Can a Ruger Vaquero withstand heavy loads?
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Jim Watson
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Is this a New Vaquero on the .357 frame or an "original" Vaquero on the .44 frame?
The original Vaquero will handle the "Ruger Only" loads up to 30,000 psi developed for the Blackhawk .45.
The New Vaquero is only slightly larger than a Colt and most folks say it should be limited to the 20,000 psi loads which are still a good deal hotter than SAMMI's 14,000 psi.
The original Vaquero will handle the "Ruger Only" loads up to 30,000 psi developed for the Blackhawk .45.
The New Vaquero is only slightly larger than a Colt and most folks say it should be limited to the 20,000 psi loads which are still a good deal hotter than SAMMI's 14,000 psi.
Bob Wright
New member
My first thought is "WHY?"
The Vaquero is a western style Single Action revolver designed for those who want a revolver for re-enactments or cowboy action shooting, or who just want the gun for nostalgia's sake.
If you want a magnum revolver for long range shooting and/or hunting and field use, get yourself a Super Blackhawk or Blackhawk. Better suited for heavy loaded ammunition and much better sights.
My take on the subject.
Bob Wright
The Vaquero is a western style Single Action revolver designed for those who want a revolver for re-enactments or cowboy action shooting, or who just want the gun for nostalgia's sake.
If you want a magnum revolver for long range shooting and/or hunting and field use, get yourself a Super Blackhawk or Blackhawk. Better suited for heavy loaded ammunition and much better sights.
My take on the subject.
Bob Wright
Then again, if it's a Ruger version of the single action Army, it's going to be more sturdy. I think one should actually shoot the Vaquero with the amped up load before passing judgment.
My Uberti El Patron is reserved for SAMMI spec limit loads, but I read that it too, as a modern gun, can handle the 20-25k psi range.
My 45 Colt Henry Big Boy no way is going to be limited to SAMMI ammo.
My Uberti El Patron is reserved for SAMMI spec limit loads, but I read that it too, as a modern gun, can handle the 20-25k psi range.
My 45 Colt Henry Big Boy no way is going to be limited to SAMMI ammo.
The original series Vaqueros were built on the same 44Magnum-class frame and cylinder size as the SuperBlackhawk or the original Blackhawks in 45LC. Those can take up to 33k PSI for loads meeting or exceeding 44Magnum external ballistics.
The "New Vaq" is built on the mid-sized "357 class" frame. It can take 20-22k PSI loads when chambered in 45LC. It's *maybe* a bit stronger than a Colt SAA 2nd Gen or later, or the various Italian replicas, but not by much.
My NewVaq is now chambered in 9mmPara with a Bowen chromoly oversize/overlength cylinder and is possibly among the strongest 9mm guns ever
. That cylinder is rated OK as a 41Magnum six-shooter if chambered in that caliber...I bought it as a blank. Unfluted actually, which is scarce among Bowen cylinders.
The "New Vaq" is built on the mid-sized "357 class" frame. It can take 20-22k PSI loads when chambered in 45LC. It's *maybe* a bit stronger than a Colt SAA 2nd Gen or later, or the various Italian replicas, but not by much.
My NewVaq is now chambered in 9mmPara with a Bowen chromoly oversize/overlength cylinder and is possibly among the strongest 9mm guns ever
. That cylinder is rated OK as a 41Magnum six-shooter if chambered in that caliber...I bought it as a blank. Unfluted actually, which is scarce among Bowen cylinders.New or old Vaquero, this load will work. A 275gr LFN will leave a 5.5" barrel at 1050 under 10gr of Unique for about 20k PSI (9 grains will give about 950, which is still stout and registers about 14k PSI). This load went from nose to new anus on a 150# hog. Gives magnum performance without the noise and recoil.
Jim March covers the New Vaquero and original Vaquero pretty well. Talking .45 Colt. The New Vaquero will take Tier 1 (14K psi) and Tier 2 (23K psi) Loads. The original Vaquero will handle the Tier 3 loads (30K psi) otherwise know as Ruger Only Loads.
As for why? Because you can. Not a big deal. My woods 13.0g HS-6 load (Tier 2) under 255g SWC is fine in both revolvers. Brian Pearce actually states 13.5g under 270g bullet is fine for the New Vaquero. My general loads are back into top Tier 1 loads (250g RNFP at 900fps) which is what I 'normally' shoot for all day fun.
One thing about a fixed sighted revolver, is your rear sights won't hang on something, or get knocked around when in the wild wooly woods....
