BFR Accuracy - Disappointing

G

Gdawgs

New member
Well I took my new BFR out to the range to sight it in today (the one from this thread) http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=481773

I am very disappointed in the accuracy to say the least. Not sure if it's the gun or my loads that I've made, but something just isn't right. I had a friend with who is a very good shot, and it did the same thing for him as well.

First off are the 45 Colt loads. I used 255 grain lead bullets and 10 grains of Unique. These were all over the place. A foot to the left, 8 inches low, a foot high and to the right, etc. And this was at just under 20 yds. Finally figured out why. The bullets are tumbling. Here's a picture of one of the targets. You can see that the bullet entered the target sideways.
DSCF0045.jpg


There were several holes similar to this one, so it wasn't just a one time fluke.

The 454 and 460 loads were much better, but still not great. Maybe 6-8 inch groups(not sure if you can call what was happening groups though) At that range I was thinking I should be able to just about put these bullets through the same hole with that long barrel(or at least keep them within an inch or two). But that's not the case. I did not notice any tumbling with the 454 or 460s.

Anyway, I'm really disappointed and not sure what to do. Maybe heavier bullets:confused: I'm using 240 grain Hornady XTP mags for the 454 and 460.
I'm guessing I may have to suck it up and buy some factory loads and try those out. If those don't work, I guess I'll give Magnum Research a call.
 
That second hole looks like the round key holed.It is possible that the bullets you are using are the wrong size. You may need to order bullets oversized .001-.002. Slug your barrel for best results.
 
Definately slug the bore...

The .45-70 uses .458" bullets. Modern .45 Colt runs about .452". It is possible your gun has the wrong barrel for the cylinder that was put in it.

There are a lot of things that could be the cause,of your problem. Check everything, and change only one thing at a time, then test for accuracy.

OR, since the gun is new, send it back, and make them get it right. BFR's aren't cheap guns, and you should get quality in performance as well as quality in manufacture, for what you pay.
 
Thanks for the info. I'll slug it today. It says on their website "Many of the BFR's calibers will shoot groups of well under 2" at 50 yards with mechanical sights. "

I can barely keep it on a 8.5x11" piece of paper at 18 yrds. :(
 
Maybe heavier bullets?
Click to expand...


Gdawgs....I think the 240s should shoot better than that. My .460 shoots them very well. @50 yards I have no problem keeping them in a 3'' dot shooting off bags. Did you check for leading after shooting the LC loads? If they tumbled, it could be they were loose in the bore. This may have led to gas blowby and leading......which could lead to poor accuracy. Could it be you're anticipating recoil with the .460 loads? I'd try maybe dropping down to 44 gr of H110/W296 with the 240 XTPs. This is still well above min loads listed by Hornady and Lyman and will recoil considerably less than the 46 gr you're using now. If all else fails, try a box of the 200gr Hornady factory ammo. It's relatively cheap(for .460 factory stuff) and I've yet to hear from anybody that it was not accurate in their gun. If all else fails....call MR.
 
I would say there's definitely something weird going on. You 'may' see a slight decline with .45Colt in the long .460 chamber but it should not keyhole. Perhaps it did receive a .45-70 barrel, as was suggested??? Hopefully it does not also have .45-70 chambers. Are your cases expanding unusually?
 
The .45-70 uses .458" bullets. Modern .45 Colt runs about .452". It is possible your gun has the wrong barrel for the cylinder that was put in it.
Click to expand...

That's my thinking. Short of not having any rifling or having a crown cut so bad you can see it at a glance that has to be it.
 
If you slug the bore,feel for constriction where the bbl screws into the frame.It might feel like a shotgun choke.

I read an interesting article by Ross Seifred that discussed "thread choke" on revolvers.He described lapping it out.I'm not suggesting you should do that,but it is interesting.
 
The suggestion of a .458 bore diameter might be right.

Tompson Center shipped a batch of 45 Colt barrels for their single shot pistol years ago that were made from barrel blanks of .458 diameter. Naturally they shot like your BFR is currently shooting.
 
I bought some .454" lead balls for muzzleloading and tried slugging the barrel with those. Hard to get a real accurate reading with what I have, but it looks like it's the .451". Definitely not the .458 diameter.

I made up quite a few different loads to take to the range today. In 45 Colt, I made some lighter loads, one with 8 grains of Unique, one with 5.5 grains of Trail Boss, and one with 7 grains of 231(all using the 255 grain lead bullets). I also made some 454 loads with 10.5 grains of Unique to see if the slightly longer case would help. As recommendation by someone here, I also made some loads in 460 cases using Trail Boss, one with 10 grains, one with 15 grains.

