China Prepares U.S. War Scenarios

glockguy45

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By JOHN LEICESTER, Associated Press Writer

BEIJING (AP) - In word and deed - namely its biggest military show in 35 years - China has made clear that it views the United States as potential enemy No.1.

Besides blowing up targets, test-firing missiles and driving tanks, the military displays at four land and sea sites in northern China in the middle of this month proved new capabilities to attack stealth warplanes and cruise missiles, state media reported.

Meanwhile, a Chinese defense policy paper issued last Monday once again raised threats of force against Taiwan and pointed to the United States as chief troublemaker.

Should Beijing's communist leaders order the People's Liberation Army to recover the island that split from China 51 years ago, Chinese generals are planning against expected U.S. military intervention.

``Do they prepare against the United States? My answer is very clear: yes,'' said Yan Xuetong, an expert in international security at Beijing's prestigious Tsinghua University.

Yan believes war with Taiwan is inevitable. Others are less pessimistic. In a report Thursday, the London-based International Institute for Strategic Studies said China is preoccupied this year with domestic issues, among them preparing to enter the World Trade Organization (news - web sites). It forecast only ``a remote possibility'' of confrontation over Taiwan.

Moreover, China-U.S. relations have improved this year and their militaries have expanded contact through reciprocal ship visits and trips by Chinese officers to the United States.

Beijing itself says it wants to peacefully recover Taiwan through negotiations - a goal repeated in the defense policy paper.

But talks are stalemated, and the paper said the situation ``is complicated and grim.'' It reiterated that China would ``adopt all drastic measures possible, including the use of force'' if Taiwan formally splits from China or continues indefinitely to refuse to negotiate unification.

China's generals have to assume an attack on democratic, capitalist Taiwan might provoke an American military response. That is why they are preparing for the worst.

Chinese fears were sharpened by NATO (news - web sites)'s air war on Yugoslavia last year to protect ethnic Albanians in Kosovo. Beijing saw unsettling parallels with its own restive minority regions, like Tibet, and felt NATO's intervention on human rights grounds set a dangerous precedent for meddling over Taiwan.

The scenario seems highly dubious right now. Unlike Yugoslavia, such a conflict could at worst go nuclear, and even if it didn't, it could wipe out U.S.-China trade worth nearly $95 billion last year, according to U.S. figures, and trigger global economic catastrophe.

Still, Chinese suspicions have been heightened by Washington's efforts to develop anti-missile shields, by congressional attempts to expand military ties with Taiwan, and by continued U.S. arms sales to the island. Yan said the Pentagon (news - web sites) was moving more submarines to the Pacific and stockpiling cruise missiles on the Pacific island of Guam.

What should China's leaders conclude from that? ``That the U.S. military has prepared for war against China,'' Yan insisted.

The Chinese defense paper was peppered with criticisms of the United States, among them that U.S. support has emboldened Taiwan's anti-China camp.

With prospects for a peaceful unification of Taiwan and China ``seriously imperiled'' and because of ``hegemonism and power politics'' - Beijing's code words for U.S. meddling - ``China will have to enhance its capability to defend its sovereignty and security by military means,'' said the paper.

But it also sought to allay foreign concerns by saying the military buildup was ``purely for self-defense,'' and that this year's defense budget of $14.6 billion is just 5 percent of Washington's. Overseas analysts, however, believe China spends up to five times more than it says it does.

The Gulf War shocked Beijing by exposing its technological inferiority. It has since focused attention on the importance of air power in modern wars. Military experts say Chinese generals have studied how Yugoslav forces hid equipment from NATO attacks, have installed Russian-made surface-to-air missiles on the coast opposite Taiwan, and have improved air defenses around big cities.

But analysts say the Chinese military would be hard-pressed to take Taiwan, and lags far behind the United States.

``The gap is enormous. They're just not in the same league,'' said Robert Karniol, Asia-Pacific editor for Jane's Defense Weekly.
 
"complicated and grim"?!?!? No doubt, Mr API writer dufus. Somebody blew a Chinese emabassy half way to Pluto over in Kosavo! Gee, thanks Bill and NATO! Sheeshe! Every time Clinton farts, the media points at the US citizens and makes a foul face like WE did it!
 
Originally posted by glockguy45:

``Do they prepare against the United States? My answer is very clear: yes,'' said Yan Xuetong, an expert in international security at Beijing's prestigious Tsinghua University.
Well they sure aren't preparing against Sweden.

Moreover, China-U.S. relations have improved this year and their militaries have expanded contact through reciprocal ship visits and trips by Chinese officers to the United States.
Improved due to lavish contributions to the DNC in exchange for some old hard drives we weren't using. "Chinese officers"? Shouldn't that read "Chinese intelligence officers"?

defense budget of $14.6 billion is just 5 percent of Washington's. Overseas analysts, however, believe China spends up to five times more than it says it does.
Like 45 years of the Cold War taught nobody the utter pointlessness of trying to compare the dollar value of the defense budgets of a free-market Western nation with that of a command-economy concentration camp with currency worth somewhere between imaginary diddly and hypothetical squat. 14.6 billion what? Chickens? Fetid dingo's kidneys? Grams of powdered black market white rhino horn?

