California Lead Warning on Handgun Grips

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DaleA

New member
I was looking at the Pachmayr web site getting some info on their rubberish grips

(Disclaimer: I like Pachmayr grips. Way back when, any handgun that came my way almost always sent me to the store to the Pachmayr catalog to see if they had grips for them. Even, (gasp!) single action cowboy style 6-shooters, which I agree should have wooden grips but for me comfort trumps looks/tradition. This was before the advent of the interwebs.)

Anyway I found this warning on the rubber grips I was looking at:

WARNING: This product can expose you to lead, which is known to the State of California to cause cancer, birth defects, or other reproductive harm. For more information go to www.p65warnings.ca.gov
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I wouldn't/didn't ever consider the grips containing any lead in their manufacture but I admit I sure don't know about these things.

So:

1. Do Pachmayr grips contain lead and just by holding them I will be exposed?
2. Are the folk in CA saying I will get lead exposure from shooting?
3. If number 2 is correct then once again CA is being silly and IMhO disingenuous, i.e. they are NOT being truthful.

P.S. I am WAY past the time where this would actually concern/alarm me personally. Like I said I've used and enjoyed their grips for years and years, I'm just curious.
 
What the warning means is the grips contain at least a certain level of lead but then again just about everything contains lead including the water you drink, car exhaust, petroleum products, plastics etc.

From the prop 65 "plain language" site:

For chemicals that are listed as causing cancer, the "no significant risk level” is defined as the level of exposure that would result in not more than one excess case of cancer in 100,000 individuals exposed to the chemical over a 70-year lifetime. In other words, a person exposed to the chemical at the “no significant risk level” for 70 years would not have more than a “one in 100,000” chance of developing cancer as a result of that exposure.

For chemicals that are listed as causing birth defects or reproductive harm, the “no observable effect level” is determined by identifying the level of exposure that has been shown to not pose any harm to humans or laboratory animals. Proposition 65 then requires this “no observable effect level” to be divided by 1,000 in order to provide an ample margin of safety. Businesses subject to Proposition 65 are required to provide a warning if they cause exposures to chemicals listed as causing birth defects or reproductive harm that exceed 1/1000th of the “no observable effect level.”

They don't list the levels so it's just plain guess work and basically a good proposition that was morphed into an overkill (again).

So basically if you hold the pistol in your hand continuously for 70 years you have a one in 100,000 chance of getting cancer from doing so. Of course you probably have a higher chance of getting cancer from second hand smoke than holding the grips for that long and figuring you'd probably be in your mid to late 90's it'll be hard to determine from what contaminant actually caused the cancer.

Just something we on the left coast are doing that is eliminating chemicals from our environment such as lead (sinkers, shot, pencils, etc).
Just think if pencils still contained lead they could imprint the warning right on the side of each one!

I'd be more concerned about lead exposure when shooting than holding a synthetic grip.
 
I don't think I have seen any product in the past ten or twenty years that isn't "known to the State of California to cause cancer, birth defects, or other reproductive harm."

Pay it no mind.
 
What Aguila said. Most anything is hazardous in California. I'm surprised they are not all dead by now.
 
Does the "warning" mean that the grips themselves contain lead or that shooting any gun is hazardous and this is just another phony "caution" CA is using to keep people from buying guns?

Jim
 
California's so full of it, almost everything carries a health warning or two. It's gotten to the point where no one pays any attention to that bs at all. Thereby making all those ridiculous labeling rules meaningless.
 
A very large portion of the products being shipped into the US are made with lead based paint. Especially plastics. This includes the casings for electronics (and likely the materials that are part of the manufacturing process of those grips). The mouse used with desktop computers will likely produce the same lead poisoning as your grips. Something to think about as that mouse gets older and it's paint wares off down to bare plastic. Since SO MUCH gets made in other countries, this becomes completely unavoidable for people. Keep in mind that lead paint is used in places that don't have federal level laws/regulations for it's use. This is part of the problem with having so little being made/produced in the US now. It's been this way for so long now, that most people don't even care anymore. But because it's still technically part of the product and it could be bought/sold in California, that label is required.

Personally, I find it laughable that we will put so much emphasis on lead paint for the walls in our homes but are perfectly fine with lead paint in/on everything else. But ultimately you really are exposed to greater levels of lead just by shooting a firearm.
 
The levels of lead you are exposed to by handling lead ammo or inhaling the vapor released by primers when you shoot will probably far exceed what you'll get from grips. However, there is some truth to what Prndll says above. Lead and other heavy metals are used as ingredients in all sorts of stuff from paints to plastics, as everything from pigments to drying agents. Many people don't know about it or wrongly assume that our government is effectively monitoring everything that comes in from overseas. There are also folks who think it is crazy to worry about things that could have slow, long-term, gradual effects that may be hard to gauge. I hear those arguments on everything from indoor range ventilation to hearing protection. Personally, I tend to lean towards safety when it isn't overwhelmingly inconvenient.
 
