Bullet seating depth issues

J

jetinteriorguy

New member
I'm having such issues with seating bullets for my AR in .223 Wylde. I'm getting variances of up to .010" and I believe it's due to how the bullets are being deformed by the seating die. Ive tried three different dies, RCBS, Lee, and Now my Forster Micrometer seating die. I tried using the hot glue method and that didn't work, the glue wouldn't stay in the die. Then I put some of the steel/putty type epoxy in and it worked great for a while, but it eventually disintegrated and I was right back where I started. I'm open to any ideas, or maybe I'm just overthinking this and it's no big deal. I've been thinking of taking some valve grinding compound and jigging up the seating stem and putting a bullet in a drill press and just using this to grind the seating stem to a better fitting shape. But this method worries me about keeping it concentric and not ruining the seating stem.
 
first thing I would ask myself is what are the odds of getting three bad seating dies in a row.

what kind of bullets are you using and what method are you using when you measuring them
 
I agree with dawg , need more information . How are you setting up the dies , prepping your brass , are you using a compressed load and what bullet are you using . Never had to form a seating stem , VLD bullets they may not position in the stem , if that is the issue a call to the die company may be the best way to go .
 
FWIW, I was experiencing a similar problem with my 308 handloads. After trying adjusting and re adjusting and new dies, I drilled the seating die stem so the stem would only touch the ogive of the bullet, not the point. I also measured my Nosler HPBT bullets and found some difference and on close inspection, I found the mouth of the HP was uneven and on some were a bit ragged (Nosler Seconds?). I tried some Sierra "match" bullets and the .008" variation shrunk to .001"-.002"...
 
I'm using two sizes of Hornady hollow point boat tail match bullets, both 68 grain and 75 grain. I'm loading them in LC brass that's been sized so the shoulder is "bumped" .003", and neck sized using a Lee collet neck sizer with a .001 undersize mandrel. I'm annealing in between body sizing and neck sizing and all brass is trimmed to the same length. I'm loading them on compressed loads, which could be the problem and I am going to try reducing the loads to see if it helps. So far the only experimenting I've tried is sizing the necks using the following method. First with the Lee collet sizer and standard mandrel, then collet sizing with the undersized mandrel. Then using the RCBS die with the standard expander button, and the same with a Lee die with a standard expander button. The bullets are still deforming with all these methods. I'm measuring these with the Hornady system from base to "ogive" with my digital caliper. I guess other than just trying to seat a few with no powder to see if it's the compressed load causing this, I feel I've eliminated anything else beside the shape of the seating stem that could do this. I just got the Forster die hoping it would eliminate this problem, but no luck.
 
what exactly do you mean deforming ? I canot imagine needing enough seating pressure to deform the copper. Mikld's suggestion is a good one
 
There is actually a circular dent around the bullet about half way up. But, I believe I've figured it out. I just seated ten bullets into empty cases and they were perfect and all seated to the same exact depth. So, must. Be the charge is so compressed the pressure on the bullet is enough to deform it. I've never had this happen before, but I worked this load up at a much shallower depth, then tried to fine tune it using Berger Bullets method. In doing this I found they were more accurate by seating them quite deep, but this is what apparently has caused the deforming. So I guess I have two choices, back off on the charge until they no longer deform, or seat them further out. But, since I've already shot them seated out when working up this load, I'll try reducing the charge to see what happens. I'm going to go back to my original load workup and look for a node at a lower charge and then redo the depth test if there is a lower node. Thanks for the suggestions, seems like having these conversations with you all Spurs my brain into more of an analytical mode and then I get things figured out.
 
hope you have it figured out. Reloading is really a very simple process, it just has a number of steps to get it done precisely. For whatever it is worth but base to tip has never had any effect on my ammo when I single load as long as the base to ogive measurement is consistent
 
Glad you figured it out , backing off on the load and giving more jump seating the bullet deeper you may be in the same node . If your seating goes well it will tighten your groups even more . Your not new at this from reading your responses , not a problem with the seating dies . Never like the idea or reforming dies to solve a problem . Most of the time it's something we are doing . Good luck .

Chris
 
Funny how you can load for years, read a ton of stuff to learn more, and yet until you actually experience an issue sometimes the simplest things can throw you. When I first started loading in the early 80’s the only sources were using manuals, and if you were lucky enough to have a mentor or two. I was lucky enough to have three really good mentors, but all of our loading revolved around hunting, not target shooting. But since starting target shooting a couple years ago, and just getting more serious about a year ago, the learning curve has taken a big jump.
 
jetinteriorguy
I only shoot benchrest , started with all the different improvements to the rifle , then the world of Precision reloading . Never seems to end , learning different methods , tweaking everything possible for that 5 shot one hole group . Be Well and keep up the good work .

Chris
 
But since starting target shooting a couple years ago, and just getting more serious about a year ago, the learning curve has taken a big jump.
Click to expand...

Yep, that is me as well. I am not CW308 class, just recreational target, but that is a huge step. And the drive to get below 5/8 MOA is a hard one.
 
RC20
Believe me , We are in the same class . I'm still trying for the 1 hole 5 shot group . Some can do that all day . I still call it recreational shooting , I'm not competing , I shoot every Sunday with a group of friends that are benchrest shooters , weather permitting . The more you shoot the same rifle the better you get . I'm so comfortable behind my rifle , it's the only one Im shooting for many years. I like reloading as much as shooting . Great Sport . Be Well .

Chris
 
Competition formal or informal is great way to spend time with good people and motivate you to the next level. I never competed on any regular basis till a year ago. Now will drive a couple of hundred miles for matches and compete in internet 'scouts honor" matches. I became sorta obsessed :o
 
dawg
I find most of the people in this game are willing to help with problems and share things that work .Great Sport , Great Forum and a Great Group of People . Plus I can talk gun talk all day . Be Well .

Chris
 
Yep, great people and good times. Tailor made for obsessive people like me. I mostly shoot at a real nice new indoor facility right down the road from work. I spend 90% of my time on the 100 yd range, and in the summer at Quantico with a lot of nice ranges available all the way out to 1000 yds.
 
jet
Sounds like Heaven . 100 - 1000 in my neck of the woods max. Is 200 yards , 200 is hard enough but would love to try long range . Wide open spaces is dream Land , enjoy it while it lasts .

Chris
 
I do not crimp, and I do chamfer all my cases. I do use a .001 undersized mandrel in my Lee collet neck sizing die. I have determined the problem was an overly compressed load and am currently working up a new seating depth test with a lower charge in another node. I have tested seating bullets in empty cases with both the standard size mandrel and the undersized mandrel with no noticeable difference in seating depth variations. Now my seating depth variance is only +or- .002" or less. I do still get a slight mark on my bullet but the affect on seating depth seems tolerable to me. I'll know tomorrow at the range.
 
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