Here's a quick rundown. EVERYTHING I made with Unique is absolute garbage. I was shooting 5 rounds per target. On one target, I shot all five rounds, and not one made it in the paper(8.5"x11"). And, they are not grouping at all, they are just all over the place. I had one round that shot 4 or 5 feet left of where I was aiming at 25 yds.

The Trail Boss loads are much better. I actually got a couple different loads to group. The best were the 15 grains of TB in the 460 cases(still the 255 gr lead bullets). I was actually able to get 5 rounds within 4" of each other.

I ran out of time at the end and didn't get to all my loads, so I just started shooting some rounds at a small rock on the bank. The 231 loads looked pretty good too. I was able to keep them pretty close to that rock.

I purchased some 45 Colt and Hornady 460 rounds. The 45 Colts weren't too bad. The problem with those is that they shot quite high compared to everything else, and I don't think I have enough travel in my rear sight to bring them down. The factory loaded 460's do not group either(no better than my reloads anyway). I was not able to put 5 rounds into one piece of paper with any of the full powered 460 or 454 rounds(at 20 yds). I realize that I am probably flinching a bit, but I know I'm not flinching that much, especially since I'm shooting off a rest. I have also let 3 or 4 other people shoot it, and they weren't able to do any better.

So needless to say, I am really bummed about this gun. I'm going to call Magnum Research on Monday and see what they say. My fear is that they will have me send it in, then they'll sit on if for a couple months, send it back with no note or anything, and they'll tell me it's fine. Then I'm stuck with a $900 paper weight, well more like a boat anchor as much as this thing weighs. :( Hopefully they'll take care of this for me though.

I have never seen a gun shoot as poorly as this one. The only thing that comes close was an old Jennings pocket 25 auto. And I've never seen a gun where different loads made such a huge difference in accuracy.

The good news-when I got home I shot my bow in the backyard. I can keep most of my arrows in a 4" circle at 30 yds with that. Wish my gun shot as good as my bow.
 
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It could be a timing issue.... I had an 8" revolver that I could not hit a milk jug at 7 yards. If the timing is off even a little (where the chambers of the cylinder do not fully line up with the forceing cone/Barrel) It will cause the bullet to vibrate/resonate down the barrel and fly who knows where when it leaves the barrel.
 
If it's not grouping with factory ammo, I'd say it's time to send it back and have them take a look at it.

An OEM will argue with you if your handloads don't work, but if it won't shoot a well known brand name like Hornady, something's got to be wrong.
 
I sent it back to MR yesterday. They recieved it today. I'll let you guys know what happens. On the MR webpage, they have an article from American Handgunner magazine. Their test gun was chambered in 475 Linebaugh, so they tested a bunch of Linebaugh and 480 Ruger ammo. Here's a quote from that article.

"It performed flawlessly with no malfunctions whatsoever and also proved to be superbly accurate. Six of the loads tested grouped four shots into 5/8” at 25 yards. That is excellent…no, way above excellent, by anyone’s standards. Twenty different loads were tested, and results are in the accompanying table. The really scary thing is the average for all twenty is well under one-inch for four shots at 25 yards. Again, I have to say this is beyond excellent performance!"

This article is one of the reasons I bought the gun. I think the best "group" I was able to get with the factory loaded 460s was about a foot. I'm hoping they figure it out and fix it, and not give me the runaround.
 
Hope they take care of you. Especially since they have a Minnesota tie-in. Where did you send the gun? I heard at one time they were considering a manufacturing plant up in northern Minnesota.
 
I've the same model and is a lot more accurate than thet. Haven't wrung it out thoroughly due to long term health issues but would expect a drop off in accuracy w/the shorter rnds in the longer chambers. There has been some recent corp changes?
 
The factory I sent it to is in Pillager Minnesota. Which is a small town norht of St Cloud. It about 2 hours north of where I live.

Magnum Research was purchased by Kahr a while back.
 
Well doggone. Your in MN, they are in MN, I hope a little 'Minnesota Nice' creeps in and they take care of you. I've never owned a Magnum Research product but I've always been intrigued by what they offer. Once again I hope they take care of you.
 
My parents came to visit for the weekend, so I had my dad bring along his Super Redhawk in 454 so I could try my reloads in his gun to see how they compare to my BFR. All of my reloads shot fine out of his SRH. I just wanted to confirm that it wasn't my reloads, or the bullets I was using. Here's a round I shot offhand at about 18 yds(255 gr lead bullet, 8 gr of Unique). I'd be lucky to get one or two shots in this target with my BFR off a rest from that distance. Still waiting to hear back from MR.

IMG_1463.jpg
 
I've been following this with interest. At least it's good to know that it's not your loads. I'm anxious to see how it turns out. Good luck.
 
Thanks Duke. I really hope I hear from them this week. I'll let you guys know what's going on as soon as I find anything out.
 
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