Barthe A. Bayonne

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PhilStef

Inactive
Enclosed are pictures of a 12 gauge Barthe A. Bayonne (only ID) that my dad brought back from Germany in WW2. My mom gave it to me after moving of our family home and it was badly damaged in the move (dropped from the attic).

I'd like to be able to shoot it again but don't know if it's worth the money to repair/restore to that extent. Despite the pictures of it now (poor lighting for sure), it (was) a beautifully made, very light sporting gun. Any suggestions or thoughts would be greatly appreciated!
 
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Just the name suggests its French. Bayonne was a city known for its armament industry and in very early days, production of bayonets. Perhaps it's a war trophy brought home by a German soldier that was subsequently seized by your father?
 
Here is The Picture

I'm sorry, the iphone pictures are not great to start. I photo-shop reduced and edited it a bit but it gives you an idea of the problem.

I'd like to thank 4V50 Gary for your response. That may be true.
Barthe%20A%20Bayonne%20Shotgun%201.JPG
 

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Ouch, yup it done got broke.
A shame, that stock looked might nice, too.
Actually a good wood worker might be able to repair it, at least enough to display it.
Or did you want to shoot it?
There's always the option of making new stock, too.
Kind of depends on how much it means to you.
 
Repair the stock for a wall hanger, replace for a shooter. Not an unusual event, though it rarely is a cheap one.

Jeff

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk
 
It's going to need a totally new stock. That one's too far gone. Really shouldn't be terribly difficult to find one that fits. Won't be that quality of wood for cheap though. I think, very much a WHAG, it might be French/Bastogne walnut. A blank of that runs $800 and up USD.
http://www.oldtreegunblanks.com/shotgunblanks.html?woodid=5
Or rummage around Gunparts. They list a bunch of shotgun stocks that might fit. https://www.gunpartscorp.com/Categories/StocksForendsHandguards-36036.htm
Any proof marks on it? Another WHAG suggests Manufacture d'armes de Bayonne founded by Leon Barthe in 1920. That'd be the MAB pistol guys. Eventually wound up being a subsidiary of FN in the 1970's.
 
Wow, Great Knowledge Gratefully Acknowledged

First of all, thank you for the Great Comments! I'm thankful and very appreciative of the wisdom and kindness shown to a new member. Every post gave me ideas, resources or options I hadn't thought of.

I would love to be able to shoot it but I agree it may be best to make it presentable. I would do this in honor of my dad, a wonderful man who was admired, respected by all. He loved that gun and enjoyed taking us out hunting with it. It holds 80 years of memories

Dad was in Sargent in the 45th Infantry Division. They fought from the landing at Anzio, Southern Italy, into France and Germany. I always suspected (but do not know for sure) that he got the gun in Germany, at the end of the war, when they were waiting to come home.

I say this because, after Anzio, he was constantly on the move, sleeping outside, in foxholes and makeshift shelters, near the front, calling in artillery. As it was in beautiful condition when we put away after his death (Nov 1973), I always thougth the double barrel would be excessive for combat purposes and if he had it, the gun would have shown it. The idea of a capture is interesting and possible though I hadn't thought of ot.

Anyway, sorry for the rambling. For now, I'll get some prices, look at the web sites and suggestions mentioned and let you know. I may send some, 'before / after' pictures or maybe I'll have some more questions! I'm very happy I found The Firing Line. Very informative and interesting to read!

Thank you all again and best regards! Phil
 
If the stock is in two pieces and you have both of them, it can be repaired. Finding a new stock that actually fits may not be as easy as some think.

Talk to a gunsmith.
 
A few months back I visited the 45th Infantry Division Museum in Oklahoma City. I was rushed through by my party but would have spent the entire day there. If you have your father's story, you might want to share it with them.

They have china from Hitler's place as well as Hitler's cape. The donor used to wear it and play Batman and jump off the garage. His father yelled at him for that. When his father took the cape, it was for padding for some china he was liberating from Der Furhrer. He didn't think about the significance of it until years later.
 
From a purely objective and cost viewpoint, I doubt that gun would be worth repairing. A decent repair (replacement) of the stock would cost a lot more than the gun is worth, plus it is in an unpopular (in the U.S) caliber. Its objective value would probably not run over $500 if that. Its sentimental value is something only you can determine.

There are a number of stock-makers in the U.S. who can obtain and work with that quality of wood and duplicate that style but all are busy and usually backed up. My WAG is that the job would cost at least $2000, maybe a lot more.

The wood is European walnut, expensive and hard to find here. And forget finding an inletted or semi-inletted stock; the stockmaker will have to start with a rough blank and do all the inletting, plus all the outside work. You might find someone in Europe who could do the work, but the cost and trouble of shipping would probably outweigh any possible savings.

I would not try any "half-A" repairs; those usually turn out to be disastrous. If you don't want to have a good repair, then any decent woodworker should be able to patch that stock together enough to look good for a wall hanger.

Jim
 
Not a bad guess, James. Since I do stock work for a living, I could probably turn a replacement out, and yes, it would take a year or so and cost close to $2000. About $250 for the piece of wood (quarter-sawn European walnut), then inlet/shape/sand/finish about $800-ish, then checkering about $500-ish. Refinishing the forearm to match would maybe be about another $200. So, all told, about $1,750 plus shipping/insurance, it will total out around $2000.

I am fairly sure the stock could be repaired, though, and that would cost significantly less. If interested, click on the link below for Summit Arms Services.
 
I'd have it repaired. A good gunsmith should be able to point you in the right directions. Sure looks repairable to me. With the adhesives available today a person with the right expertise should be able to do it.
 
You're going to have to spend some money on a repair, and may need to use only light loads if you fire the shotgun after it's repaired.

If it's a sentimental piece, it's worth fixing. I certainly would.
 
Pretty thing. I hope you find somebody who can repair the stock. Steel pins and modern adhesives can do a lot.

I have a gun like that, a Verney Carron almost certainly confiscated from a Frenchman by the Germans, confiscated from a German by the Americans and souvenired out. The armies of the world are great believers in gun control.
 
You can send all the pieces of the stock to a stock maker, such as Macon, select a piece of English Walnut, and let them have at it. They glue the old one back to use as a pattern, rout a new one on a pantograph, then fit and checker it. They keep the old stock as a pattern, unless you want it back. It's best to send them the forearm too, and allow them to refinish it, so it will match the stock.

Those can be fixed, but they're never as strong. I've done those, and added all-thread rods as pins, which held up, but the problem is that you can always tell it has been broken, unless someone is awful good with using veneer, and can make it match the grain. That is very expensive and time consuming.
 
The stock certainly looks nice. But unfortunately the original choice of wood blank was a bit less than ideal. The grains should run clean along the wrist. Under shock, the wood may crack or split along the grains, but it won't break across. As seen in the picture, the grains pretty much run short across the wrist. So it breaks in piece when shocked.

I would glue it back and not to shoot it again. Modern glue, when applied correctly, is at least as strong as, if not stronger than, the wood itself. I wouldn't worry the glue job would weaken the stock. The concern is the stock being weak to begin with.

-TL
 
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