Barrel break-in???

R

Rainbow Six

New member
I figure this one will generate as many different answers/opinions as "cleaning" questions but I'm gonna ask anyway.

What kind of break-in procedure do you follow and what are the alleged benefits of your techinque?

I am ready to start breaking in my new rifle and I wanted to get a good idea of what is generally accepted as "proper" break-in procedures. Anyone know what Remington might recommend?

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For Sale: SIG P220 - see handgun classified forum.

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Georgia TFL'ers get together:
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R6...aka...Chris
 
Not an expert but here's what I did on a Rem. 700VSF......

First 40 shots: Full cleaning between each. Make sure you get bore DRY afterwards.
Next 60: Patch between every shot. Clean every 3.
Worked real nice. Rifle shoots way better than me.

Call the Rem. Custom Shop and ask them what they recommend. I called them several years ago and they were very nice and helpful. I didn't take their advice - I remember that their method didn't seem like "enough". If I remember correctly, they said clean every 3 to 5 rounds.

Stay safe, Butch
 
When I bought my M70 in .30-06, I ran a tight fitting patch, soaked with Hoppe's #9, through the barrel followed by three dry patches. I then fired four rounds (one fouling shot, three for zero) for the first two boxes (40 rounds total) cleaning the bore the same way between each set of four rounds. After that I started cleaning after every ten rounds (one fouling shot, nine for group) in the same manner until I sold the rifle. It would shoot MOA, or better if I was doing my part, with its prefered loading.

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Guns cause crime like spoons cause Rosie O'Donnell to be fat!

I hunt, therefore I am.
 
I'm beginning to think barrel break-in is a myth. After reading what some top benchresters have said I think all you need to do is begin with a super clean bore and then shoot the rifle as you intend to do without wasting rounds doing some odd break-in procedure. And then you clean the bore at a practical or reasonable interval consistently until that day when you worn it out after several thousand rounds. You can't improve it's inherent accuracy by any particular voodoo method of shoot one, clean, shoot two, clean, etc.
 
Benchresters have a fantastic concern with itty-bitty groups. They also have a tendancy to do anything that helps. When a rifle has to group in the teens to be competitive (.01 to .02 @ 100y), little things count. Voodoo is an excellent term. Heck, some of them weigh their primers to sort them..

The oft mentioned shoot one, clean one for X number of rounds does work. As Gale McMillen noted last year, barrel makers love it as it wears your barrel out faster. I've done it a couple of times (I was unemployed at the time) and the results are there. I'm just not sure if it means anything on any rifle but a benchrest one.

IMHO - I do like to clean frequently with Remclean or JB Compound at first. Once I get more than fifty rounds through the rifle, it's cleaned after a days shooting.

Giz
 
Voodoo? If you actually tried it, you'd find that it works! Assuming you have a descent barrel on a new gun, (No, this won't work on a Chicom SKS!) somewhere about halfway through the process, you'll notice that the barrel becomes noticably "slicker" as you run a patch through it. If you don't wish to try it, so-be-it. But, it works.

Here's what you need.
1) Agood supply of patches. (GI work fine)
2) Two or three good brass bore brushs.
3) A good nitro solvent. I use either Shooter's Choise, or Hoppies #9.
4) am agressive copper remover. (I like Sweet's 7.62, but Hoppies Copper Remover, or Shooter's Choise Copper remover work fine too.)
5) A can of Brakleen or similar degreaser.
6) Lots of range time.

Now, here goes.
1)Assuming you're starting with a virgin barrel, (If you're not, ALL copper fouling MUST be removed.) degrease the barrel with a patch soaked with Brakleen, then run a couple of clean, dry patches through to dry the bore.

2) Fire ONE shot. (Some people recommend bare, jacketed bullets, but I use Moly-Coated ones, since I want my barrel coated with moly.)

3) Run patch, soaked with the nitro solvent, through the barrel.

4) Brush the barrel a few strokes with a brush dripping with nitro solvent.

5) Run another nitro solvent soaked patch through to remove what the brush broke loose.

6) Run a dry patch through to remove the nitro solvent.

7) Degrease the barrel, as in step one.

