Can I avoid rod-based cleaning on an M1A/M14?

B

Battler

New member
I have a "Loaded" springfield M1A on the way. This gun must be cleaned from the muzzle if I use a rod.

On my milsurp rifles, I have been using the bore-snake. I like it a lot - and prefer it to using a cleaning rod from an ease-of-use standpoint.

However, this will be a brand new barrel, and I would like to make it last as long as possible and not abuse it.

Although I hear mixed things about the necessity of "breakin" - I would like to play it safe and do the full breakin; but of course not ADD wear/damage to the gun from thinking.

Will the bore-snake do during breakin? If not, during the rest of the gun's life?

Or to retain more control over brush/patch ordering and amount, should I order the Otis?


thanks,
Battler.
 
I think the boresnake is the only way to go. I used one to break in my HK91. And since you are really only pulling the boresnake through once or twice as opposed to repeated dingings with a rod, I think the boresnake is easier on the barrel too.

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"Death to the false ones, dance on a string, till the blood on your sword is the blood of a king!" -Manowar
 
As I try to give you a streight answer to your 'problem' all I can see is the face of my Marine Corps DI, turning redder and redder after I ask "Do I really have to take it apart to clean it?" beertrucker-x
 
Originally posted by Battler:
Or to retain more control over brush/patch ordering and amount, should I order the Otis?

Either/or/both. ;)

I've never used a Bore Snake, but I got an Otis a couple of months ago and like it so much that I even use it for bolt guns that I have bore guides for. I have the plastic gun vice that's sold under several names clamped to a WorkMate bench. I think it's easier to feed the cable and pull the patches and brushes through than walk around to the back of the gun and feed in a rod. For bores around 30 cal., I use a .45 cal nylon pistol brush with a 2 1/2" patch wrapped around it. I still use a rod for things like polishing with JB.
Click to expand...
 
Battler, I'd just get a good one-piece coated rod like the Boretech or the Dewey. Get the 25" rod (the longer ones like the 30" have more flex).

You can get a muzzle bore guide from Sinclair or you can make your own by drilling out the primer hole of a 12 ga. shotgun and slipping it over the flash hider.

Use a chamber plug to keep the solvent and junk out of the receiver.

Also check this out http://www.mikesshooters.com/maint.htm

I think I finally have the URL correctly typed now.

Regards! DaMan


[This message has been edited by DaMan (edited November 06, 2000).]
 
Boresnakes are ok but the Otis kit would do a better job for breaking-in. I agree with DaMan, the Dewey or Boretech rods with a Dewey guide are the way to go and in shooting an M1A for about 8 years now I've yet to damage a barrel with this method. Be careful inserting the rod into the muzzle and all will be fine. I pull my patches through; wrap the patch on the jag, insert it in the chamber, insert the rod and tread it into the jag and pull through. I don't like to push anything over the crown I would rather pull it across and the guide keeps the rod from contacting the muzzle during threading on the jag as well.

Brian
 
I like Bore Snake as well, particularly for field cleaning or "casual" cleaning.

However, it does not seem to clean as fastidiously as the traditional rod and brush, particularly with only one pass. Some times, with only one or two passes, I find that there is significant amount of carbon fouling left in the grooves. I wonder if that is okay for short-term storage between shooting sessions.

My concern was (and remains) how I can keep the debris embedded on the cord if I pass the Bore Snake through more than once. That has never been satisfactorily explained to me.

Perhaps I should purchase the Otis system as well. How well do surplus pull-through cords work? They seem to go for $3-4 as opposed to $35 for Otis.

Skorzeny

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For to win one hundred victories in one hundred battles is not the acme of skill. To subdue the enemy without fighting is the supreme excellence. Sun Tzu
 
The pull-thru's have some utility as the basis of a small field cleaning kit (I still prefer to have a rod available, in case the bore gets plugged and your M1A has buttstock storage to accomodate same).

For home/shop use, just get a high quality NON-jointed rod. People who are smarter than me can't agree on whether a plain steel rod or a plastic coated one is better, so I'll leave that alone (mine is plain steel, by RIG). You can get a bore guide that fits in your flash suppressor to keep the rod centered. www.brownells.com has them. When cleaning, be sure to keep the rifle inverted, so solvent and dirt doesn't run down into the gas cylinder.

