Big Bore Winchesters

W

William T. Watts

New member
I saw an auction on gunbroker, a fellow listed 1 bag of 50 rounds of .375Win brass that sold for $300.00, I know people are desperate for brass for the Winchester Big Bore calibers, but this is ridiculous. Seems I saw someone posted 38/55 brass could be shortened and may have to reamed but is doably for the .375 round. I believe I would use this option at this time. To bad Winchester abandoned these people who bought their products, I have the .307 big bore and love it but I put in a ample supply of brass that will fill my need for years to come. These are terrific rifles!! William
 
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307 Wichester ! Awesome !

Hey William, great gun, great round. Congrats !! I would love to have BB's in all three, 307, 356, & 375 Winchester. I do have a Marlin 375 that I picked up $100 bucks cheaper than 2 Big Bores I saw at a gun show, years ago. It's too bad the 307 or 356 didn't take off, they are both great cartridges. :confused: I used 38/55 brass with no issues, until i stocked up on 375 brass (1000) I should be OK for a while !! ;)
 
Absolutely agree with both of you!

I recently picked up a 94BB in 375 and have been watching GB listings for brass and ammo with interest. It is ridiculous the prices they are fetching, but it is what it is. I have more patience than I have dollar bills to fritter away paying $4+ each for fricken BRASS.

I'm not sure if the two of you saw my post in my 375 Win thread I made a couple weeks ago...

But I contacted Starline asking if their 38-55 brass could be safely loaded to 375 Win pressures and if they would ever consider getting into making 375 Win brass...

Oh heck, here is the copy/paste of the conversation:

"You can trim down our .38-55 brass to .375 Winchester length as a makeshift case for the .375. We haven’t tested this so we are unsure as to whether or not the .38-55 brass will hold up to the same pressures, as it is quite a bit thinner walled at the base than the .375. Hopefully we will be able to begin producing brass for the .375 sometime this year.

Regards,
Hunter Pilant

Process Manager

Chief Ballistician"


Lets keep our fingers crossed, and maybe drop an email from time to time with Starline asking them to consider making some 375 Win brass...if even on a seasonal basis.....

And William: My brother just won an auction for 1 bag of new 307 Win brass. He got it for $27 if I recall... And that is cheaper than what it would go for if in stock at the usual online suppliers. The seller called him and offered him a second bag for the same price and he turned it down. He doesn't have a 307..yet. But he plans to get one and thought he would throw down a bid on the brass, not thinking he stood a chance at winning with a $30 max bid. Unless this was a complete fluke, it seems the 307 stuff isn't inflating like 375 is.

But for me, I'll just have to do what I can to make my 26 brass last awhile and hope I get some notifications from the online suppliers when 375 brass comes back in stock.....
 
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I had a 307 for number of years, it was a pretty good rifle and bargain priced when I bought it. The open sights were canted just off of straight up but I used a Leupold 1.5 x 5 and it turned in good groups. Mine had a fairly heavy barrel, I suspect that helped the accuracy but naturally made it quite a bit heavier than your typical 30 30. I think I still have brass gathering dust. I should post it for sale I guess.
 
The stiffer receiver and heavier barrel translated into better than the usual accuracy one would expect from a lever rifle. My Winchester .307 94BB handles the 170gr Hornady and Nosler Partitions quite well with 1 1/2 or better groups using a Leupold 3 X 9 Vari Xll scope that may be as old as the rifle. I think the rifle was purchased in the early to mid 80's, it shot well from the get go, my rifle was in the second series of rifles released by Winchester with the more traditional straight stock. I've never shot the rifle over a chrony but would expect velocty to be just under 2500FPS with the 170gr hornady and Nosler bullets I use. I almost hate to take it to the woods because I don't want to booger it up, still a beautiful rifle!! William
 
Mine was the first series with the raised cheek piece. 1 1/2", some a little better, some a little worse, is what I recall. It liked 170gr. Nosler Solid base bullets the best and would usually shoot about 1 1/4" with them and 748.

I have several old boxes of Nosler 170gr. Partitions left over from that rifle. I've recently begun to test them for my 307's replacement, a 1970 Savage 99 in 308 Win. I'm hoping to find a slighly reduced, short range load for feral pigs.
 
I know someone who did shorten .38-55 brass and load to .375 Winchester specs.

In the first 20 rounds he had two or three case head separations.
 
I never figured out why the rifle didn't sell better, the only thing I could come up with the butt stock didn't have the traditional look and it turned off potential buyers. I knew about the first series and wouldn't buy because of the new look and jumped on the the rifle when they change to the more traditional looking stock. I don't hunt much any more but still like to go to the local G&F range that I still enjoy shooting. To bad Winchester is dropping the components and ammunition for these rifles, bad business all the way around. Doesn't help any the made/assembled in Portugal rifles what I've seen they aren't the quality I expected. After looking at the model 70's available I purchased a Kimber with a French Walnut stock that was an attention getter.. I hate that Winchester isn't the company it was when I was a young man!! Sigh!! William
 
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"Mike the brass is thinner in the web area and has to be loaded down to 38/55 pressures.. William"

Yes, I know.

