Charlton Heston & NRA "infomercial"

HS

New member
The local TV & news services here in Australia are up in arms about the NRAs TV add using Aussie crime statistics in NRA advertising !
Talk about TWO FACED....
For years every News group & anti here has been screaming
"Don't go down the American Path!" but when an American points out the DISMAL FAILURE of gun laws in Aus, England & Canada they get ostrasised by the very same people!....grrrrrr :(
I really am glad of what i saw in the NRA add & the way Charlton put forward the facts. :)
Join the NRA guys n' gals before it's TOO LATE !

------------------
"The Gun from Down Under !"
http://www.para1911fanclub.w3.to/
E-mail hotshot_2000@hotmail.com
Alternate E-mail
HS2000@ausi.com
 
HS, you beat me to it. The 7.30 report on the ABC tonight was an absolute national disgrace.

Not only did American gunowners get totally vilified with the usual snide remarks and oh-so-superior politicians blathering on witlessly, it lied shamelessly about crime and guns in Australia.

You MUST read the transcript BEFORE it is taken down
http://www.abc.net.au/7.30/stories/s112715.htm

For God's sake, people, wake up and learn. After hearing/seeing this tonight, I am ashamed to be an Australian.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Anti-gun campaigners apalled by
NRA adverts

American television viewers have been treated
to an apocalyptic vision of Australia as a land where citizens cower indoors while criminals run riot in the streets. The video, produced by America's National Rifle Association, chose emotive pictures of a law and order rally in South Australia to make the case that tough new gun control laws, in the wake of the Port Arthur massacre, have left citizens in Australia unable to defend themselves from a veritable crime wave. [FULL STORY[/quote]

And, yes, they do give an e-mail address.

Get to it. Tell 'em the USA is none of their f***ing business. (And I will not apologise for my language. You want to throw me off TFL for it, fine -- I've said what I must say!)

B

B


[This message has been edited by Bruce in West Oz (edited March 22, 2000).]
 
I heard the news report this morning. The claim is that the NRA is using inaccurate stats. Is this true? Is so, shame on the NRA for being stupid. If not, should be easy to refute. I have also heard the stats, but they were only for one year. I'd like to hear how things are developing since the ban.

------------------
Rob
From the Committee to Use Proffesional Politicians as Lab Animals
 
Just in case it's taken down.....
-------------
Transcript
22/03/00
Anti-gun campaigners apalled by NRA adverts

KERRY O'BRIEN: American television viewers have been treated to an apocalyptic vision of Australia as a land where citizens cower indoors while criminals run riot in the streets.

The video, produced by America's National Rifle Association, chose emotive pictures of a law and order rally in South Australia to make the case that tough new gun control laws, in the wake of the Port Arthur massacre, have left citizens in Australia unable to defend themselves from a veritable crime wave.

Today, Attorney-General Daryl Williams wrote to NRA President, former screen star Charlton Heston, to protest against what he described as a misleading campaign.

But, as North America correspondent Craig McMurtrie reports, the video is only the latest salvo in what's become an increasingly vitriolic showdown between the White House and America's powerful gun lobby.

NATIONAL RIFLE ASSOCIATION VIDEO: If you follow politics at all, you know a lot of people in Washington DC want to take away your right to keep and bear arms.

The truth is, they've got the whole world on their side.

NATIONAL RIFLE ASSOCIATION VIDEO: It's disgusting that almost every day we learn of another person being terrorised, robbed and attacked in their home.

VICTIM: And they jumped on me and knelt on my chest and grabbed me around the throat, because I immediately started calling out 'Help'.

ADVERTISEMENT: If you want to preserve your right to keep and bear arms --

CRAIG McMURTRIE: What you are watching is an infomercial paid for by America's gun lobby, a piece of National Rifle Association propaganda that paints a picture of Australia most Australians would hardly recognise.

REPORTER: Cold hard facts the anti-gun forces can no longer escape.

Armed robberies have skyrocketed, up 69 per cent; assaults involving guns rose 28 per cent; gun murders increased 19 per cent; and a new phenomenon -- home invasions jumped 21 per cent.

CRAIG McMURTRIE: Where they got those figures from isn't clear.

Puzzled Australian statisticians say firearms-related crimes are down across Australia.

The National Rifle Association isn't saying.

A spokesman described them as "official government numbers", but no-one was willing to be interviewed.

No-one, that is, accept Adelaide's Keith Tidswell, from the Sporting Shooters Association, a group that's received $10,000 donations from the NRA on at least two occasions.

KEITH TIDSWELL, AUSTRALIAN SPORTING SHOOTERS ASSOCIATION: From what I've seen of their comments, I think they do accurately reflect the feelings of the firearm-owning community.

I believe there may be some concern about the statistical data.

CRAIG McMURTRIE: As it happens, the NRA film crew was filmed in South Australia by the ABC last year -- their producer Ginny Simone.

