bullfrog99
New member
are either the hk-91 or fal copies that are floating around for around 500 to 600 something worth looking at? if so what models? I am looking for somthing with a little more punch than my ar-15.
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cheap hk-91 and fal copies
- Thread starter bullfrog99
- Start date
Destructo6
New member
Inexpensive FAL clones that are built on the Imbel receiver are worth a look. If the barrel is pretty good, it would be worth it even if it needed some minor rework.
Cheap HK style rifles are a real crapshoot. Interport HK's (~$1200) are pretty good and are built on licensed HK receivers (FMP of Portugal). The CETME clones built on the Century cast stainless receiver, which was sold to them by SW, is pretty good also, but you have the CETME accessory incompatibility issue and the front sight is often canted.
Cheap HK style rifles are a real crapshoot. Interport HK's (~$1200) are pretty good and are built on licensed HK receivers (FMP of Portugal). The CETME clones built on the Century cast stainless receiver, which was sold to them by SW, is pretty good also, but you have the CETME accessory incompatibility issue and the front sight is often canted.
I can't speak to the reliability of the HK-91 clones, but I have handled a few FAL clones. As you will no doubt read from others, the Century FALs are a crap shoot. They sometimes come with a Brazilian Imbel receiver (primo) and decent original parts sets. However, they are often poorly assembled, contain second-rate American parts, and don't shoot worth a darn. I've shot three, and two of them were terribly unreliable.
If you do go the cheapo route and find problems, there are a few excellent FAL gunsmiths out there who can get it running for you for a few hundred dollars. A few that come to mind are Arizona Response Systems in Phoenix, Arizona Expert Arms in Flagstaff, and George Gouger (Double "G" Gunsmithing) in (?).
If you do go the cheapo route and find problems, there are a few excellent FAL gunsmiths out there who can get it running for you for a few hundred dollars. A few that come to mind are Arizona Response Systems in Phoenix, Arizona Expert Arms in Flagstaff, and George Gouger (Double "G" Gunsmithing) in (?).
ROCK-n-GLOCK
New member
As far as the CETME goes, it is a good gun for the price. It uses HK91 mags and it made on a Stainless Rcvr. Probable one of the better Century products out there right now. I have one I got from Impact and it is a good shooter. The only problems I have seen is the front site. Some of the assemblies were put together with the front site canted, making it hard if not impossible to get sited in. If you buy your CETME from AIM surplus and it has a problem, they will make it right. I like these guns, they shoot nice and will munch up any kind of Ammo. Mine is pretty darn accurate. They are also made from new kits, surplus Spanish military rifles, not used ones like most of the G-3 clones out there.
FAL's on the other hand, IMHO, are a superior rifle(design) in all aspects. Easy to strip and clean. Adjustable gas system to compensate for fouling or different ammo loads on the fly. They are rock solid, you can get 20rd mags for 8 dollars all over the place. Spares are readily available for all parts of the rifle from more places than you can bookmark.....The Century ones are a crap shoot as stated. Your options are(there may be more, these are the most obvious):
1. Century FAL- Hit and miss for 500 bucks. As stated above, you could buy one maybe get lucky and be ready to go or need to send it off to ARS for an additional 300 bucks to make it right.
2. Buy a parts kit, Imbel rcvr and have one custom built by ARS or others as mentioned. This method you know you will have a good shooting rifle. Need a good kit, not to hard to find. There are places that sell kit anywhere from 150-250 bucks, another 200-220 for a Imbel rcvr and about 350 for the build including finishing of the rifle....lets say 770 bucks. Or you can assemble yourself if you are profficient and save the assembly dollars.
3. Buy a "Kit" gun from DSA. These are built of of Austrian kits and are superb rifles. Good shooters, well made and come with a limited lifetime warranty. This is the route I went as many others have too.......
4. Follow the auction boards. There are always a crap load of FAL's on http://www.gunbroker.com and you can get a rifle for a decent price sometimes.
Buy a IAI M444. These are suppose to be pretty good, but they have some small problems I've read about but overall have gotten good reviews.
Bottom line, I would go for the FAL over the HK copy unless you really like the HK style and then I would buy the CETME.For 500 bucks in the Main Battle Rifle world you get what you pay for. I would hold out till I could get 700-800 dollars and get a good FAL that will last you a lifetime and will be a rifle you will love to shoot...