The Gulf War shocked Beijing by exposing its technological inferiority.
They had previously assumed their vast superiority in Shower Flip-Flop and Whoopie-Cushion manufacturing rendered them invulnerable...

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"..but never ever Fear. Fear is for the enemy. Fear and Bullets."
10mm: It's not the size of the Dawg in the fight, it's the size of the fight in the dog!

[This message has been edited by Tamara (edited October 29, 2000).]

[Edited by Tamara on 02-27-2001 at 01:09 AM]
 
Really though, the US has done some truly asinine things to make the already neurotic Chinese Communist regime even more paranoid:

(1) Link MFN trading status to human rights improvement. The CCP is barely able to hold onto social order as it is; it requires a police/informant infrastructure of stalinesque proportions as it is. It has to deliver on the $$$ to the people or it has no legitimacy. Holding hostage the economic welfare of over a billion people is something a Congress that barely values the rights of 250 million Americans is an act of stupitity it is very capable of sinking to.

(2) Maintain forward bases in Japan and South Korea, without including the Chicoms in the "peace" process regarding North Korea, or in regular regional security talks. Historically China has experienced its severest invasions from the north (barbarian tribes) and the northeast (Japanese.) Asians tend to have a keen sense of historical wrong (think generations of parents passing on grudges) and the Chinese in particular still regard the Korean War as a pre-empted invasion of China. MacArthur threatening to use atomics on the Chinese mainland didn't help matters any.

(3) The "accidental" bombing of the Chinese Embassy in Yugoslavia. Asides from killing the 2 Xinhua news agency reporters (read: intelligence officers) the timing was truly awful. Pakistan's concurrent nuclear ascendance was most certainly thanks to Chinese aid, which Washington has quietly tolerated for years due to Pakistan's role as a staging area for mujahedeen guerillas during the Afghan War. The Chicoms now see any foreign policy venture as eventually leading to a military incident.

And please don't underestimate the ability of the Chinese to receive punishment and mete it out. They have the manpower to prosecute a war for centuries if necessary, barring NBC use. They survived a Japanese invasion during the Second World War that arguably was more brutal than even the Nazi invasion of the Soviet Union. With light infantry they fought the US to a standstill during the Korean War. Asian nations tend to shrug off casualties and are willing to endure them in order to attain a goal. Witness the Vietnam War, for instance.

As for the Gulf War, the Chicoms had believed up to that point their incremental hardware upgrades had given them some semblance of parity. They didn't realize back then the importance of C3I but they do now. In a war of maneuver, the Chicoms won't attain anywhere near the objectives they want. In a war of attrition, they have the will and manpower to make it last for centuries. A military victory over China will be one barely worth having. Cross fingers and hope some restraint enters the picture.
 
In times of crisis, a bogeyman is needed to rally the nation as a distraction. With the crackdown on qigong (sp?) adherents in Peking, why not have the US take the role of the bogeyman?

Besides, they know we don't have the offensive capability (look how Clinton gutted the armed forces) or the troops anyway.
 
Chinese communist doctrine is all about bogeymans and external threats. The *Center of the World* siege mentality doesn't contribute much to rational perception. Heck, I'm mostly ethnic Chinese myself, I know this firsthand.

Falun Gong disciples = qigong adherents. Not really; that was started by this scam artist called Li Hongwei and is a cross between Jeohvah's witnesses and the Jim Jones cult. It IS a social menace, and the only reason it's spread so far is that the Chicoms have ensured by annhilating all traditional social structures that there is a moral vacuum in their own society that lets filth like this spread.

I wouldn't go so far as to say the Armed Forces are gutted. Granted, enlistment is down and retention is terrible. But in a pinch the US has raised great armies in WW1 and 2. This of course goes to show how important RKBA is ... citizen soldiers are what count in a major war.

Besides, you don't need all that much capability anyways. Chicoms have negligible strategic lift and one parachute division. Sink all their ships, place a lot of Patriot systems in Taiwan, and shoot down everything that flies. Not too hard against Mig-21s. Ground combat is where it's really difficult ... the Taiwanese can deal with what's left.

Besides, America will outlast Clinton. It's outlasted worse before. I don't especially like Bush, but Gore is a million times worse. I'm glad Cheney is on the ticket. Can't wait til Hillary bites the dust too.
 
They don't have to fight us when they can buy our President. Now, to complete the terms of the sale, Bill should go to China in 2001 and stay there.
 
Both China, and the US need "enemies" to keep up the "Military". Without enemies. that are "threatening" the US it would be hard for the Military to get the money they want.