GINNY SIMONE, TELEVISION PRODUCER: We are just here documenting what you see going on, which is a huge problem, not only here, but we are experiencing the same thing that you are experiencing.

And time and time again I've asked people here, "What is your message to the American public?"

And they say, "Don't do what we did.

Don't sit silent, because it can happen to you just as it has happened to us."

NATIONAL RIFLE ASSOCIATION VIDEO: Gun laws that have backfired, and Australians who have been forced to hide behind bars and deadbolts.

Some are even installing extensive security systems because the firearms they still own that haven't been banned have to be locked up, unloaded and unavailable.

DARYL WILLIAMS, FEDERAL ATTORNEY GENERAL: The simple fact of the matter is that dangerous firearms were removed from the community.

Now, if the National Rifle Association thinks it's good to promote ownership of automatic and semiautomatic firearms in the community, in the suburbs, then I think they've got another thing coming.

TREVOR GRIFFIN, SOUTH AUSTRALIAN ATTORNEY-GENERAL: Generally around the world, among the thinking communities who know about Australia and SA, they recognise that crime is not out of control in Australia and that it is most unreasonable and unfair, and even offensive, to compare the position in Australia, and SA in particular, with the position in the USA.

NATIONAL RIFLE ASSOCIATION VIDEO: Think about it, who but the NRA can fight on every front --

CRAIG McMURTRIE: Every few minutes in the infomercial Americans are invited to join up or send a donation.

They're told over and over again that there's a global conspiracy to take their guns.

And the blitz on television and on the Internet is working.

Membership of the National Rifle Association has swelled to 3.5 million, and with that kind of ammunition, with that kind of money, the NRA has rounded on the real target, the Clinton White House.

On 29 February, there was another school shooting in America.

There have been many, only this time the victim was a six-year-old girl, her name Kayla Rolland.

The gunman -- he was also six -- was a classmate.

The incident gained national headlines and the attention of the President, who decided to use it to try and break a deadlock in Congress over new gun control measures.

BILL CLINTON, US PRESIDENT: I ask all Americans to join me, because I think these things are reasonable.

This won't effect anybody's right to hunt or sports shoot or anything, but it will save kids' lives.

NATIONAL RIFLE ASSOCIATION ADVERTISEMENT: When a six-year-old in a crackhouse finds a stolen gun and shoots his schoolmate, the President doesn't demand gun theft prosecution or busting drug dealers -- he demands safety locks.

Mr Clinton, when what you say is wrong, that's a mistake.

When you know it's wrong, that's a lie.

CRAIG McMURTRIE: And that was just the start.

The NRA's executive vice-president: WAYNE LA PIERRE, NRA EXECUTIVE SECRETARY: I mean, I've come to believe he needs a certain level of violence in this country.

He's willing to accept a certain level of killing to further his political agenda -- and the Vice-President, too.

I mean, how else can you explain this dishonesty we get out of the administration?

JOE LOCKHART, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: The executive vice-president of the NRA made personally -- just sick charges -- levelled sick charges against the President last week.

CRAIG McMURTRIE: It's rhetoric that has some of the gun lobby's political supporters in Washington ducking for cover.

NATIONAL RIFLE ASSOCIATION VIDEO: I would say that within 5 to 10 years, the restrictions on gun owners in America will be similar to what happened in Australia.

SECOND SPEAKER: Don't trust your politicians -- get in there, keep on their backs.

Be a member of the NRA, be a member at your local gun club.

THIRD SPEAKER: Be part of the NRA.

CRAIG McMURTRIE: But in the year when most US law-makers face re-election, it seems the NRA has decided anyone, anywhere is fair game.

NRA MEMBER: I think the Americans have to be very, very careful because their rights will be quickly eroded, as ours have, and we don't have a chance in hell of getting those rights back.

DARYL WILLIAMS: One gets somewhat outraged when an organisation based in the US, where there are something like 11,000 firearms homicides in one year, is telling us our gun laws fail.
© 2000 Australian Broadcasting Corporation

email: 7.30syd@your.abc.net.au
*********
As an aside, the Antis twist the TRUTH & LIE everday regarding Statistics...
If the NRA gets a figure of 19% incorrect THEY'RE suddenly the BAD guys ?

With the spate of IN HOUSE attacks against ELDERLY people (mostly Female) way on the RISE, & drive by bag snatchings being the "In Thing", & last but not least the shooting up of a Sydney POLICE STATION....

A 19% increase may actually be TOO LOW!


------------------
"The Gun from Down Under !"
http://www.para1911fanclub.w3.to/
E-mail hotshot_2000@hotmail.com
Alternate E-mail
HS2000@ausi.com
 
I'd still prefer a source for the figures. I would hope the NRA would have the brains not to exaggerate, knowing they'll be questioned and that anyone can find out whether they're telling the truth.