FAL's on the other hand, IMHO, are a superior rifle(design) in all aspects. Easy to strip and clean. Adjustable gas system to compensate for fouling or different ammo loads on the fly. They are rock solid, you can get 20rd mags for 8 dollars all over the place. Spares are readily available for all parts of the rifle from more places than you can bookmark.....The Century ones are a crap shoot as stated. Your options are(there may be more, these are the most obvious):
1. Century FAL- Hit and miss for 500 bucks. As stated above, you could buy one maybe get lucky and be ready to go or need to send it off to ARS for an additional 300 bucks to make it right.
2. Buy a parts kit, Imbel rcvr and have one custom built by ARS or others as mentioned. This method you know you will have a good shooting rifle. Need a good kit, not to hard to find. There are places that sell kit anywhere from 150-250 bucks, another 200-220 for a Imbel rcvr and about 350 for the build including finishing of the rifle....lets say 770 bucks. Or you can assemble yourself if you are profficient and save the assembly dollars.
3. Buy a "Kit" gun from DSA. These are built of of Austrian kits and are superb rifles. Good shooters, well made and come with a limited lifetime warranty. This is the route I went as many others have too.......
4. Follow the auction boards. There are always a crap load of FAL's on http://www.gunbroker.com and you can get a rifle for a decent price sometimes.
Buy a IAI M444. These are suppose to be pretty good, but they have some small problems I've read about but overall have gotten good reviews.
Bottom line, I would go for the FAL over the HK copy unless you really like the HK style and then I would buy the CETME.For 500 bucks in the Main Battle Rifle world you get what you pay for. I would hold out till I could get 700-800 dollars and get a good FAL that will last you a lifetime and will be a rifle you will love to shoot...
hksigwalther
New member
Huh, I had just taken out my R1 FAL and CETME last Saturday. Sent a couple hundred rounds through each. I brought the R1 to find the proper gas setting for it and the CETME just to shoot it. It took about two magfuls for the R1 to get it dialed in (due to some very minor problem solving concerning the gas regulator). Once dailed in it shot pretty much OK. Did bet 3 misfires - 2 no primer hits, 1 light primer hit. I had not cleaned the rifle previously (which curiously had sand in some areas) so I'm thinking the bolt wasn't fully forward when the hammer fell. Thoroughly cleaned the rifle after shooting. Will try again to note reliability. Incredibly easy to disassemble and clean.
The (steel receiver) CETME started shooting right out of the case without any adjustments. No failures. Even seemed to have less recoil than the R1. You can feel and hear the entire cycling action of the gun when firing. An odd sensation. I did seem to shoot less accurately with it off hand than the R1. I think this is mostly due to the rear sight difference. The maximum range I was shooting at was 65 yds and so was using the open notch sight setting. The R1 of course has a rear peep sight for all ranges and I seemed to do better with it. Benched, both rifles shot about the same. Off hand I did better with the R1. The CETME is a bid harder to clean.
The reason I bougt these two was so I wouldn't have to shoot the HK and the DSA. They are great lower cost alternatives (at least mine).
The (steel receiver) CETME started shooting right out of the case without any adjustments. No failures. Even seemed to have less recoil than the R1. You can feel and hear the entire cycling action of the gun when firing. An odd sensation. I did seem to shoot less accurately with it off hand than the R1. I think this is mostly due to the rear sight difference. The maximum range I was shooting at was 65 yds and so was using the open notch sight setting. The R1 of course has a rear peep sight for all ranges and I seemed to do better with it. Benched, both rifles shot about the same. Off hand I did better with the R1. The CETME is a bid harder to clean.
The reason I bougt these two was so I wouldn't have to shoot the HK and the DSA. They are great lower cost alternatives (at least mine).
My vote is for the FAL, I have had two built on Imbel recievers one metric the other inch. If I had it to do over again I would stick to the metric (parts availability,ect) Both very reliable, the only failure was with bad ammo. The STG parts kits are very nice, if you include enough American parts (available from DSA) you can have a pistol grip, high cap mags, and bipod and still stay legal with the imperial federal government. I have owned an HK 91 and though I do respect the design I think that it is inferior to the FAL. Another atribute not talked about much is the FALs natural pointing ability, I can throw the FAL to my shoulder and hit a stump at 25yds time after time, sans sights. It feels like a Browning shotgun in this respect.
Alex
Alex