My post was in response to this, which Red Ride posted yesterday.

"You can trim down our .38-55 brass to .375 Winchester length as a makeshift case for the .375. We haven’t tested this so we are unsure as to whether or not the .38-55 brass will hold up to the same pressures, as it is quite a bit thinner walled at the base than the .375. Hopefully we will be able to begin producing brass for the .375 sometime this year.

Regards,
Hunter Pilant

Process Manager

Chief Ballistician"
 
I always thought those big bores were in the odd ball category. And now it looks like my first impression was spot on. 300.00 for a bag of brass that's obscene. Cheaper to have Jes bore a barrel. And its brass is almost free. Oh well such is life._:)
 
Sure Shot Mc Gee I don't know if I would call the big bore series of rifles odd ball, they certainly fill the bill for some one wanting something a bit more powerful than a 30/30. When the velocity of a .307 is well above 2400FPS that is a significant improvement over the 30/30, I've taken several deer with my .307 that were bang flop, it isn't any better than that. The .375 will do the same thing plus it is more than enough for black bear, additionally the rifles even equipped with scopes are easy to carry when compared to the bolt guns. They are not for everyone but the people who hunt with lever guns these rifles were well made and quiet attractive. I probably won't buy another but can't foresee myself ever selling my rifle.. William
 
To bad Winchester is dropping the components and ammunition for these rifles, bad business all the way around.
Click to expand...

seems this is the new order... Remington falls into the same class... I'm totally hooked on the 17 Fireball, that Remington standardized, & then dropped a couple years later... Remington was the only one that made correct headstamp brass for the 17 Fireball, so correct headstamp brass is very hard to come by...

I'd love to have a Winchester big bore in 375 Winchester... I have a 14" Contender barrel in 375 Winchester, & it's quite a cartridge for 150 yards or less... I have space for one more big bore lever gun, & I'm still deciding between the 375, 405, or 444 ( already have a 45-70, so I looking for something between 30-30 & the 45-70 in a lever gun :) )
 
"To bad Winchester is dropping the components and ammunition for these rifles, bad business all the way around."

Actually, that's good business all the way around.

Ammo companies drop poorly selling cartridges/brass/other components all the time.

Setting up a production line once a year to make an increasing limited appeal item costs money. Warehousing it and parceling it out to dealers over the course of the year costs money.

At a certain point any intelligent manufacturer is going to look at the numbers and say "this is now costing us more to manufacture than is logical. To recover our costs we'd have to increase the price exponentially, likely further alienating an increasingly shrinking market."

Businesses are in business to make money. They make money in part by making decisions like this. Or, more realistically, they avoid losing money uncecessarily by making decisions like this.
 
Unfortunately as a consumer I make decisions based on my wallet, what I am willing to pay and do I really need it. Since we are talking about brass specifically the big bore Winchester series of rifles in the most encountered calibers the .307Win and the .375Win. When I purchased my rifle I purchased several boxes of ammunition, I had been a handloader at least 20 years. I knew I would load for the rifle, I immediately purchased several hundred rounds of Winchester .307 brass. I had bullets for a 30/30 Winchester that were suitable for the new rifle, plus the powder I used IMR 4895, somewhere in the mix I switched to IMR4064. After all these years I still have six unopened boxes ($13.35 plus tax) of the white box Winchester ammunition. When Winchester decided they were going to manufacture the .307 brass every three years I knew I needed to buy additional brass and not worry with it. For a few years I had access to once fired brass that went thru Remington's ballistics lab at their Lonoke Arkansas ammunition plant just a few miles down the road. I realize I'm lucky to have access to virtually everything I need. With that said I never handle a rifle nor shot one until I went in the Army in 1962, since then it has been a life long affair with center fire rifle!! William
 
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Thanks Mike Irwin. I pretty much decided I will not attempt to load 38-55 brass to 375 pressure.

Just wanted to get the word out as to what the Starline rep told me about loading 38-55 too hot as I have seen reports of people doing it. Plus the added bonus of that post is that it looks like Starline is going to start making brass for us! :D
 
^^^ I'll keep my eyes open for that !

When I loaded 38/55 brass, I cut to 375 spec and used 240 or 255 cast @ 1900 & 1800 fps = (38/55 levels) and they shot fine; 3"-4" @ 100 yds with a Williams peep sight and Gold dot up front. :D
 
i have a winchester big bore in the 94 timber carbine in .444 marlin and it sure is a killer with the 265gr FP bullet at 2000fps with a healty dose of H-4198. i have loaded 300gr bullets at 2000fps with the same powder for bear, but for every day use its a bit much. eastbank.
 
yes it gets a bit bitter at the back end in a hurry. it is a dream to carry all day tho. i have had a 1x4 leupold on it since day one with out a bit of trouble,i do have redfield rings and bases on it. eastbank.
 
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