Are Heavier Bullets Better?

W

Wildernesshunter

New member
This has probably been an eternal debate and I think it is worth re-debating on a regular basis with new powders and technology in bullets, etc.... being developed annually.


So here is the question..... Are Heavier Bullets Better?


Maybe the ole aught six is a good place to start the debate, simply because of the wide variety of loads that can be worked up for this steadfast old performer.

110 gr
125gr
150gr
165gr
180gr
200gr
220gr


Powders abound.......

Hunting.....

Deer
Black Bear
Elk
Moose
Grizzly/Brown

As the animal grows in weight and aggression.... is the 220gr a better choice over the 150gr at a much higher velocity?

As I look at the empirical data.... I doubt the assumptions the story the data tells....when a bullet makes impact.
 
I'm sure plenty of folks on here have shot more game than I but seems like the heavy for caliber bullets anchor game better for me. These days that's 180gr ballistic tips in a 308. When I shot the ol 06 the 200gr gameking was my favorite.
 
"When I shot the ol 06 the 200gr gameking was my favorite."


Funny.... that's the box of 100 pills that I just purchased.

Figured the 220gr was a little too heavy for the '06, but felt the 200gr was the perfect compromise between the 180 and 220.

.......
 
It's not as simple as it used to be. In the "old days" heavier bullets were known to give better penetration and were thus preferred for the proverbial "Griz" or what have you.

Modern bonded, hybrid, and monometal bullets turn this on it's ear somewhat.

But to answer your question: yes. I believe heavier is superior so long as you have sufficient velocity to get the expected terminal performance from your chosen bullet.
 
Every bullet has its design point. That is the velocities that can maintain terminal performance.

Some are rated 2000 fps-2900 fps for example.

The mono bullets (Barnes, Cutting Edge, and others) have a minimum impact velocity for no maximum impact velocity. We all know the these bullets take velocity to perform.

Thin jacketed bullets such as the Sierras will go all to pieces if impact velocity is too high. I knew a guy that swore off of cup and core bullets because he shot a black bear at 30 ft with a 300 Weatherby using a 150 gr bullet. The bear offered no reaction at all to the hit and just ran off from all the noise.

Bullet selection (aka type) has quite a bit to do with whether we use a heavy bullet or a lighter bullet.

The only way I would use a 125 gr or lighter bullet in a 30-06 would be if it was a mono. Personally I have never used anything lighter than 150 gr in any design.

I was growing up when Barnes and Bitteroot were making the premium bullets of the day and they were definitely heavy for caliber. Nowadays, most good bullets are constructed so they can perform for novice and knowledgeable seasoned hunters alike.

As a footnote, I have several boxes of Woodleigh Protected Point 240 gr bullets that were designed for the 30-06.....in case I get to go dinosaur hunting next season.
 
Wildernesshunter wrote:
Are Heavier Bullets Better?
Click to expand...

Not necessarily.

What you want as a shooter is an optimal balance between velocity, energy, accuracy and terminal performance. Go to the extreme of any of these metrics and you are likely to sacrifice the others.

If someone tells you something like:
  • "Only heavy bullets are any good"
  • "Velocity is king of take-down"
  • "Accuracy is the only thing that matters since bullets that don't hit have no effect"
  • "A bullet is only any good if it strategically breaks into multiple pieces causing multiple wound channels"
Ignore them.

They don't know what they're talking about. Accuracy, for example, is important because misses don't bring down game or preserve your life, but an accurate shot that doesn't bring down the game and leaves you to chase it through the woods and eventually lose becomes nothing but animal cruelty. All of these factors need to be held in balance based on the kind of shooting you do in the environment in which you do it.
 
More about the construction than the weight. The most versatile .30 cal bullet weight is a 165 though.
"...a black bear at 30 ft with a 300 Weatherby..." Too much gun in the first place. Mind you, even a TSX out of a 300 Weatherby is running 3,000 + FPS.
 
I was really upset by the Berger VLD hunting bullets I used this year. I did not read up on them or anything, and thought because they said "hunting" they were a bonded core bullet. Turns out they preform just like match bullets and explode on contact. They claim 5" of penetration before they cut loose. Maybe, but no exit wounds on the 4 deer kilt with them.

