I Am planning a vacation to Montana & Wyoming this summer . I Will be traveling with my wife and 3 Labrador retrievers. We plan on day hiking into the back country . I will be carrying my Glock 40 cal. I am confident it could handle just about any negative encounter with wildlife in the area except for bear. That I am not sure about. Any thoughts on whether it could handle a charging bear (grizzly or black)
Bear vs the 40 cal
- Thread starter Hot Shot
- Start date
Me personally I would not chance it or even consider a .40 to save my life from a charging grizzly. But it is better than nothing and people have killed bears with far less firepower. Still if you have the option I would step up to a minimum of a 10mm with full power loads and solid bullet construction and heavy bullet weight. But if you however decide to carry a .40 I would find the heaviest hard cast bullets for the .40. I would not even feel super comfortable with a .357 mag for grizzly protection.
tahunua001
New member
more than likely it would be enough for black bear but I'd want something more for grizzlies. pretty much I'd want a 480 ruger, 500 S&W... 44 mag from a non snub nosed at the minimum. what part of Montana/wyoming are you going to be in? if we're talking yellowstone or anything west of there then you'll more than likely require something bigger as Grizzlies will be a serious problem. however if we're talking like the big horn mountains then you're far more likely to be in blacky only territory and would probably be fine with a 40.
Certainly sounds like a guess to me. Not good enough when I am facing a PO'ed bruin.
Ditch the Glock and get a 12 ga slug gun. You might live longer in bear country.
Here is a good one:
http://www.mossberg.com/product/sho...s-mossberg-590a1-special-purpose-590a1-magpul
Brotherbadger
New member
Bring bear spray. It will be more useful. Bring the 40 too, but bear spray will take care of any angry bear.
Art Eatman
Staff in Memoriam
Do some Googling on pepper spray. From what I've read over quite a few years, it's a better defense than the medium-power handguns.
jdbuck460XVR
New member
Out of the millions of folks that have also vacationed in those areas in the last decade or so, how many have died from bear attacks? Take the 40 and instead of investing in a hand cannon you can't afford to practice with enough to hit a charging bear in the CNS, get some bear spray and keep your 3 dogs close.
tahunua001
New member
well since bruin refers to a brown bear, I'd say we are pretty much in agreement.
personally, I would opt for something bigger given heavy grizzly activity in most of those areas. in addition to bear mace.
RodTheWrench
New member
The best bang for your buck - literally - is to get a Lone Wolf barrel in 357 Sig for your Glock. Your mags load up and function perfectly with 357 Sig, you've got gobs and gobs more power, you don't have to buy a new holster, all plusses in my book.
Here's a link to one: http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=474488838
I've carried and operated one of these for a couple of years and I wouldn't trade it for anything. Don't get me started on my 9mm conversion barrel that I shoot supressed with...
Here's a link to one: http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=474488838
I've carried and operated one of these for a couple of years and I wouldn't trade it for anything. Don't get me started on my 9mm conversion barrel that I shoot supressed with...
Sure Shot Mc Gee
New member
From my experience's with MN Black bears. Dogs are you're best deterrent against bear attacks. Even a small pooch can harass a BIG bear into quick -stepping out of a camp site and/or change a bears mind about a outright charge once his nose picks-up the scent of a dog. I've witnessed just that with my MinPin on more than one occasion. Bliggy still has his (jewels) so he's always up for a good bear tangling at my cabin.
After dog/s. I would put (spray) at the top of the list. Then a 12 ga. with 1 oz slugs. Reason for the 1oz: their faster than 1-1/4 oz ones but thump just as hard. 40 cal will change the nasty behavior in any human. BIG bears are a whole different ball game when it comes to changing their intentions.
After dog/s. I would put (spray) at the top of the list. Then a 12 ga. with 1 oz slugs. Reason for the 1oz: their faster than 1-1/4 oz ones but thump just as hard. 40 cal will change the nasty behavior in any human. BIG bears are a whole different ball game when it comes to changing their intentions.
I trust my 40 against black bears and lions in Colorado, but I wouldn't bring it to a grizzly area thinking I was "all good."
That said, rather than invest a couple hundred in a chunk of metal that you won't use after your trip, Bear spray is an effective, if less sexy, solution.
That said, rather than invest a couple hundred in a chunk of metal that you won't use after your trip, Bear spray is an effective, if less sexy, solution.
Armed_Chicagoan
New member
Dogs are not allowed on the hiking trails in Grand Teton NP, even if on a leash. And they are not going to scare a grizzly, and I cringe at the thought of 3 Labs thinking a grizzly is something to toy with. In addition wolves will likely attack and kill dogs on sight, they will see them as competitors and threats.
That isn't country to let your dogs run free.
That isn't country to let your dogs run free.
