CA Gun Show and White Supremacy

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PKAY

New member
Just yesterday I attended the Crossroads of the West gun show at the Big 'A' stadium in Anaheim. I've been attending gun shows since I was a kid, and this one was no different (except one used to be able to buy over the counter, cash and carry).

As with all shows, there are book and periodical vendors selling everything from military manuals to historical photos and documents from all sides of all the wars we've been in and some we haven't. One vendor stood out, however. While offering the stuff noted above, he devoted about half of his space to books and periodicals devoted to Aryan Nation and other white supremacist groups. His display sported a large flag that I've seen before as representing the group in Idaho who just got their butt sued.

There is a First Amendment, and I don't have a problem with his believing whatever he wants to. The folks attending the show were not flocking to his display. It would have been nice, however, and quite interesting to have a display from JPFO right next to his.

What do you TFLers think about this?

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Safe shooting - PKAY
 
I think yesterday was some kind of anniversary for them. We had a march here. All of 11 extremists showed up. Some of them travelled in from Indiana and Tennesee. We had the entire department on duty to protect them and were augmented by 5 state troopers. They got out their Nazi flag and their Confederate flag and their Aryan Nations flag. One member wore purple and green Klan robes.

I think that this is the price we pay for living in a semi-free society. Our advice to those who wanted to protest their presence was that if we ignored them long enough, they'd go away. We had a few cat-calls at them but that was the limit of it.

Now this is a public street and the First Amendment applies. I think that a gunshow sponsor could limit what kind of people he rents space to. Certainly we should try to maintain a good image. But then what else would you limit? No Paladin Press titles?

Are we showing that we respect all freedoms or just projecting a negative stereotype about ourselves by letting them into the gunshows? It's a tough question. If I were a show promoter it would be guns and gun related items only. NRA, SAF CCRBA, JPFO, LEAA would be the only groups I'd rent space to. But then that's just me.

Jeff
 
Thanks for the post, Jeff. I can imagine if the local media got a hold of it. And they may still. Who knows? I am uncomfortable drawing the line. After all, militaria of all types and the attendant literature associated with it is purveyed at gun shows, including items from those we fought and defeated as mentioned earlier.

But this was something I have never seen at a gun show.
 
I have seen this guy at the Crossroads show here in Phoenix. If it is the same guy, his name is Dieter, and he is a hard core klansman. He is a nice enough to talk to, but I just don't agree with his social/political views.

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Yeah, I got a permit to carry,it's called the friggin Constitution.---Ted Nugent

"Glock 26: 17 rounds of concealed carry DEATH comming your way from out of nowhere!!! THAT'S FIREPOWER, BABY!!!"

Taurus 605: Five hits of .357 MAG that will just ruin your day, Scumbag!!!!
 
While I agree with the First Amendment perspective, it does our cause little good to have radicals (right or left) to be seen in our company as their presence could be manipulated to protray us under a false light. Remember, photographs leave more lasting mental impressions than the printed word.
 
Make the shows nonpolitical except for RKBA info (assuming it is without bigotry).

As I have said before, the association of the RKBA with bigots and loonies is one of our own self-inflicted wounds. Most of us aren't like that but that's what the public thinks.
 
Everyone is entitled to their own opinion as long as it doesn't harm anyone else. They have the right to be there but you also have the right to trade or not trade with them. I would make it a point not to patronize any vendor so affiliated.

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Those who use arms well cultivate the Way and keep the rules.Thus they can govern in such a way as to prevail over the corrupt- Sun Tzu, The Art of War
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by EnochGale:
As I have said before, the association of the RKBA with bigots and loonies is one of our own self-inflicted wounds. Most of us aren't like that but that's what the public thinks.[/quote]

This guilt by association seems to go both ways . The reason that these people have the success , albeit limited , is because the overwhelming number of minorities that we see or hear about are on COPS or 6 O'Clock news getting busted . When a suspect that the police are searching for is shown it is almost always a minority .
On the other hand when a guy is caught hurting minorities or defacing their property they will very often be associated with the Klan . If not by them then by the media . I saw one fool on T.V. being hauled in for doing something stupid screaming " Power to the Klan ." Even if he was not a member they are implicated in his foolish action .
So when someone does something stupid with a weapon it shows us in a bad light since the rights he has used to do bad are the same rights we are fighting for .
The rights of people are a tricky issue . If they don't want a Nazi flag marching down the street then the right to the Star of David outside a synagogue in public view could be considered offensive to this person as well . Athiests want all religious displays kept off public property . Christians proudly wear the Cross on their bodies as a sign of their faith . These are all First Ammendment exercises and must be treated as such .
If they deny this guy a table he gets more publicity than if every person at the gun show stopped at his table and asked questions .
If enough people stopped at his table and ridiculed him ( First Ammendment again ) he might fold his tent and leave . Unless his arguement holds water . In which case he belongs there . Only those that stop at the table will know . Will this guy pass the test ? Our founding fathers were considered radicals at first . The rights that he wants are the same ones you want also . Unless he actually does harm he is just a person with an opinion .
Rosie wants to take your gun and put you in jail . Is she any better or worse ?