As for the "shoot one/clean rifle" sort of "break-in". This is voodoo BS. No less an authority than the late Gale MacMillan thought it was BS and I agree. I think the procedure gratifies a certain tweaky/persnickity personality type. Just clean the barrel initially, shoot the thing, and clean it normally afterward. Leave the voodoo to the tweaks.

Rosco

[This message has been edited by Rosco Benson (edited November 09, 2000).]
 
Thanks, Roscoe, for bringing up Gale's info on this. You beat me to it.

Battler, you DO have a complete buttstock cleaning kit in the rifle, right? A one piece rod is the right one to use, but IMHO every M1A/M14 owner should have the kit in his buttstock. The quote, "If WE ever need to depend on the rifle, WE will succeed, because WE are squared away" is true. The cleaning kit goes in, and in the back of your mind you always know it's there, just in case. They are cheap ($7) and worth it. BTW, check out Fred's, and buy several USGI synthetic stocks (with hardware) for $9 each too.
 
I have the Springfield Loaded fiberglass on order (I think it arrives today) - does it COME with a cleaning kit?

I just wnat to make sure I take proper care of it from day ONE.

BTW - who's "Bills"?

Battler.

[This message has been edited by Battler (edited November 09, 2000).]
 
I don't know who "Bill" is, but if you're looking for Fred's, he's here: http://www.shotgunnews.com/members/fred/pages/Fredspagesindex.html

BTW, it has often bees said that Springfield is merely refinishing USGI synthetics with their black stuff and selling them at a high price. I'm a BIG SA fan, and also a BIG capatilist, but I also like to help other shooters. The $9 stocks (if you buy 2, $12 each for just one) from Fred's aren't pretty when they get to your door, but you can do a dandy camo pattern on them and you'll get lots of complements. No, I don't believe that the SA stock will come with the buttstock kit.

Like I said, the buttstock kit isn't for your regular cleaning duties, it's for then emergency that may happen if your life is on the line. Silly? Perhaps, but perhaps not. "Be prepared."
 
I do the same as MouseGun in cleaning my M14. Insert coated rod, attach brush, apply solvent, pull through. Detach brush, wipe rod down, repeat. Similar for patches. Use only bronze bristle brushes (stay away from stainless) and always wipe that rod down prior to insertion.

My concern about pull-throughs is that it can have an abrasive effect on the muzzle if not pulled through concentrically. Maybe I'm being anal, but having polished guns on a buffer, I've seen metal worn away if care is not exercised.
 
Any good online places from which to order some dewey guides? I'm at work during the day (can't phone) and Brownells displaced the last online order I placed there.


Battler.
 
I just bought the Otis kit and used it today for the first time. I really liked it. It made cleaning the M1A really easy and simple. The cable is plastic coated too so you are not going to rub anything. I would recommend it. I also used it on my Mosin Nagant and it worked good there too. I recommend the Otis rifle cleaning kit. A good deal.
 
I just bought an Otis rifle cleaning kit as well. It works pretty well. I won't go back to the rod again (though I really liked the Dewey brand rods).

However, for some reason, the grooves of my Romanian SAR-1 still has lots of fouling on it. I've tried a 30 caliber bronze brush on it as well as a 38 caliber pistol one. The lands are sparkly clean, but the grooves still have fouling. What must I do???!!!

Skorzeny

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For to win one hundred victories in one hundred battles is not the acme of skill. To subdue the enemy without fighting is the supreme excellence. Sun Tzu
 
With the dewey, would I still need to get a bore guide?

And what do I do for a jag? It doesn't seem to include one; but I'd really like to be able to push a patch through tight.

Battler.
 
I use a guide with every rifle I own, it's cheap insurance, coated rod or not. I like the Otis kits for field cleaning when needed, however a Dewey or Parker-Hale jag with a patch wrapped around it does a much better job cleaning as it fits tighter and there is more patch in contact with the bore.

Brian
 
Skorzensky, try using some Butch's Bore Shine. Run two wetted patches throught the bore, and wait five minutes. Run one more wet patch through, and after one minute, start running TIGHT dry patches. that ought to do it.
 
Sorry, typo (I put dewey instead of otis) - Would I need a bore guide with the Otis? A jag?

I'm thinking of starting out with the Otis now.

thanks,
Battler.
 
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