CA Attorney General Plans Ban On More Semi-auto Rifles

S

sholling

New member
Word is out that California's fascist Attorney Generalissimo is planning on reclassifying all semi-auto rifles with detachable magazines as assault-rifles. Under the law rifles with any 2 of the following "evil" features is covered under the ban.

1) A pistol grip or thumbhole stock

2) A detachable magazine

3) a flash hider

According to the shop keepers I spoke with the AG office has decided that any rifle stock other than the old style straight stocks found on some lever actions rifles are "pistol grip" stocks. This means that the AG is reinterpreting (rewriting?) the law so that it now bans your Mini-14s, Mini-30s, and other previously exempted rifles.

Remember to vote in November.
 
I've been told that on 01/01/2000, the NRA, CRPA, and possibly the GOA, SAF are going to file a suit against SB23 and SB15. Screw the AG!

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Vigilantibus et non dormientibus jura subveniunt
 
These politicians have too much power and are using it to make law abiding citizens into criminals.

Something has to be done to stop this abusive use of power. One man should not have the power to disarm us. This Kalifornia Attorney General is really out of control.

As far as the NRA filing a suit against SB23, it's about time. They had better do something besides send me a large amount of paper in the mail every month requesting me to send them more money.
 
Well, this would make perfect sense to me. After all, hasn't the SKS buyback scheme ( http://www.sksbuyback.org ) been a tremendous success ... ? ;)

Lockyer is a smiling, fascist bozo. The NRA and others better push this guy back, because California tends to 'infect' the rest of us.
 
If the NRA doesn't file suit, then I will take back my argument to join them.

One interesting question though, that the gun community must ask, is why does CA keep electing these type of folk? The RKBA
political strategy in CA seem a flop.

In TX, Bush campaigned in some part on passing a CHL bill. If it is the demographics in CA ,
then the NRA better stop preaching to the choir in CA to get more donations and spend some time on messages to those folk who don't like them.
 
Glenn,

I'll admit that there are a lot of liberals here in California, but except for a few places like LA (specifically the 'Valley') and San Francisco (where liberalism is just off the scale, and most would consider Lenin too conservative) they are in the minority.

The biggest problem here is that the media have done just an incredible job of demonizing firearms. TV news casters and left wing newspapers like the LA Times trumpet every crime and accident that involves the misuse of a firearm. They also display a picture of a gun in the background when reporting ANY violent crime - firearm related or not. What they will NOT do is report incidences of self defense using a firearm.

The fact is that the media in general has declared total war on the Second Amendment, and California is just their most recent success story. Most people (not just in California) just don't know enough to understand that they are being manipulated. Once they get the facts most people start seeing our side of the argument as the correct side, but there just isn't any way to out shout the press. This is why I've always argued the every gun owner should include some Time-Warner, Fox, CBS, GE (NBC), and/or Disney (ABC) stock in their portfolio - even if it's just a few shares. 100 pissed off stockholders representing 10,000+ pissed off stockholders at the annual stockholder meetings would be enough to cause serious policy changes in their news divisions! Don't forget that management lives in constant fear of pissed off stockholders.

The other thing that happened in California is that the Republican Party went out of its way to alienate the Latin community that makes up about 40% of the southern half of the state, and about 30% of the total vote. These people are mostly politically conservative, but the Republicans party leadership got them to come out in droves to vote Democrat. Dumb!!!! They also limited our choices to the Republican gun grabber or the Democrat gun grabber, because they fell for the media's BS too . When the choices were limited to which gun grabber too few bothered to vote.

Folks, if you don't get off your butts and support the Second Amendment with votes, $$$, and letters to newspapers etc. (and not just gun rags - preaching to the saved is a waste of time) it WILL happen to you too!
 
I'd say this rumor is in error. First of all, SB 23 already labels as an "assault weapon" any rifles that have ONE of those features in addition to a detachable magazine.