But I am getting sick of the double standard. When HCI says that 13 innocent children are "killed by guns" each day, no one questions. When the NRA gives stats to support its position, they're liars. And didja notice they didn't give any specific figures, just "puzzled" statisticians say the figures are down?
If the NRA blames Clinton for some of the violence, they're the devil. Every news agency and most of their political "allies" vilifies them and calls them extremist liars. When Clinton said outright that the reason for gun violence in America was that the NRA exists, you didn't hear a peep. And now that LaPierre's comments have reopened that debate--they STILL don't mention it! Who are they supposed to be fooling?

Finally, I found it grimly amusing that they would cry foul that the NRA's PAID ADVERTISING was "propaganda" after filing such an alarmist, unsubstantiated, buzzword-filled piece of propaganda under the guise of a NEWS STORY. I expect paid ads to be biased; I'd prefer to think that news wouldn't be, but it just isn't possible.
 
I picked up a CD of Peter, Paul and Mary from
the library for my little girl. Lovely songs, and reminded me that one thing that's sorely lacking in 2nd amendment defense is populist support. We are failing in PR. Oleg is doing a fine job with his posters... hope he can get them put them up on billboards. The NRA/GOA/JDFA should support his efforts. And we need singers and poets!
 
To put my images on billboards, I need to re-shoot the mess on larger format and offer the results to http://www.coa.org as they can raise money for ad space. Right now I spend between half a day and a day per poster AND up to $50 in expenses. Re-doing them for print and billboards would raise the cost to $100-200 per poster and about a day in production.

Is there a financial support for that kind of effort? I don't think I can sustain the pace for all that long on my own...

------------------
Oleg "cornered rat" Volk (JPFO,NRA)

http://dd-b.net/RKBA
 
The good news that I forgot to mention is that my existing posters provide with a good guide as to which images would be most popular.

I would like to do it the way Apple Computers supports their advertisers: by providing free or nominally priced CDs with hi-res images of posters to people in publishing, media and pro-RKBA org.

Those of you with knowledge of fund-raising practices (legal aspects, too), please help me out with advice.
 
This has made shooters look worse in Australia.
It's a pathetic effort from the NRA. All they had to do is call the SSAA, how hard would that have been ?
 
First off if you think that gunowners are ever going to get a fair shake on the Clinton Leftist News Media you're living in fantasy land. http://www.nra.org/ do some browsing and find the stats. Here's one on the 13 Children: Since When is a 19 year old adult a "child? The President Says: 13 Firearm -related fatalities among children every day. Is a 19 year old a "child?" Fatalities among children ages 0-14 Assault: 346 Suicide: 127 Accident: 142Unexplained: 14 Total: 629 Average Number Per Day: 1.7 Fatalities among juveniles and young adults ages 15-19 Assault: 2,216 Suicide 1,135 Accident 164 Unexplained 61 Total: 3,576 Average Number Per Day 9.8 Source: National Center for Health Statistics, 1997, the most recent year of complete data available. On March 2, 2000, President Clinton tried to persuade the public to support so-called "Triggerlock" and "smart" gun laws, by falsely claiming that 13 children are killed with guns every day. (NBC "Today Show") The claim is commonly made by anti-gun politicians and activists. On April 27, 1999, promoting another series of proposed restrictions of guns, Hillary Clinton claimed, "Every day in America we lose 13 precious children to gun-related violence." (Remarks by the President and the First Lady on Gun Control Legislation.) Anti-gun groups have made the same claim for years.


------------------
"Gun Control Only Protects Those in Power"
 
The crime stats are just plain wrong -
The pro gun associations in Australia wont even say they are true.
This just makes shooters look bad and less believable.
The statistics are avaiable here and they fluctuate year to year and noone can claim its had a good or bad affect on murder rates etc.
Just because the antis lie doesn't mean we should.
Or wont anyone even believe the Aussie pro gun groups ?
Do you think we are that dumb we wouldn't be using the statistics if they were actually correct ?
 
Here's a URL direct to the Sporting Shooter's Association of Australia's response.

The ordure has really hit the rotating cooling device over this one -- politicians are scurrying around like ants over here.

http://www.ssaa.org.au/nraweb.html

It would appear some of the NRA's stats are supported, and some we have been unable to find a source for --- yet.

Nevertheless, for our Attorney-General to write to the NRA and demand the adverts be withdrawn is w-a-y out of line in my book.

B
 
HS
thanks for the heads up and info good to here from down under..... <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by HS:
The local TV & news services here in Australia are up in arms about the NRAs TV add using Aussie crime statistics in NRA advertising !
Talk about TWO FACED....
For years every News group & anti here has been screaming
"Don't go down the American Path!" but when an American points out the DISMAL FAILURE of gun laws in Aus, England & Canada they get ostrasised by the very same people!....grrrrrr :(
I really am glad of what i saw in the NRA add & the way Charlton put forward the facts. :)
Join the NRA guys n' gals before it's TOO LATE !

[/quote]
 
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