Charter Army Cylinder Gap

C

crawdad185

New member
I had asked this question in an earlier post, but everyone was focusing on another problem I was having, so I thought I would just make a separate post. Gun is an early (Stratford) Undercover 38 special.
I've always had difficulty opening the cylinder on this gun. When I pushed the cylinder release button in, I could hardly ever get the cylinder to open. I had to pull on the shell ejection rod to get the cylinder to release.
I ordered a new cylinder release button and new release spring and put that in and, although it made a huge difference, it is still very rough and a little hard to open. I adjusted the little screw that sets in the frame, but that didn't help.
I've just learned to live with the rough and troublesome cylinder release, but there is another problem that I am really concerned with.
When you close the cylinder, it is very tight. I can see where the front of the cylinder has been hitting the forcing cone when I close it. It is a little easier to close when I push back on the cylinder as I close. I'm not sure what the cylinder/forcing cone gap should be, but if I pull back on the cylinder, I can barely make out a little light between cylinder and forcing cone. If I don't pull back, I can't see any light at all. I know that when I close the cylinder, it will just barely hit the forcing cone. I can see where it has worn a small corner of the forcing cone and I can see rub marks and scraping on the front of the cylinder itself.
This is what I am concerned with and worry that it might be set too close. Then again, I have been shooting this little gun and it honestly is one of the sweetest small revolvers I own, and very accurate.
Any comments or thoughts on this would be much appreciated.
 
The barrel-cylinder gap should run .004"-010"; optimum is just about .007". If the gap is too much, noise and blast is increased and velocity is lost; if it is too little, the cylinder can bind when it heats up from firing or from dirt or powder residue.

Jim
 
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Besides Jim's response, if the cylinder's hitting one side of the barrel, IMHO it would indicate either:

The end of the barrel's not squared off.

or

The cylinder-pin/cylinder-arbor junction has enough wear to allow the cylinder some wobble off square.


If the cylinder doesn't have any/much play on it's pin, the barrel stub can be squared when filing it to correct the gap - but I wouldn't advise adjusting the gap w/o first checking the cylinder for excessive play.

IME, with the current CA company & it's Prexy (Nick Ecker), I would bet that Charter would repair your revolver for a pittance, or the bubble.

Unless you're an adept @ revolver work, I would sugest at least contacting CA for a discussion.



.
 
One point to bear in mind with older used guns is the possibility of parts replacement. Barrels can be replaced, cylinders replaced, cranes replaced, etc. If the work is done by a competent person, things will be fine. But all too often, someone will order a part from a parts supply company and get it to fit, one way or another. When things don't work, the amateur "gunsmith" heads for the local gun shop to trade off the messed up gun and make it someone else's headache.

Jim
 
Ok, I had already decided to send it back to charter for another problem, so I'll just add this to the list for them to take a look at.
I plan to send it out next Monday. I'll post their findings when I get it back.
Thanks for your help.
 
All great advice and info. Usually some folks are complaining about too much cylinder gap! :eek:

If it's going back to Charter, I'd certainly make a not of it to them as you mentioned so they can hopefully do what needs to be done to it. If you get it back and still have the problem, try to find a good pistol smith who can decipher it and correct it. Good luck!:)
 
When I was still working as a gunsmith, a man brought in an older Colt. He bragged that the barrel-cylinder gap was super tight. It was, I measured it at under .002". His complaint was that after about three cylinders of rapid fire, the gun hung up and he had to fiddle with it to get it working. The problem was, of course, that .002". When the cylinder heated up, it expanded and closed the gap, tying up the gun. His "fiddling" allowed the gun to cool and get working again.

I set the gap to .006", but didn't tell him that. He never noticed that his precious tight gap was gone, but the gun worked.

Jim
 
One issue with those Charter Arms Undercover pistols is that the cylinder release pin is actually a slotted screw (the part that pokes out of the frame when you push the cylinder release forward). If you look at it, you'll see the slot.

That screw can rotate and recess itself further and further into the frame, so that when you push the cylinder release, it won't move up to flush with the frame so the rear cylinder pin is still partway in the hole.

The cure for this is some blue Loctite, and disassembly of the pistol to where you can get to the cylinder release pin. Just unscrew it, put the Loctite on the threads, screw it back in, and adjust so that it is flush with the frame when the latch is pushed forward, and then let the Loctite set up.

I did had to do this on a 1981 Charter Arms Undercover that my wife had inherited. Once I did that, it shot like a charm.

I can tell you that the cylinder latch slide is a pain to take apart, and watch out for a very tiny spring that is held in place by the screw that holds the cylinder release in place. That thing is tiny, and will go flying across the room if you aren't careful.

Here's a similar thread from a year or so ago:

http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=512055
 
I had the same problem with a Taurus 445 in 44 special. Two cylinders and you couldn’t turn the cylinder. I don’t remember what the gap was but the barrel end was also not cut straight. I purchased this gun used from the store where I was working at the time cheep. It had been brought in for the failure.
Good gun smith opened the gap and it became a fair shooter.
 
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