The warning did not say the product CONTAINS lead, merely that you would be EXPOSED to it; I am taking that to mean by shooting a gun, not the rubber grips themselves.
 
If that were the case, firearms would be the only place those labels would ever be seen. I've seen these things on pillows (bedding). Your exposed to it by virtue of the substances by which it's made.
 
JWT wrote:
I'm very concerned. I chew constantly on my grips ...
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That's a very bad habit.

Obviously, its a reaction to stress and if you can't identify and mitigate the causes of the stress, you will need to redirect the behavior in some other way.

Have you considered taking up smoking? ;)
 
DaleA wrote:
1. Do Pachmayr grips contain lead and just by holding them I will be exposed?
2. Are the folk in CA saying I will get lead exposure from shooting?
3. If number 2 is correct then once again CA is being silly and IMhO disingenuous, i.e. they are NOT being truthful.
Click to expand...

Lead containing compounds are frequently used in the manufacture of rubber and polymers, but generally the lead appears in the finished product at very low levels. But since lead is one of those chemicals for which there is generally considered to be no "safe" level of exposure, even trace amounts qualify for the warning sticker.

You can find that same sticker on hundreds of other products. Most recently, I found one on a vacuum cleaner. So, no, this is not some California conspiracy to discourage people from shooting.

The reality is that between the lead in the primers and the lead in the bullets that gets flushed out of the gun during cleaning and ends up in minute amounts all over the exterior surface of the gun, shooting DOES expose the shooter to lead.

And if you go to the range and wander around in front of the firing line you'll get exposed to a whole lot more lead. :D
 
The penalties for having a product the state deems dangerous are so severe that the manufacturers put a warning on everything. Steel fishhooks. Plastic bobbers. Don't even think of pulling into a gas station.

The warning labels are so common that they have become useless.
 
natman said:
The penalties for having a product the state deems dangerous are so severe that the manufacturers put a warning on everything. Steel fishhooks. Plastic bobbers. Don't even think of pulling into a gas station.

The warning labels are so common that they have become useless.
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Precisely.

The sign pictured below exemplifies the absurd extremes to which companies have gone to avoid even the slightest possibility of violating Prop 65. (These signs are all over the park, and IIRC are even posted on the perimeter fences.)

disney_sign.jpg
 
The grips on a handgun can pick up lead during the act of shooting. You can also transfer lead to the grips with your hands. There are hand wipes available that remove the lead from your hands and equipment if you are concerned about it. Eating food or drinking fluids while at the range is another way you can be exposed to lead. I have been doing all those "bad" things for the past 45 years and have never had elevated levels of lead in my system. The four children I raised are not retarded or affected by lead exposure in any way. People who cast lead bullets are exposed to a lot more lead than you can get at the range and probably should have blood tests annually to monitor their lead levels. I don't know anyone who has had elevated lead levels except a couple of guys who worked in a smelter in the early '70s.
 
Lead in it's metallic state is relatively harmless. Lead oxide is very toxic. The lead in paint is lead oxide. The lead we breathed in from burning leaded fuel was lead oxide. The white crust on things like dug up civil war bullets is lead oxide.

Lead like what you get splashed on you at the range, and the black residue you get on your hands from handling lead is metallic lead and not very toxic. The only real danger would be the metallic lead turning into lead oxide very quickly which isn't very likely.

If you work around a great quantity of metallic lead, like a foundry, there is bound to be a bunch of lead oxide lurking around.

I'm not a expert on this matter. If someone knows more about this subject, please chime in.

This is IMPORTANT.
 
arquebus,
You are correct in that metallic lead is not dangerous. The biggest problem associated with metalic lead is breathing the vapors. This allows metallic lead to get into your lungs where it can change to lead oxide and be absorbed before your body can expel it. Eating metallic lead dust is not a problem because it isn't absorbed in the digestive tract. It just passes through for the most part given time. Since there is no oxygen in the digestive tract conversion is highly unlikely. Lead salts, lead oxide, lead sulphate, and lead chlorate, can be absorbed and raise your lead levels and each causes its own problems. The body will clean that stuff out unless continued exposure occurs at a faster rate than the body can get rid of it.
 
"Many thanks. Under what circumstance would you be exposed to lead vapors ?"

I would think poorly vented indoor shooting ranges would be one place that could be a problem. Another would be casting your own bullets in a poorly ventilated area could be another source for the problem. Probably shooting cast bullets in "dirty" powder loads might add lead residue on your hands. A good washing of the hands after shooting should take care of that if you feel it is a concern.
Frankly, I started shooting and casting lead bullets in rifles and handguns when I turned sixteen and that was back in August of 1964. Had my lead levels checked a few years back and was considered to be in the normal range for a kid that grew up supposedly gnawing on the lead painted bars of my crib. :rolleyes: I'm sure none of my kids had any form of birth defects and all have succeeded quite well in life.
Paul B.
 
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