Here's the applicable section:

12276.1. (a) Notwithstanding Section 12276, "assault weapon" shall also mean any of the following:
(1) A semiautomatic, centerfire rifle that has the capacity to accept a detachable magazine and any one of the following:
(A) A pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon.
(B) A thumbhole stock.
(C) A folding or telescoping stock.
(D) A grenade launcher or flare launcher.
(E) A flash suppressor.
(F) A forward pistol grip.
(2) A semiautomatic, centerfire rifle that has a fixed magazine with the capacity to accept more than 10 rounds.
(3) A semiautomatic, centerfire rifle that has an overall length of less than 30 inches.
(4) A semiautomatic pistol that has the capacity to accept a detachable magazine and any one of the following:
(A) A threaded barrel, capable of accepting a flash suppressor, forward handgrip, or silencer.
(B) A second handgrip.
(C) A shroud that is attached to, or partially or completely encircles, the barrel that allows the bearer to fire the weapon
without burning his or her hand, except a slide that encloses the barrel.
(D) The capacity to accept a detachable magazine at some location outside of the pistol grip. [INCLUDING THE "BROOMHANDLE" MAUSER OF THE BOER WAR ERA -- THOSE EVIL 100 YEAR OLD "ASSAULT PISTOLS"]
(5) A semiautomatic pistol with a fixed magazine that has the capacity to accept more than 10 rounds.
(6) A semiautomatic shotgun that has both of the following:
(A) A folding or telescoping stock.
(B) A pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon, thumbhole stock, or vertical handgrip.
(7) A semiautomatic shotgun that has the ability to accept a detachable magazine.
(8) Any shotgun with a revolving cylinder.
(b) "Assault weapon" does not include any antique firearm.
(c) The following definitions shall apply under this section:
(1) "Magazine" shall mean any ammunition feeding device.
(2) "Capacity to accept more than 10 rounds" shall mean capable of accommodating more than 10 rounds, but shall not be construed to include a feeding device that has been permanently altered so that it
cannot accommodate more than 10 rounds.
(3) "Antique firearm" means any firearm manufactured prior to January 1, 1899.
 
Bruegger,

I'd say it's probably not a rumor 'cuz one shop owner called DOJ while I was standing there and they confirmed that there is some kind plan of this type in the works but that it's not yet complete. What DOJ is saying is that ANY gripping area that extends below the top of the trigger is a pistol grip as defined under Section E of SB23.
 
Have to agree with Sholling on this one.

Once the legislation is passed, the "interpretation" of that legislation can be flung farther and farther afield.

Two examples from our (Australian) experience:

1. A "firearm" here now includes an air rifle, a non-firing replica, a movie "prop" gun, a speargun, a toy gun, a slingshot ... and so on, ad nauseam. They just keep extending the list -- because they can.

2. Here, legislation simply stated that you are required to maintain "control" (in safety terms) over a firearm while transporting it in a vehicle. That interpretation has now been expaned by the authorities to mean some or all of the following (depending on which State you live in):
• you can not leave your car while the firearm is in it
• the firearm must be in a separate "theft-proof" container to the bolt, magazine and/or ammo
• containers must be locked
• containers must be chained or fixed immovably to the inside of the vehicle
• firearms must not be readily identifiable as such from outside the vehicle

I think it's the old "give the basta*ds an inch and they'll take a mile syndrome".

B
 
in case you miss the thread in General:

from Ar list
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Your deadline is March 31, 2000.

California AR owners, please read this carefully. I've said it =
before, at least three times. Yes, SB23 does give you until =
12/31/2000 to register your AR. BUT REGISTRATION IS NOT ENOUGH!

SB23 also contains a clause that says that all guns banned as of =
1/1/2000 [By effect of new Pen. Code =A7 12276.1], must be sold, =
moved out of state, rendered inoperable, or otherwise you must get a =
permit from the DOJ. Here, you read the law...

Sec. 12285(b) Any person who ... (B) lawfully possessed
a firearm subsequently declared to be an assault =
weapon
pursuant to Section 12276.5, or subsequently defined =
as an
assault weapon pursuant to Section 12276.1*, shall, =
within
90 days, render the weapon permanently inoperable, =
sell the
weapon to a licensed gun dealer, obtain a permit from =
the
Department of Justice in the same manner as specified =
in
Article 3 (commencing with Section 12230) of Chapter =
2, or
remove the weapon from this state.