8) Run a patch, soaked with the agressive copper remover, through the barrel and let it soak for a brief time. (About 10 minutes)

9) Run another patch, soaked with the agressive copper remover, through.

10) Repeat 8 & 9 untill absolutely NO "green" comes out!

11) Degrease the barrel, and fire another shot.

12) Repeat, until you have fired 12 rounds.

13) Fire 2 shots and repeat above cleaning procedure until you have again fired 12 rounds.

14) Fire 3 & clean for 12 rounds.

15) Fire 4... .

16) Fire 5... .

17) Fire 10... .

18) You're done.

Yes, I know it's a pain in the ass, but you DO want your Obermeyer, Hart, etc., barrel to shoot great, last forever, and be easy to clean, DON'T YOU?

After break-in, I shoot an 88 round Highpower match with my M-14/M1-A. Cleaning on it: Wet patch, brush, wet patch, dry patch, DONE!

Yr. Obt. Svnt.

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Fred J. Drumheller
NRA Life
NRA Golden Eagle
 
For hunting purposes I doubt that you need to go to the trouble of breaking in a barrel. I guarantee you none of the guys I hunt with have ever broken in a barrel. Yet they consistently kill deer year after year. I, however, do go to the trouble of breaking in my barrels because I think it will aid in both their accuracy and longevity and because I actually enjoy doing it.
 
Well, I wasn't exactly clear. I'm not sure whether it makes a difference or not but my rifle is a Remington 700 Light Tactical Rifle and it is to be used as a law enforcement sniper gun. It *HAS* to be absolutely accurate and repeatable for liability reasons.

If it were a hunting rifle I wouldn't mind 3" groups at 100yds. For my purposes, I want 1/4 MOA if at all possible, 1/2MOA minimum. Shot placement has the potential of being far more critical in a police sniper scenario.

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For Sale: SIG P220 - see handgun classified forum.

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Georgia TFL'ers get together:
May 20, 2000-From 3pm to 6pm
http://www.wolfcreek-gun.com
***************************

R6...aka...Chris

[This message has been edited by Rainbow Six (edited May 10, 2000).]
 
R6,

With a clean, factory barrel, shooting 3-5 shots (slow, don't overheat the barrel) and then cleaning will work just as good as cleaning after each shot. Be wary of ammonia based cleaners such as Sweets, they can do more damage than improper cleaning.
The clean 1, shoot 1... routine is ideal for custom, hand lapped barrels (Hart, Shilen...), but unnecessary with most factory barrels, but it won't hurt.
 
I just checked out Shilen's how-to page on breaking in a new barrel. Based on their answer to that question in the FAQ, they don't seem to regard barrel break-in procedures as necessary.

That being noted, they listed the following:

Clean after each shot for the first five, then every five shots thereafter until you have put fifty through it.

They make a good point in suggesting that one not simply blast rounds just to break-in the barrel. They suggest using the first five shots to zero the scope and the ten "break-in" five shot groups to start grouping.

The only thing about going by their recommendation is that it is made in reference to their hand lapped barrels, not factory Remington barrels. The LTR came from the Remington Custom Shop but I don't know if it was hand lapped or not.

Anybody have the phone number to the custom shop?



------------------
For Sale: SIG P220 - see handgun classified forum.

***************************
Georgia TFL'ers get together:
May 20, 2000-From 3pm to 6pm
http://www.wolfcreek-gun.com
***************************

R6...aka...Chris
 
I seem to remember reading on a website somewhere about using JB Bore Paste during break-in. I think the guy said he made around 20-25 passes with JB before firing the first round, then started with groups. Anyone know where I might have seen this? The name "Varmint Al" seems to ring a bell for some reason.

R6
 
Chris,

Al Harral's web page can be found at Varmint Al's.

Also, I remember someone telling me that all barrels coming out of Remington's Custom Shop are hand-lapped. I'd be interested to know if I just made that up, so let us know what you find out.

[This message has been edited by sensop (edited May 10, 2000).]
 
Thanks for the link. I thought that he was the one that used JB for break-in. Apparently he makes 50 passes with JB, then starts grouping and repeats the JB if there is any "green" during the first cleaning. He uses Moly coated chunks though. I am not going to put moly through my rifle.

