Chinese SKS - Can't get my zero!?

G

Gregory Gauvin

New member
I feel really stupid even asking/posting this. This has in some form been asked time and time again. And I'm an experienced competition shooter. But here we go.

I took my Chinese SKS out today for the first time to dial it in and just have a range day...firing Wolf 122gr steel cased ammo. Letting them fling around and not worrying about having to pick up my beloved brass to reload. Advertised vel. I believe 2396ft/sec, give or take. Shouldn't matter too much here everything was done within 100 yards.

So, I know the SKS sights are designed for meters...but, I shoot 100 yards, I figure, 100m equals 109 yards so it shouldn't make too much of a significant difference dialing in a 100 yard zero with the rear sight set to the 100m notch.

I know lots of guys like to zero out for a battle zero, and use the "Combat" notch or "ladder" notch (fully rear) - whatever you'd like to call it, it should be the same as the 300m notch anyhow. I just wanted notch 1 (100m) to shoot 100 yards for me.

So...I decided to walk the rifle out to 100 yards, starting at 50 yards. I put the rear sight at the 100m notch. I was shooting low. Perhaps 6" low - and right. Anyhow...just ordered the front sight tool...because I knew my windage would be off and had brought a brass punch and hammer to find out that even a really good wack wouldn't move it. Well...save that for another day.

I figured to hit 100 yards I need to be probably pretty close at 50yards, so, I cranked the front sight down 1 full turn. Come to find out it bottomed out. Still was shooting low. So, I moved the rear sight to the 200m notch. Now we were doing alright. Gun shoots decent groups.

Moved out to 100 yards. Now my mentality was saying, OK, the front sight is higher than the bore, by, I dunno, 1.5" or whatever it is, so, I should expect to hit a bit low at 50 from POA to get POA/POI at 100yards (thinking ARs here). But then again this russian nonsense...with the rear leaf sitting lower than the front sight...perhaps a 100 yards zero would shoot a nibble high at 50 yards. No matter...I just wanted a 100 yards zero when rear sight was on 100m marking.

Well...bullets are hitting elevation wise at 100y pretty much where I need them to be (minus my windage, until I get the tool)...except, I have to keep the rear leaf at the 200m mark. If I try to zero 100yards on the 100m mark, shoots low...and I have no more adjustment of my front sight.

So two questions - before somebody says to go get a file. If I'm way low at 100 yards on the 100m marking...what kind of system is this? 9yard difference...the whole shebang ain't right. I never plan to shoot 200 yards or past 100 yards with a 7.62x39..., I know all other sight notches wouldn't work for me....just wanted Notch 1 to hit at 100 yards. And makes me wonder why. I'm shooting a 6'oclock hold, not POA/POI. So I'm puzzled. If I even wanted to sight it for a 300m zero, it would have to be low. What's going on.

Question two - Supposing Notch 1 (100m) I had dead on at 100 yards. At 50 yards, would I be hitting low or high?

I most likely am going to attain my 100 yard zero by putting the rear leaf all the way back to the battle sight position (obviously would shoot high at 100y then)...and start to raise my front sight post.

I like to keep all my rifles zeroed at 100yards. Guys who battle sight their rifles at 25m and have a 0-2" bullet rise fall between point blank and 300m...fine. Not my style. My mind says with a rifle sighted at 100yards, if you can't hit a Human Target within that range you suck. And past 100 yards know your hold over. Shouldn't be THAT off to miss a human target unless you're firing a rainbow 45-70.
 
Zeroed at 100 yds (or meters), at 50 yds you should be just slightly low, maybe 1/2"-3/4". So yes, you need to shorten up the front sight blade (that answers both of your questions).
 
Soviets

Seems like I read somewhere in an AK periodical, that the Soviet way to zero an SKS and an AK was to set the battle sight, then adjust the front sight till point of aim equates point of impact at 25M. At that point, the notches are "close enough" and comrades should not complain. The typical logic, applies to the battle sight 0-300M or something for a standing advesary. I suspect the same logic is applied for the notches, 2-3 CM difference betweedn POA and POI should not matter on a standing opponent, and comrade should be happy.