*Section 12276.1 is the NEW "assault weapon" definition that bans =
your rifle because it has a detachable magazine and a pistol grip =
etc. This is NEW, effective 1/1/2000.

Let me say it again, in case you don't get it. There are two things =
an AR owner must do to satisfy SB23:

1. Register the gun within one year of 1/1/2000.

2. Get a permit from the D.O.J. within 90 days of 1/1/2000.

Now, nobody's talking about #2, not the media, not the NRA, not CRPA, =
not Chuck Michel (NRA lawyer), and certainly not Atty. General =
Lockyear's office. You may think I'm nuts, but I do have a degree =
from Harvard Law School, I was a Fellow of the State Assembly and I =
practiced law for 8 years. I also showed this provision to a retired =
Superior Court Judge who agreed that it imposes a requirement to get =
a DOJ permit within 90 days. He also added that it means that anyone =
who registers an "assault weapon" without getting a DOJ permit will =
be incriminating themselves. His words, not mine.

Why don't the gun rights groups talk about this? They are either =
saving it for the lawsuit, or they are ignorant, or they are hoping =
that nobody will notice. If they've read the statute, they also know =
it will be impossible for their members to protect themselves in time =
and don't want to be bearers of very bad news.

I repeat, you could be subject to criminal penalties come April 1, =
2000.

Ignore the 90-day rule at your peril.

Don't count on this 90-day rule to be overlooked. HCI will litigate =
to enforce it just as they litigated to overturn Dan Lungren's SKS =
amnesty. And HCI won.[/quote]
 
DZ,

I re-read the bill and you are right but I've checked out the DOJ's web page and didn't find anything about obtaining a permit. WTF? I'm confused. Also, how do you get a permit for that? Here's the link for the DOJ web page. Click on new laws for 2000 and new laws for high capacity mags and assault weapons.
http://caag.state.ca.us/firearms/infobuls/index.html

Corbon91

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thats what the poster of the original message on AR15 list said

here is the Article: http://caag.state.ca.us/firearms/dwcl/12275.htm
ARTICLE 3. REGISTRATION AND PERMITS

12285. (a) Any person who lawfully possesses an assault weapon, as defined in Section 12276, prior to June 1, 1989, shall register the firearm by January
1, 1991, and any person who lawfully possessed an assault weapon prior to the date it was specified as an assault weapon pursuant to Section 12276.5 shall
register the firearm within 90 days, with the Department of Justice pursuant to those procedures that the department may establish. Except as provided in
subdivision (a) of Section 12280, any person who lawfully possessed an assault weapon prior to the date it was defined as an assault weapon pursuant to Section
12276.1, and which was not specified as an assault weapon under Section 12276 or 12276.5, shall register the firearm within one year of the effective date of
Section 12276.1, with the department pursuant to those procedures that the department may establish. The registration shall contain a description of the firearm that
identifies it uniquely, including all identification marks, the full name, address, date of birth, and thumbprint of the owner, and any other information that the
department may deem appropriate. The department may charge a fee for registration of up to twenty dollars ($20) per person but not to exceed the actual
processing costs of the department. After the department establishes fees sufficient to reimburse the department for processing costs, fees charged shall increase at
a rate not to exceed the legislatively approved annual cost-of-living adjustment for the department's budget or as otherwise increased through the Budget Act.
(b)(1) Except as provided in paragraph (2), no assault weapon possessed pursuant to this section may be sold or transferred on or after January 1, 1990, to
anyone within this state other than to a licensed gun dealer, as defined in subdivision (c) of Section 12290, or as provided in Section 12288. Any person who (A)
obtains title to an assault weapon registered under this section or that was possessed pursuant to subdivision (g) or (i) of Section 12280 by bequest or intestate
succession, or (B) lawfully possessed a firearm subsequently declared to be an assault weapon pursuant to Section 12276.5, or subsequently defined as an assault
weapon pursuant to Section 12276.1, shall, within 90 days, render the weapon permanently inoperable, sell the weapon to a licensed gun dealer, obtain a permit
from the Department of Justice in the same manner as specified in Article 3 (commencing with Section 12230) of Chapter 2, or remove the weapon from this state.
A person who lawfully possessed a firearm that was subsequently declared to be an assault weapon pursuant to Section 12276.5 may alternatively register the
firearm within 90 days of the declaration issued pursuant to subdivision (f) of Section 12276.5.