One load Reference: Brian Pearce on the 45-270SAA bullet loads .
BTW, give me some references to the many people 'blowing up' .45 Colt Ruger revolvers. I haven't ran across any incidents that some allude too. All the .45 Colt shooters that I know, research their guns before building up loads for them....
As for why? Because you can. Not a big deal. My woods 13.0g HS-6 load (Tier 2) under 255g SWC is fine in both revolvers. Brian Pearce actually states 13.5g under 270g bullet is fine for the New Vaquero. My general loads are back into top Tier 1 loads (250g RNFP at 900fps) which is what I 'normally' shoot for all day fun.
One thing about a fixed sighted revolver, is your rear sights won't hang on something, or get knocked around when in the wild wooly woods....
One load Reference: Brian Pearce on the 45-270SAA bullet loads .
BTW, give me some references to the many people 'blowing up' .45 Colt Ruger revolvers. I haven't ran across any incidents that some allude too. All the .45 Colt shooters that I know, research their guns before building up loads for them....
I guess that would be the folks who think "Ruger only" means any Ruger and go right for the big stuff. I think there is adequate published science and testimony to support use of mid level loads in Vaqueros, which by the way are also available as convertible 45 ACP rated at 25k psi max.
Driftwood Johnson
New member
Howdy
I wish I had a dollar for every time this question gets asked. First off, the question must be asked, exactly what does the OP mean by 'heavy handloads'?
Secondly, exactly what does the OP mean when he says 'Vaquero'?
The 'original model', big frame Vaquero was manufactured from 1993 until 2005. In 2005 Ruger ceased production of that model and introduced the New Vaquero, a smaller frame gun, but more importantly, the cylinder of the New Vaquero is smaller and the the chamber walls of the New Vaquero are thinner. Meaning the cylinder is not as strong as the older, larger model. Then, in their infinite wisdom Ruger dropped the name 'new' from the New Vaquero. Look it up on their website and the only thing you will see is Vaquero, even though this is the smaller model.
So. Any Vaquero made after 2005 is the smaller, and less robust New Vaquero, despite what the website says. I believe Ruger has even stopped stamping 'new' on the frame of the smaller Vaquero.
'Ruger Only' loads: These predate the New Vaquero, at least in my loading manuals. These loads were published before the New Vaquero existed. So be very careful of loading up ammo from the 'Ruger Only' pages of any manual and firing them in a New Vaquero. The gun may or may not take them.
Ruger made it extremely clear when the New Vaquero was introduced that it was designed to take SAAMI MAX 14,000 psi 45 Colt loads. Period.
Why anybody feels the need to push the envelope beyond that escapes me.
I have bunches of Single Action revolvers chambered for 45 Colt. Ruger, Colt, and Uberti. I do not happen to own a New Vaquero chambered for 45 Colt. If I did, I would not load anything more powerful than the SAAAMI Max of 14,000 psi for it.
Period.
Why do the Nervous Nellies miss that the New Vaquero is approved by Ruger for and produced in the higher pressure 45 ACP round (45 convertibles)? That would not be "Ruger only" loads though. The 20k psi range would be about right. The standard 45 Colt is so soft shooting in a New Vaquero as to be pretty boring to shoot as just range use. Gimme some drama!
I have bunches of Single Action revolvers chambered for 45 Colt. Ruger, Colt, and Uberti. I do not happen to own a New Vaquero chambered for 45 Colt. If I did, I would not load anything more powerful than the SAAAMI Max of 14,000 psi for it.
Sounds simple to me you like a bigger boom buy a bigger gun .
Sounds simple to me you like a bigger boom buy a bigger gun .
Can Vaquero withstand heavy loads
I have a Stainless Vaquero produced in 95. I haven't measured the cylinder to see if it is the heavier version.
I bought a box of bear loads.
360 grains 1400 fps. I think. Too lazy go read the box.
Shot once it near wrecked my hand. Trigger finger and second finger hammered very hard. heel of thumb and palm of other hand the tut was cushioned in bruised.
All the screws are tight and everything seems good but I'm going to mike it before firing again.
I'm use to firing 300 grain.44 Hornady loaded long in Super Blackhawk with Pchymer grip. at about 1400fps or better. It leaves some rubber in hand but recoil was nowhere near as brutal.
Those .45 loads are as heavy a load as Casull rounds.
I don't think I will use them in this gun again. Now if I buy a 7 1/2 in barrel and ported probably still not.
Need a heavier gun.
I read on internet site that the Vaquero with 1.7+ dia cylinder is the heavy version. The 1.6 in is the light version.
