Ban of "Cheater Guns" For hunting?

Z

Zorro

New member
Aren't there too many cheater guns in Black Powder hunting now?

Let's face it In-Line fired "Magnum" Black Powder Rifles with scopes just aren't REALLY! Primitive weapons.

Shouldn't the hunting laws be re-written to say something like "Black powder Rifle MEANS! Open sites ONLY!

Hammer fired ONLY! (In Line Ignition is SPECIFICLY BANNED)

Hand poured Powder ONLY! (Pellets are Banned)

Lead Bullets ONLY! (All Copper bullets AND/OR SABOTS are Banned.

Blued or Browned CARBON STEEL ONLY! Stainless Steel is SPECIFICLY Banned. Chrome lined Carbon Steel Bores are OK.

Wood Stock ONLY! All other materials are BANNED. One exception Laminated Wood is considered wood.

Any inclusion of any banned item listed above classifies the "Primitive Weapon" as a Modern Shotgun.


Just a suggested re-write of current Hunting Laws.
 
Yeah! We need a whole $h**load more laws right #^@&*" now!
There isn't enough, "I envy that person over there so I need more laws to make me happy!" stuff going on already.

Count me out.:barf: :barf:

I don't own an inline, nor will I in the future, but I also don't have enough free time in my life to spend time advocating for more hunting restrictions.
 
ML or Primitive

I don't really want to debate this - suffice to say that the state DNR or equivalent which sets the rules (not really laws) for hunting can decide if they want a primative season (PA Flintlock only style) or just a ML season (MI style). Entirely up to them and they usually listen to the voters.

Either way, I am shooting my Lyman GPR in regular rifle season;)

JPM
 
Hey, if you don't want to use a stanless steel in line magnum fancy gun. Don't. But if someone else wants to let 'em.
 
I'm still cheezed at Pennsylvania banning maxi balls for primitive season, given that it very likely has led to an increase in wounded, unrecovered, deer.
 
Ban of "Cheater Guns".

I recall back in the mid 70's when the Bowhunters were very opposed to the new "Compound Bows" being allowed for the bow season. Now if you can find a bowhunter shooting a longbow or recurve, --well you get the idea.
There ain't that many of "us Hunters" out there, so why the in fighting??? ;)
 
A traditional ML can be as accurrate and dependable as a modern inline. The hunter must take the time to practice at the range to really learn the traditional ML rifle.

Problem is that many hunters do not want to shoot much at all. In fact many of them will buy a box of cartridges for their modern .30-06 rifle and that 20rd box of cartridges can last a decade.

These guys will not take the time to learn how to shoot traditional ML rifles and thus manufacturers have created the modern inline muzzle-loaders.

Personaly I wish these slobs would just quit hunting because they are the real reason for crippled game.
 
Zorro, just what is it you object to? At first it seemed that you wanted to step back to the 18th century, but then you said, "chrome lined carbon steel bores are OK." Hmmm... Please, don't tell me that it's mere appearance that counts!

(BTW, RetiredSgt, I used to use a compound; I'm much happier with my longbow and a split-finger tab.)
 
I think that anything that gets a hunter into hunting is a good thing.After all you are on a internet sight called
www.thefiringline.com that's main goal is to support the RKBA (right to keep and bear arms.).What you are suggesting is that
we not get hunters interested into hunting and to help fuel the anti gunners with more propaganda.

I posted my thoughts on this several weeks ago.Although I like flintlock rifles , I still feel there is a place in the field for inline
guns.If you don't like them then don't buy one but don't put down a fellow hunter just because that is what he is into.How
would you feel if a inline hunter wanted to ban side locks because he did not like them?

Maybe the answer lies in the fact they states should open up a season just for flintlocks in addition to the muzzleader season.

respectfully submitted
 
Well, I guess I'm more of a traditionalist (I prefer my 1853 Enfield and .45 Hawkin) and think that the in-line rifles lack the challenge that a side-hammer gun offers, especially when they are using scopes on them. Now do I think in-line rifles or scopes on muzzle loader should be banned? No. I do think though that they should be allowed but only during regular rifle season with percussion and flint locks only allowed during the muzzle loader season. I guess my opinion is just that, an opinion and if they want to hunt with a modern muzzle loader, well, that's their thing. I just like to know that I can hunt with a rifle like the original hunters here did a hunderd years ago and before the gadgets came.
 