Chapter 2 is for MACHINE GUNS! http://caag.state.ca.us/firearms/dwcl/12200.htm

here is the relevent part:
ARTICLE 3. PERMITS

12230. The Department of Justice may issue permits for the possession, manufacture, and transportation or possession, manufacture, or transportation of
machineguns, upon a satisfactory showing that good cause exists for the issuance thereof to the applicant for the permit, but no permit shall be issued to a person
who is under 18 years of age.

12231. Applications for permits shall be filed in writing, signed by the applicant if an individual, or by a member or officer qualified to sign if the applicant
is a firm or corporation, and shall state the name, business in which engaged, business address and a full description of the use to which the firearms are to be put.
Applications and permits shall be uniform throughout the state on forms prescribed by the Department of Justice.
Each applicant for a permit shall pay at the time of filing his or her application a fee determined by the Department of Justice not to exceed the application
processing costs of the Department of Justice. A permit granted pursuant to this article may be renewed one year from the date of issuance, and annually thereafter,
upon the filing of a renewal application and the payment of a permit renewal fee not to exceed the application processing costs of the Department of Justice. After
the department establishes fees sufficient to reimburse the department for processing costs, fees charged shall increase at a rate not to exceed the legislatively
approved annual cost-of-living adjustments for the department's budget.

12232. Every person, firm or corporation to whom a permit is issued shall keep it on his person or at the place where the firearms are kept. The permit
shall be open to inspection by any peace officer or any other person designated by the authority issuing the permit.

12233. Permits issued in accordance with this chapter may be revoked by the issuing authority at any time when it appears that the need for the firearms
has ceased or that the holder of the permit has used the firearms for purposes other than those allowed by the permit or that the holder of the permit has not
exercised great care in retaining custody of any weapons possessed under the permit.

IMHO
THIS SUCKS!

dZ
 
Please tell me i am wrong!
it looks like CA residents have less than 90 days to obtain a machine gun permit for their new "assault rifles"

dZ

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"walk softly and carry a big stick, one that goes bang in .308 is fine"
 
I could be wrong, but I think the permit is only for transfers after 1/1/2000. There won't be anything there because they will never planned to issue permits.
 
seen this yet? http://www.regagun.org/faq.html
Can I take an assault weapon to a gunsmith for repairs?

Yes. However, you cannot leave it with the gunsmith unless they hold a California Assault Weapons permit.
Otherwise, you must remain with the firearm while it is being repaired. If the assault weapon must be shipped to
the manufacturer for repairs, a firearms dealer with an assault weapons permit must handle the shipping.

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"walk softly and carry a big stick, one that goes bang in .308 is fine"
 
http://www.turners.com/html/SB23.htm
SB23, the new "Assault Weapons" bill,
was signed in July of 1999 and was set
to go into effect on January 1, 2000. To
date, the California Department of
Justice has yet to clearly define the
class of weapons that will be banned.

The DOJ has recently published its
preliminary guidelines for the
enforcement of SB23. As these
guidelines are written, it appears that
any centerfire caliber, semi-automatic
rifle, with a detachable magazine, will
be classified as an "assault weapon".
This new definition is clearly beyond the
scope of the initially expected impact of
SB23.

In order to protect our customers and
our employees from potential criminal
and legal jeopardy, Turner’s
Outdoorsman will suspend the sales of
all centerfire caliber, semi-automatic,
detachable magazine rifles effective
January 1, 2000.

This suspension of sales will remain in
effect until the DOJ establishes its final
enforcement rules. All customers are
urged to contact the DOJ directly with
any questions regarding these
enforcement guidelines.
 
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