
555 rapes (0.12 per thousand), and
1,781 robberies (0.39 per thousand),

...for a total of 17,112 violent crimes in 2000, for a total violent crime rate of 3.75 per thousand.

By comparison, in Vermont, where no license of any kind is needed to carry a defensive firearm openly or concealed, the total violent crime rate in 2000 was 1.14 per thousand: http://www.disastercenter.com/crime/vtcrime.htm

In New Hampshire, where a license is issued upon a clear background check by the police, costs $10 for four years, and where open carry of defensive firearms is legal, the 2000 violent crime rate was 1.75 per thousand.

Even in Virginia, which is right next door to crime-infested, guns-banned DC but which has shall-issue concealed carry and open carry (which is mandatory in some situations), the violent crime rate is lower than Norway, at 2.82 per thousand.

So a US state without any gun control at all is over three times safer than Norway, and the more gun control which gets imposed, the closer to Norway's level of crime danger a state gets.

People usually make the mistake of comparing foreign countries to the overall US crime rate, even though the top 8 urban areas with the strictest gun control account for over half of the violent crime in the entire country.
 
I still find it a safe country to live in and much safer than the US no matter what the statistics from 2000 says. But yes there is crime in Norway if you go the wrong places like anywhere else. But to get yerself involved in it or a victim of crime. Then u really got to work hard.
 
Good job Dux

Dux, I drive 78 miles one way most every day to work. I've found a fanny pack holster to be great for driving. It nestles in my lap, where it's simple to reach, and if you ever do have to bail out of your car for some reason, it's with you. The one I've got I just put my regular belt holster in the velcro tie down strap, and I've got it with me too if I need that.
 
Hold on.

Mikkel, are you saying that the victimization rate in your country is wrong because one willifully becomes a victim?

I can't agree with you on that at all.
When I get home I will grab some stats for you.
 
Mikkel, the same is true in the US - if you go to DC, Chicago, San Francisco or any other place in the US where defensive guns are effectively banned, you'll be a lot less safe than other places in the US where the right to armed self-defense is recognized and protected.

Have you ever visited Vermont or New Hampshire? Next time you're in the States, you should be sure to stop by for a visit. My wife and I would be happy to put you up.
 
XB - glad things turned out just as well for you. Best of all possible outcomes.

Skid and Cajun - good suggestions guys: I am doing some research into all the new options you have shown me. One of my main concerns is whichever I go with - I will have multi-uses for. Otherwise if it is specifically just for one purpose - I probably will use it for a month and then go back to old habits - the glove compartment. Thanks very much.

Mikkel - Dont want to go too far off topic here - but I have friends in nearby Sweden (also strict gun controls) and similar culture to Norway. They have felt that the crime has been rising in the recent years because the average civilian cannot arm themselves.

As per your post - you carry several weapons (non-firearm) within easy reach - if Norway were completely safe - you would not need such items. :D
 
Agreed, but maybe im a bit paranoid? I like to be prepared for the things im not supposed to be prepared for if u know what i mean...... its getting worse but still i find it safe in this country. Then again, we only hear about the bad things going on in the US. If i ever go to Vermont or some other place in the US ill check u out, and this goes for u as well. If u ever want to take a trip to see the fjords and maybe do some hunting, ill set u up.
 
Dux

Had almost the exact same thing happen to me and my wife while in my van a week ago today. It was raining hard and as I pulled up to the line of traffic stopped for the red light, I noticed a rather large man - about 6'4" and around 220, wearing a hooded sweatshirt and with his hands thrust into the pockets of the sweats - walking slowly down the line of traffic looking into the driver's window of each vehicle. Something about the way he was acting set all my alarms off, and even my wife - who normally pays little attention to such things - told me to be sure my door was locked. I reached into the console and pulled out my Bersa and rested it in my lap. Just as I did this, I saw the guy lock eyes on me and he skipped two cars and walked directly toward us. He had to have seen me reach into the console, and when I kept eye contact as he approached, he slowed considerably and stopped about 3 feet away from my door and said something. With my window closed, I could not understand him, so I rolled the window down, with my right hand on the gun. He glanced down as if trying to see what I had, but the height of my door prevented that. So he mumbled something again, I said "Sorry, I couldn't understand you, what did you need?" and he finally said "do you have any spare change?" I answered (truthfully) that I did not, having just given the last of my cash to my daughter to go out with her friends for the evening. He hesitated, hands still in pockets of his pullover, glanced down again trying to see what I was holding, then turned abruptly and walked away across the road. The light changed and we went on.

Did he really just want change? I honestly don't know. But he set every hair on my neck on end. Something about him just screamed "trouble", and he behaved very strangely. I travel thru this intersection several times every day, and it is not an area for panhandlers, and I have never seen anyone attempting to get handouts there. The fact that my trusting wife was instantly on edge added to my concern.

Suffice to say, I was very glad the Bersa was handy. Obviously, I think you did very well.
 
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