Cheater Guns

Jimmydee: Yeah I switched "back": to a longbow about 25 years ago. Haven't hunted much with it in the last 5 to 7 yrs. or so, but I shall!;)
 
I believe there are some states that will distinguish between flint & percussion, in-lines and others. Canada allows us to bring in a flint, but not the evil 1861 Springfield with its far reaching Minie Ball. Heaven forbid hitting something with regularity at 400 yards plus.

The Rendezvous I use to attend forbid any sights other than open sights that were on the barrel. No rear aperture. Yet, historically, there were some guns (especially amongst the Arabs & Turks) that had rear aperture sights - with several holes to allow for varying distances. Scopes are no-no, yet we know Frederick the Great shot a scoped rifle around 1735. We also know that David Rittenhouse made a scoped rifle for Charles Willson Peale during the American Revolution (see the Peale papers published by Yale University Press).
 
More gun laws. THERE's a great idea.
I shoot traditional only, no sights except a bead. I don't LIKE inlines, but I sure as hell won't tell another shooter his weapon ought to be banned.


On the other matter...real bows don't have training wheels.

And only a student bow should draw less than 75 lbs. Men start at 90 lbs and go up from there.

In fact, if you REALLY want to shoot longbow, the accepted standard (according to the May Rose recovery) is 120 lbs. I think we should ban anything under the minimum recovered example of 87 lbs as "not a REAL longbow."

Any takers?

tongue firmly in cheek.
 
Zorro,

Do you drive a vehicle (car, truck, motorboat, ATV) to go hunting, or do you walk, ride a horse, or paddle a birchbark canoe?

Why does it bother you what others do as long as it is legal?
I hunt with a modern in-line muzzleloader during MUZZLELOADER season in Louisiana. However, when these seasons were started here, regular rifle season was shortened so we could have this muzzleloader season. It was promoted as additional hunting season in the beginning, but gradually, over the years, the regular rifle season was started later, and ended sooner to make room for an early and late muzzleloader season. Basically, it is just an excuse to sell an additional lisence.

It seems your beef is with the WORDING of the laws(muzzleloader vs. primitive weapons), a technicality.
 
Cheater guns

Madmike: It is certainly good to hear that someone knows of the Mary Rose. Thanks to you, I do believe I shall take out my copy of "Tembo" and watch it tonight.;)
 
Well, if it comes down to cheat'n, I'd be happy to take a civil war minie ball rifle and build it into a flintlock or a "trade" musket - albeit a rifled one.
 
Mike Irwin
you can be stilled the great and mighty PA game comission has deemed us in need of the maxi ball but still limits us to the venerable old flint, which I think is as much of a cause for lost game than the round ball. I would like to see PA allow the use of percussion.
 
A quality flintlock can be every bit as reliable as a caplock when the operator knows what they are doing.

In fact a properly made flintlock rifle will have a faster lock time than the average percussion rifle, though we are talking custom flintlock rifles here as the manufactured flintlock rifles are just not up to par. The vent holes on many manufactured flintlock rifles are just too low to the flash pan. There would be a faster ignition if the vent holes were moved up just a bit (Fire arcs upward).


http://www.nmlra.org

National Muzzle Loading Rifle Association
 
I know of no scientific tests that show that either flintlock or percussion is faster. The Historic Arms Making Journal (NMLRA publication) does have one article wherein they test the speed of several flintlocks including the fancier roller bearing frizzen models that the English were exporting heavily between 1810-1830s. They were no faster than the normal flintlock.

My experience, for whatever it's worth, is that a flintlock can be just as fast as a percussion and it's a matter of the shooter ensuring the flint is snug in the jaws (I prefer lead for a clamp as it conforms to the flint's shape), clean flashhole, pan & frizzen (hammer/steel/battery).
 
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