So all this really boils down to is saber rattling, no one wants a war, but they want to put up a good front! With-out all this the military has nothing to do at all :)

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Dead [Black Ops]
 
I just returned from a three week trip to China. In seven of the eight cities I visited (Hongkong was the exception) I saw many signs and banners in English and Chinese saying "Taiwan is ours" and "Taiwan in 2000"
Every Chinese I spoke to about the signs said "Taiwan is ours and we are going to get it back." If China decides to attack Taiwan the goverenment would have wide spread popular support.
 
**** China.
Favored Nation Trade Status... and they are doing "Vs USA" wargames.
Screw them.

We can just as easily import crappy junk form Mexico as we can form China.
 
I told you so. :rolleyes:

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WARNING: This post may be another "self-aggrandizing attempt to cause needless controversy, argument, distraction"
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Keepin' the FUD Legacy Alive! Check us out @ FUD's Fan Club!
 
No sane CINC would seriously conemplate invading a territory as vast as mainland China, but the beauty is that we don't need to do that if the Chinese get frisky. If the Chinese decide to invade taiwan, they will get a mauling that will make the Gulf War look like a roughly evenly-matched contest. They have a few million AK-47 toting guys in camouflaged pajamas, so what? They can't swim to Taiwan, and their Navy is not even in the same league with the Argentine Coast Guard. They don't have the transport capability to shuttle all their armored divisions unharmed across the Taiwan Strait. They have a boomer, but the thing is so noisy that American skippers have to track it with the Gertrude underwater phone instead of the sonar so as not to blow speaker circuits on the console for the towed array. I give the Chicom boomer about five minutes once hostilities erupt.

If they start lobbing long-range ICBMs, they'll get a quick reminder that the US invented that game; and that a head count of a billion isn't all that much when you're playing dice with thermonuclear warheads.

Who else are they going to invade, if not Taiwan? Russia, maybe? Good luck trying to get an offensive through Siberia...even uncontested they'll be on the road for a few weeks until they reach any significant settlements. Plus, I think that the Russians wouldn't really like a million Chinese pouring across their Far East border without passports or valid visas.

The only thing that makes the Chinese even remotely worthy of concern is their nuclear capability, and they are hopelessly outclassed in that field, even by the Frogs. They could make a move for Taiwan or the Spratley Islands, but their Navy isn't up to snuff for going toe-to-toe with the U.S. Navy. They have resources, and a lot of riflemen, but they are not the same threat that Japan was back in 1941.

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"He who joyfully marches to music in rank and file has already earned my contempt. He has been given a large brain by mistake, since for him the spinal cord would fully suffice." -- Albert Einstein
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Glock/Benelli/Enfield -- the all-purpose threat management system.
 
Sounds like the start of another Cold War... Good. People have forgotten what is is like to be afraid every night, wondering if the scenarios from "The Day After" will play out in their neighborhoods. It took a man like Ronald Reagan to slap down the Communist Biaches. I don't think a man like Buddhist Al (gore) can deal with this properly... Do you? What we need a REAL MAN. "Like Who" you ask? Well, I am glad you asked. Like Mr. T of course! What is Al gonna do? Offer them more Nuclear Secrets? Maybe he will try to be all diplomatic or something and get some more campaign contributions. Screw those Reds. We can get Mexico to make those Barbie Dolls. At least we know our neighbor to the south ain't gonna push the button

It's not the size of your bullet, it's how you use it.

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w i l http://geekswithguns.com

[This message has been edited by GeekWithGun (edited October 31, 2000).]
 
lendringer is right. No way the Communists are going to win. No Chicom offensive is going to last more than several months at best - even that at the cost of bankruptcy. They're not dumb enough to use nukes though - and please, even a limited strike on China is going to wreck the planet. The thought of a dozen Chernobyls drifting across the Pacific is not very pleasant.

The problem with China is in making sure that they don't pull any BS ever again if they do resort to hostilities. This means going in and removing the Chicoms. All of them. It's not like the Gulf War where you can leave Saddam Hussein alone and contain him with a couple of no-fly zones that basically serve to keep a few fliers in Incilrik AFB sharp and employed.

It took the Japanese two nukes and several years of casualties before they became reasonable. Think of what it'll take to subdue the Chinese mainland. Bloody nose is it.

As for Mexico, please. Not all the trade can be shifted there until (1) the Mexican interstate banditry problem is solved on the trains and highways, and (2) Vicente Fox keeps his committment to cleaning up the Mexican government. The Chinese control graft levels through gunpoint - which is why US companies don't get gouged indiscriminately. Mexico is still way too messed up in terms of poverty, education, drug inflow, infrastructure breakdown.

But hey, enough of that. I'm all for a president who won't accomodate tyranny, knows what a cigar is really for, and doesn't use state troopers as a pimping service. That president certainly isn't the pathological liar with the brain-stutter who's the current veep. If Bush doesn't show backbone and slap down the Chicoms - who all along are very Hitleresque, they respect only STRENGTH - then this country's screwed. Who else is there, Nader? *shudder*
 
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