Hey Hot Shot, I was in your position 2 years ago. Took my wife & kids out west for a few weeks. Rushmore, Badlands, Yellowstone & Grand Tetons. Brought my M&P40 and bear spray. We were fortunate enough to see a gorgeous, huge, grizzly our first day in Yellowstone. He was about 75 yards away paying us no mind. I must say, I was not prepared for just how big these things are, and how vulnerable I felt. We got a few pics, and a shaky video lol before he moved off. We were lucky enough to spot another grizzly and 3 black bears during our trip. Though none as close as that first one. While I felt confident with the 40 for any lesser animals, and certainly any 2 legged vermin that might pose a threat to my wife & daughters, I quickly realized that I was glad we had bear spray. Next time I'll be wearing my new 4" 629, but the bear spray would most likely get pulled should a bear show any interest in us. JMO. In any case have a great trip and enjoy what I think is some of the most beautiful country out there.
I'm in agreement on bear spray as the 1st line of defense, but I'd not leave the 40 at home, it'll perform better than many think. I've camped in Yellowstone and other places where grizzlies live and around black bear all the time. I carry my G-20 in 10mm loaded with Double Tap 200 gr bullets @ 1300 fps and sleep well.
Double Tap offers the same load in 40 S&W at 1100 fps.
http://www.doubletapammo.net/index.php?route=product/product&path=125_182&product_id=607
There are many, many documented cases of 357 mag working on bear and that is about the same performance as you'd get with a 4" 357. In fact I've started carrying my G-23 a lot more in black bear country simply because it is a lot lighter and more compact. There have been a couple trouble grizzlies killed with 45 ACP in Alaska recently and I'd rate the 40 WAAAY better. A 400-500 lb black bear was killed by poachers here a few years ago with a 40, so they will work.
A typical grizzly is marginally larger than a typical black bear. The difference is that the grizzly is more aggressive and more likely to actually attack while a black bear is far more likely to retreat. It isn't any harder to stop one than the other if they do attack. Many confuse grizzlies with their much larger cousins in along the coast of Alaska that can weigh over 1200 lbs. Grizzlies in inland parts of Alaska or the Yellowstone area are much smaller.
I wouldn't think I was "all good" with anything. But the reality is that if things go bad penetration and a lucky shot are the best you can hope for. A 200 Gr hardcast bullet @ 1100-1300 fps is going to give as much penetration as anything from a handgun including 44 magnum. And 16 shots give you 10 more chances to get lucky than 6 shots.
Double Tap offers the same load in 40 S&W at 1100 fps.
http://www.doubletapammo.net/index.php?route=product/product&path=125_182&product_id=607
There are many, many documented cases of 357 mag working on bear and that is about the same performance as you'd get with a 4" 357. In fact I've started carrying my G-23 a lot more in black bear country simply because it is a lot lighter and more compact. There have been a couple trouble grizzlies killed with 45 ACP in Alaska recently and I'd rate the 40 WAAAY better. A 400-500 lb black bear was killed by poachers here a few years ago with a 40, so they will work.
A typical grizzly is marginally larger than a typical black bear. The difference is that the grizzly is more aggressive and more likely to actually attack while a black bear is far more likely to retreat. It isn't any harder to stop one than the other if they do attack. Many confuse grizzlies with their much larger cousins in along the coast of Alaska that can weigh over 1200 lbs. Grizzlies in inland parts of Alaska or the Yellowstone area are much smaller.
I wouldn't think I was "all good" with anything. But the reality is that if things go bad penetration and a lucky shot are the best you can hope for. A 200 Gr hardcast bullet @ 1100-1300 fps is going to give as much penetration as anything from a handgun including 44 magnum. And 16 shots give you 10 more chances to get lucky than 6 shots.
tahunua001
New member
we can agree to seriously disagree. compared to an EASTERN BLACK BEAR, the grizzly may be marginally larger, and by marginally, the average grizzly boar can grow to be 50% larger than the average eastern black bear, weighing in at about 800 pounds. however when compared to a WESTERN BLACK BEAR, they are much larger, about 100% larger in fact. a black bear in montana, wyoming or idaho over 350 pounds is a rarity while grizzlies over 600 are commonplace. sure they are no Kodiaks but they still are still a lot of meat with a very bad temper.
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The Verminator
Moderator
Bear spray!
Nothing less than the 10mm!!!
Probably MORE than the 10mm.
Black bear attack is statistically insignificant in probability.
Griz is only slightly more likely, but being prepared is good and also prepares you for other threats that are more likely (human).
Nothing less than the 10mm!!!
Probably MORE than the 10mm.
Black bear attack is statistically insignificant in probability.
Griz is only slightly more likely, but being prepared is good and also prepares you for other threats that are more likely (human).