But I am of the mind set that 100M should be 100M, and having the rear at 200M to hit at 100 would bug me. So I get what you are trying to do. I want my woods rifle if set at 100, to be on at 100.

You might try another brand of ammo, perhaps it could make up some elevation and reduce the amout of filing you'll have to do
 
You might try another brand of ammo, perhaps it could make up some elevation and reduce the amout of filing you'll have to do.
Click to expand...

I was gonna say this, too. Are you dead set on sticking with this ammo? You may find something a little faster that would shoot higher. http://www.recoilweb.com/7-62x39-ammo-test-101531.html

If you're gonna modify the front sight post, I'd personally unscrew it/remove it completely and file some off from the bottom side. This way you can screw it in deeper (giggity), but it will hide the file marks and won't make the top look even more stubby in yer sight picture. In fact, I'm mighty tempted to chuck it in a drill and file/turn the top of the post thinner, because it's pretty thick as it is.
 
I'll not address the SKS (not a fan of it or the AK), but to Meter VS. Yards.

Since I don't shoot the 7.62X39 I'll use my Carbine. 110 RN Bullet, w/mv of 1900 fps.

With a 100 yard Zero, its dead on. A 100 yards is about 91.44 yards, or 100 meters is 109.36 yards.

I used 110 cause that as close as I can get on my ballistic calculator.

There .6 inches difference between yards and meters. The 122gr 7.62X39 is a bit faster so if anything the difference should be less then the .6 inches.

From what I know about these rifles ( and I use to instruct in their use) with the group you are gonna get with iron sights you wont be able to tell whether you're shooting at 100 yards or 100 meters.

I do shoot the Mosin. And as a CMP MI I help people set them up for the CMP Vintage rifle matches. I have know idea what type of common core math the Russians use to set up their sights, but I know on the Mosin, I can disregard the commie system, zero the rifle at 100 yards and the Mosin sight is set on the 100 mark, then move the sight to 200 or 300 or what ever, its on.

On my 223 55 gr loads the difference between yards and meters is only .1 inches so I don't loose a lot of sleep at short distances between the two.

You're not going to get the groups with the SKS. But if one shoots wash tube size groups, you can still zero the rifle.

Forget the meter vs yards. Set up a LARGE target at 100 yards. Shoot 20 rounds. Draw a line through the target from 12 to 6 and then 3 to 9 o'clock.

You'll end up with 4 quarters. Count the number of hits in each quarter. Then adjust your sights according to those numbers. Keep doing this until you get an equal number of hits per quarter, then you're rifle is sighted in at 100 yards.

After that load some quality ammo and start working on shrinking those groups.
 
Wolf 123 grain(there's a 125 too) steel cased ammo is low end, um, refuse. It's velocity varies according to which Wolf brand it is. 2362 or 2410 fps. Your rifle appears to dislike it. It grouping at all?
I'd forget the metrics and just sight in about 3.5" high at 100. Hornady's 123 runs 2350 fps MV. It drops like a brick past 200 with the 3.5" high sight in.
Mind you, no SKS was ever made for accuracy. They were made to be issued to illiterate conscripts, who could be taught to use 'em as fast as possible.
The whole issue is likely nothing to do with the sights(except how bad they are) and is more likely just the rifle itself.
 
I made a mistake. I was firing TULA brand ammo. 122gr HP. 2330ft/sec. I bought a 640 can of this, back in 2014. So...I have quite a bit to burn up.

I'm fully aware of the SKS's "accuracy". I fire at a 6" or 6.25" black circle at 100 yards. I'm content with keeping them all in that 6" circle. This gun and ammo appears to be able to do it, if I do my part. 6" at 100 yards is nearly a head shot, definitely "combat accurate".

I'll play around with it...I'll get it there...Thanks. +1 on filing the front sight from the bottom if needed.
 
I'm sorry but anything made in China is pure garbage. I'm not surprised at your issue and would suggest trading that piece of "stuff" in on an American made piece of pride and joy.
 
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