It does not resemble my Super Blackhawk , in the frame ,but more closely the Colt. it is heavier, with shorter barrel, than a stainless 7 1/2 in Vaquero I examined at Cabelas.
I have a Stainless Vaquero produced in 95. I haven't measured the cylinder to see if it is the heavier version.
I bought a box of bear loads.
360 grains 1400 fps. I think. Too lazy go read the box.
Shot once it near wrecked my hand. Trigger finger and second finger hammered very hard. heel of thumb and palm of other hand the tut was cushioned in bruised.
All the screws are tight and everything seems good but I'm going to mike it before firing again.
I'm use to firing 300 grain.44 Hornady loaded long in Super Blackhawk with Pchymer grip. at about 1400fps or better. It leaves some rubber in hand but recoil was nowhere near as brutal.
Those .45 loads are as heavy a load as Casull rounds.
I don't think I will use them in this gun again. Now if I buy a 7 1/2 in barrel and ported probably still not.
Need a heavier gun.
I read on internet site that the Vaquero with 1.7+ dia cylinder is the heavy version. The 1.6 in is the light version.
It does not resemble my Super Blackhawk , in the frame ,but more closely the Colt. it is heavier, with shorter barrel, than a stainless 7 1/2 in Vaquero I examined at Cabelas.
I wonder if Ruger has changed the frame marking, or just their website???
I have several Vaqueros, they all say "Vaquero" on the frame, left side, below the cylinder window. I have one of the early (case colored) New Vaqueros, and it says "New Vaquero" on the frame. I was unaware Ruger had dropped the word "New" from the New Vaquero, until it was mentioned here.
Will be going to a gun show this weekend, and will look for a current production "Vaquero" to see what the gun actually says...
OR, some one who has bought a NIB one recently, post and tell us, or show us a pic, please!
Did they change the frame markings or just the way they refer to it on their web site???
I have several Vaqueros, they all say "Vaquero" on the frame, left side, below the cylinder window. I have one of the early (case colored) New Vaqueros, and it says "New Vaquero" on the frame. I was unaware Ruger had dropped the word "New" from the New Vaquero, until it was mentioned here.
Will be going to a gun show this weekend, and will look for a current production "Vaquero" to see what the gun actually says...
OR, some one who has bought a NIB one recently, post and tell us, or show us a pic, please!
Did they change the frame markings or just the way they refer to it on their web site???
The only New Vaquero that I know of that Ruger only stamped Vaquero on is the .44Special New Vaquero. Why? I have no idea. My .45 New Vaquero is stamped New Vaquero as is one I saw in the store a few months ago. I haven't seen proof yet that Ruger dropped the New from the frame stamp. Just my observation.
. I though, believe tier 2 loads are perfectly safe in the New Vaquero as do many others. That said, most of my loads for the New Vaquero (and my flattops) are SAAMI loads in the 900-950fps range (250g RNFPs) out of 5 1/2" barrel. Plenty for most purposes... But the original Vaquero and New Vaquero will still easily handle my woods load which is a Tier 2 load.
.
Find table of cylinder sizes here:
Gunblast New Vaquero
and a bit more info if you like
Gunblast New Vaquero Revisited
.
That is of course, your opinion and your right to do and say so
. I though, believe tier 2 loads are perfectly safe in the New Vaquero as do many others. That said, most of my loads for the New Vaquero (and my flattops) are SAAMI loads in the 900-950fps range (250g RNFPs) out of 5 1/2" barrel. Plenty for most purposes... But the original Vaquero and New Vaquero will still easily handle my woods load which is a Tier 2 load.Not quite. The .454 loads can be up to 60K psi where the .45 Colt Ruger Only Loads max out at 30K.... Do da' math
.Find table of cylinder sizes here:
Gunblast New Vaquero
and a bit more info if you like
Gunblast New Vaquero Revisited
Well, wouldn't you as a manufacturer? After all it the only 'standard' for .45 Colt. They would say (legally) the same thing for the large frame and Redhawk .45 Colt revolvers as well
.
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Driftwood Johnson
New member
Howdy Again
The cylinder in the center of this photo is from a large frame 'original model' Vaquero. On the left is a cylinder from an Uberti Cattleman, on the right is a 2nd Generation Colt cylinder. All three are chambered for 45 Colt. Notice how much more metal there is surrounding the chambers in the Vaquero cylinder. A New Vaquero cylinder chambered for 45 colt will look very similar to the Uberti and Colt cylinders.
Me too.