I called the custom shop but I got a voicemail. I left a message and my home phone#. Let's see how long it takes to hear from them. :)

On another note, my Iron Brigade Armory one piece scope mount came in this morning. Man, this appears to be a rock solid piece. I don't think you could find a more soild mount anywhere. I can't wait to squeeze my new Leupold Tactical into this bad boy and get started with the fun part. Now, if the scope would just come in.

I also have to say that Norm Chandler Jr's customer service has been as good as I have ever recieved anywhere. I plan to do business with the Chandlers as soon as I can afford a Chandler Super Grade Sniper. :)

Note: While I was typing this post the custom shop returned my call! About five minutes call turnaround. Here's the poop...

The custom shop representative said that, in his opinion, shooting one round and cleaning is a little extreme. He recommended starting with a clean bore and shooting three round groups and making sure not to heat up the barrel, cleaning between groups for the first 30 rounds, then clean it when it needs it. He also thought it would be a good idea not to put any real heat into the barrel for the first 100 rounds.

When asked about the JB break-in procedure mentioned above he said that the abrasive in JB is really ultrafine and you'd really have to "go to town" to oversize the bore. He also said that he only uses JB on a bore that fouls excessively. He recommended using the least abrasive method that will clean the bore, be it a patch and Hoppes or copper solvent, and using more harsh cleaners only if the bore absolutely requires it. Makes good common sense.

According to the rep, the LTR isn't a full Custom Shop(CS) gun. The CS does chamber the barrels and do a few other regular manufacturing procedures on the LTR. It goes through the CS but isn't considered a custom piece.

He said that the bore is not hand lapped so I guess you made that up sensop. Shame on you. :)

I'll break out the Shooter's Choice and a few patches this afternoon and get it ready to start breaking it in. I guess I will use the CS recommended break-in.

Groups to follow! Stay tuned... :D

------------------
For Sale: SIG P220 - see handgun classified forum.

***************************
Georgia TFL'ers get together:
May 20, 2000-From 3pm to 6pm
http://www.wolfcreek-gun.com
***************************

R6...aka...Chris
 
Yeah, I thought I might be wrong about that. I wonder if they chamber on the minimum side of SAAMI nominals.

Good turn-around on the voicemail.

A little JB and occasional cleaning for the first 30 -50 rounds and it sounds like you could have the equivalent of hand lapping.

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Drop Al an email and ask his opinion. He's good about answering email.

[This message has been edited by sensop (edited May 12, 2000).]
 
I just recently broke-in a Remington 700 VS. I scrubbed the barrel first with JB to smooth burrs left by machining. I shot three and cleaned for the first thirty. The bore after 30 rounds was still powder fouling and copper fouling excessively. Scrubbed the barrel with JB again, and went to the range, and shot 5 and 10 shot groups to 100. Now the bore does not powder foul or copper foul as bad as it did at 30 or 50 rounds. I am satisfied that the barrel is now broken-in. I broke a Kreiger in not long ago, and it only took about 10 rounds. I wish I could say the same for the Remington, but of course the Kreiger was handlapped from the factory, and cost a lot of dollars. After break-in of the Remington, I only clean with Shooters Choice utilizing patches and a bronze bore brush. I can put 20 rounds through the pipe, and clean with the Shooters Choice, and remove what copper has collected in the bore without using ammonia cleaners. After every 100 rounds or so, I plan on scrubbing the bore with JB. But I do believe that the JB helped smooth the bore, and has tightened groups in other rifles that I have owned, and will continue to use it sparingly.
PS. What is it with Remington rifle barrels coming in to their own around 100 rounds? I mean they start grouping better and fouling is less. I have heard the 100 round magic number mentioned more than once when it comes to factory Remington barrels.
Sling Shot

[This message has been edited by Sling Shot (edited May 11, 2000).]
 
Maybe a good hand lapping simply does what 100 rounds or so would with wear? Hand lapping polishes the bore smooth instead of wearing it smooth as when one shoots and cleans without abrasives to break it in.



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***************************
Georgia TFL'ers get together:
May 20, 2000-From 3pm to 6pm
http://www.wolfcreek-gun.com
***************************

R6...aka...Chris
 
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