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TOM
SASS AMERICAN LEGION NRA GOA
 
At least the SOB is open about it.

There was some dude operating in Florida who sold pre-packaged survival bulk foods at gun shows. Didn't seem abnormal at all, but one of their customers got home and inside some of the packages was extensive racist materials.

THAT was intolerable. I advised the customer to tell the gun show promoter what was going on, and I think he did.

Jim
 
Yea, just a bunch of good ole boys.... :(

If that sort ever came to power the only "gun shows" you would be likely to see are called "firing squads".
 
12-34hom - I agree. Last night I watched 3 hours of "Hitler Youth" on the History Channel. Your "firing squad" comment has ample historical precedent. Were these misanthropes ever to come to power, a very dark age would ensue. Hate is an all-consuming feast where the hater is the one consumed; humanity lost, brain dulled, inured to murder most foul. Security through purity! What a concept. Last time I checked, blood ran red no matter one's skin shade. History means something very different for these folks.

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Safe shooting - PKAY
 
I've been seriously bitched at, because I'll go up to tables where folks are pushing that crap, from the Turner Diaries stuff on through the really sick stuff, and tell 'em that I wish that they wouldn't associate themselves with what has become a very political topic. One major dealer in this area sells a lot of books, and I've told him that as long as he has one copy of one of those missives on display, I'm not going to patronize him. 99% of his stock interests me, but...

Geeze - All we need is some reporter wandering in, and going off on the idiots pushing klucker lit at gun shows... Everyone will be painted with the same brush.
 
He has the right to believe what he wants.
But the show is private and the owner of the show can keep out inappropriate tables.

Thus, the little speech about freedom is irrelevant to a privately run operation.
It has nothing to do with your right to worship. Build a church or dance in the woods. You have the right.

I have the right to tell show owners that they are fools to have such stuff and personally if they have this stuff just to make a buck, they stink.

Pigs.
 
PKAY: I went to that show on saturday...didn't notice that guy however. Only time I ever saw something like that was at The Great Western Gun Show at the pomona fairgrounds.
 
TwoGuns - I don't recall whether he was on the upper or lower floor; they're set out almost identically. He was on the right hand side about half way down. All of his White Supremacy materials were to the front. Prominently displayed and supported at each end just above was the flag mentioned earlier.
 
Yep...he was there.

My wife and I were strolling up and down the aisles..she looking for a new holster for her HK USP...me wanting to buy everything as usual :D

We got to his table and were looking at the assorted political books before we looked up. Then, as we moved down the table, we noticed the books got more and more extremist. We suddenly stopped and looked at each other...and moved to the other side of the aisle. Once up the other aisle, she said to me..."I've always heard about people like that, I've just never really seen one..." Gave me the creeps, personally. But definately reminds me of the types of behavior we need to be on guard against. I'll defend his right to talk all about it. And I'd defend my right to prevent that crap from happening in my community...so we wrote a letter to Crossroads about it (actually the wife handled that). Just a quick one pager explaining that although he may have paid the fee, that we didn't appreciate shopping where someone was openly purveying hate literature. Since he was the only one, and wasn't getting much business, I'd be surprised if he is at the next one in November.

aiki



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The fox provides for himself, but God provides for the lion--R. Kipling
 
As perverted as this material is, these people have the right to express their opinions. When you start talking about
censoring someone for their political or
religious views, you then have the same conditions that existed when the king of england was running things.

It is one thing to not buy their literature, but, when actively seek to have this stuff removed from the shows, you only hurt yourself and your fellow Americans.

Today it is Nazi stuff, tommorrow reloading manuals.

Waterdog
 
As a defender of truth - I am obligated to protect his first amendment rights to say his crap - to act the fool and display his ignorance.

And

Should he cross the line - I have the right to stomp a mud hole through him.

Remember that.
 
It's important to remember your parallel 1st amendment right to call people like this fools to their face.
 
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