Bullet weight v. felt recoil

eddiejoe333

New member
Perhaps it is a silly question, but in a given cartridge, say .44Mag, will a lighter bullet, pushed by the same amount of powder, have a lighter felt rcoil than a heavier bullet? I ask because I'm considering a Ruger Redhawk in a 4-inch barrel.

Thanks.
 
Felt recoil correlates best with bullet momentum. Multiply the muzzle velocity by the bullet weight, don't worry about units. Then compare values for different loads - higher momentum, higher felt recoil.
 
What Carbine says is true. I'll add to it.

Heavier rounds have less muzzle velocity because there is more mass to store more energy during flight and at impact.

Longer barrels have, in general, higher muzzle velocity, but the mass of the extra barrel length compensates for that.

I have fired a 4 inch Taurus Tracker. I can honestly say if I ever am looking for another high powered revolver (hard to get something else when you already have a S&W 460V) but want easier to find ammo, the first thing that will come to mind is a Taurus Tracker or something like it (like the Ruger you mentioned, hard to beat a Ruger, I found out just how hard by looking at a snubby .357 for my dad.).

But if all this info confuses you, just focus on what Carbine said.
 
I don't doubt the technical data above, but when it comes to actual shooting I simply have a hard time telling the difference. If someone gave me a blindfold test I would probably fail. Now I can tell if I am shooting +P etc.

I was just shooting .45ACP the other day in 185g and 230g...all non +P. I could not tell the difference.
 
I had a Taurus Tracker in .357. It was ok, but I traded it for an S&W 65. Like the .357, I know I can use .44Specials in the Ruger, but I'd like to stay with the longer case. I believe I can achieve my desired result with handloading. I was wondering if it would be worth the effort, and it sounds like it might. Thanks for all the input.
 
Is not recoil the result not only of the momentum of the bullet but the momentum of the burned powder?

In rifles the majority of the recoil is from the powder gases.

The gases roughly equal to the weight of the powder are expelled at super high velocity and hence: mass times velocity = momentum or recoil.

That is why a suppressor is a very effective muzzle brake.
 
Variables Affect Recoil

I shot 6 full power loads from a model 29 with a 6" barrel and that was enough for me. I shot 6 full power loads out of my Bro. in Laws Ruger Super Black with a 7 " barrel and nothing to it. By the way the bullets went thru a guardrail at 40' with no problem. My 357 6" barrel only made a dent. Lots of variables related to recoil. Best, Lyle

If you can't shoot faster than the other guy; shoot straighter. Chic Gaylord
 
Without even attempting to be scientific about this...

... I will say that, subjectively, the nastiest recoiling loads I've shot through my GP100 were hot 125gr magnums. The 158 recoil (and bang and flash, too) didn't come close to the 125's.

YMMV.
 
Yes officer, it wasn't me

By the way the bullets went thru a guardrail at 40' with no problem. My 357 6" barrel only made a dent.


LOL!:rolleyes:
Yes officer, it wasn't me that shot that hole through the GUARD RAIL!
It was my brother!

Why were two responsible Fireline members shooting at a guard rail?:eek:
 
I can comfortably shoot my Ruger Redhawk with most loads up to max. and up to 240 grain bullets. I am not very big but shooting is controllable.
But......BIG BUT......when I put in 300 gr. bullets with max charges the story changes dramatically. These are very difficult to control rounds and very tiring to shoot. A 'practice' session with 300 grainers is no more than one cylinder, six shots.
Same with my 30-06. I can shoot almost any bullet and charge with no problem. But, again, the heaviest rounds, 220 grains, with max charges are whomper-stompers that I simply do not enjoy shooting. More than I want. Fortunately, I do not have occasion to use that combination in the '06.
Answer is a definite YES.
 
First, recoil is based on the simple formula that the mass times the speed of the "stuff" (bullet, powder gas, unburned powder) going in one direction equals the mass times the speed of the "stuff" (gun, scope, sling) going the other way. This is Newton's "equal and opposite" law.

But the main component of the forward moving "stuff" is the bullet. It moves fast and goes far. The main component of the backward moving "stuff" is the gun. But the gun is heavier, so its speed is less and it doesn't go as far or as fast.

Recoil begins when the bullet begins to move. If the bullet doesn't move (if the barrel is blocked), there is no recoil. (Hatcher's experiments confirmed this and, incidentally, the M1903 rifle he used did NOT blow up.) Further, if the bullet cannot move and there is no recoil, a recoil operated pistol, like the M1911, will not operate. My own experiments have confirmed that.

So, with any given weight of bullet, powder, etc., and any given weight of gun, the recoil will be the same IF THE GUN IS FREE TO MOVE. But the gun is not free to move when being held by the shooter, so his body enters the equation and becomes part of the rearward moving mass, further slowing and restricting the movement of the gun.

OK, so what about "perceived recoil"? What about what we feel when we touch off a .44 Magnum? That is where such things as stock/grip design, stock and grip material, and similar items come in. If the buttstock of a rifle came to a sharp point, so the momentum was concentrated in a pinpoint, that rifle would be quite uncomfortable to shoot (to put it mildly). But if the stock is wide so the momentum is well distributed, firing the rifle will be pain free. A recoil pad, which spreads the momentum over time as the pad compresses, also reduces felt recoil.

Given a certain bullet mass and velocity, and a certain gun mass, there is nothing we can do to reduce free recoil. But there is a lot we can do to reduce felt recoil.

Jim
 
Answer To The Guard Rail Question

Dear High Valley Ranch; Good eye. This guardrail has been beside a trial on my Father-in Laws property for over 40 years that I know of. I believe that the county widened the road prior to that and they probably disguarded it. But thanks for being on the ball, we may need to remind each other as fellow gun ownrers to be responsible. It's out in the county and legal to shoot there. Thanks, Lyle
 
Just joshing. I am sure that FF members would not do anything that was not proper, now would we!

Thanks for the explanation, though.


Careful shooting at metal, though, because that round that just dented might have richocheted somewhere.

I think there is a youtube video of someone who accidentally shot the metal frame and it came back and hit him in the head.
A fixed guard rail is different than a swing plate or one that is designed for plate shooting.
 
I've been thinking about building a data recorder for recoil ( in my spare time, ha what spare time)

It would consist of a fixture that holds the gun like your hand and some strain gauges to measure forces in the X , Y , Z axes. I could get away with a single axis recorder if the gun was restrained along the bore axis.

The goal would be to separate recoil caused by the bullet moving and the recoil caused by burning powder after the bullet leaves the barrel.

The shape of the recoil event could also be recorded. A fast powder should show a short high peak while a slower powder longer and lower even if the bullet reaches the same velocity at the end of the barrel. Think of it this way, a car needs to be rolling at 20 MPH at the 300 ft mark. Get in the car and smoothly accelerate so you hit 20 exactly at the 300 ft mark then let of the gas. Now with the car sitting at the starting line, light off a rocket that burns for 1 second but the car still needs to rolling 20MPH at the 300 ft mark.

I'd also expect a faster powder to have less muzzle blast than slower powder that is still burning after bullet has left the bore. However testing is the only way to confirm all of this.
 
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