Now, I was initially disappointed and shocked. With a week or two to think about it all four dropped where they stood. The thoracic cavity was soup in all four. No working heart or lungs in any of the deer. Hit them right and they go down where they stand. I am still concerned what a wounder shot will do, especially with only an entry wound.

I was going to complain, but after watching their promotional video the bullets preformed exactly as advertised (I just didn't see the advertisement before hunting).

Their Hybrid bullet is bonded, and next year I'll load those. I still want a bullet that stays together and exist, but I have to say that the performance of these was flawless for what they are. I am scratching my head though about how they differ from the match grade bullets I love so much.
 
Fast burning powders work best in semi auto having a gas operation. Slow burning powders work best in most bolt actions. Lever guns can function well on everything else in-between.

Every cartridge has a preferred bullet weight. Even the 06 has one. Although most do not shoot that preferred 06 bullet weight. And quite likely a few do not know or care to know?
 
The proper bullet weight in any caliber is completely dependent on velocity, bullet construction, and the toughness of the game you're hunting. Heavier bullets, and/or tougher bullet construction is necessary for heavier and thicker boned species in order to ensure penetration into the vitals, which is what bullet selection is all about. Thin skinned and lightly boned animals can be hunted with lighter for caliber bullets at higher velocity because there is still sufficient penetration. With medium sized game, heavy cup and core bullets at moderate velocity can be substituted with a lighter bullet of tougher construction, such as a Partition, bonded core or mono-metal bullet, at higher velocity, because they can stand up to the higher striking velocities without coming apart.

I think heavier bullets are in general more reliable, because their slower muzzle velocity makes the velocity spread over normal hunting ranges to be smaller, and bullet performance therefore more consistent.
 
Better?
That's a matter of application and opinion.

As for me, I tend to favor mid-to-heavy bullets for a cartridge. Most cartridges seem to be at their best in that range.


.32 revolver cartridges see mostly 115+, with only a few 90-98 gr WCs thrown in
.380 Auto gets 100s
9mm gets 122-147s
.44 Mag sees almost exclusively 300+ gr now
.223 Rem is split - 52 gr HPs for varmints, 67-69 gr for other stuff
.270 Win gets 130s or 140s
.30 WCF gets loaded with some 150s, but primarily 170s - none of the light stuff
7.62x54R sees mostly 174 gr bullets, with some 150s thrown in
.30-06 gets nothing lighter than 165 gr
And the list goes on...

The only real oddities in my reloading room are:
6x45mm - I generally run even lighter bullets in the 6x45 than I do in .223/5.56. 45-58 gr bullets make up the majority.
.35 Whelen - Though not terribly light, I started working with 200s and was impressed enough to not really get away from them (at least not yet).
.444 Marlin - I have heavy bullets. I've loaded heavy bullets. I even designed (and tested) a 437 gr bullet for the cartridge. But I shoot 265-275 gr bullets almost exclusively. That's the cartridge's "happy place".
And the in-work .17-223 - This one is going to be all about velocity. I'm looking at it like a mini .22-250 or .220 Swift. 17-20 gr bullets. All the velocity I can squeeze out of it (4k fps should be within reach). Copper fouling be damned. I want the SPEED! ...Until accuracy falls off.
 
I think bullet construction is very important.

Several years ago I worked up a max velocity load using a 130gr Barnes TTSX bullets in my 270 Win. I can't remember the exact velocity, but for some reason 3060 fps stands out in my mind. Should kill anything that moves, right?

Wrong. They penciled right through the lightweight Texas whitetail I hunt (a big deer where I hunt is 130lbs., with most around 100 to 110 on the hoof). The bullet acted like a FMJ. I had several deer run on me when the shot wasn't directly in the vitals. Not a shot in the hams, but 2 or 3 inches behind the vitals. Disappointing for sure. Not making excuses for poor shooting, but before I started reloading I had hit several deer in the same fashion with Power Points or Core Lokt's and had bang flops. On the other side was a huge gaping hole.

So, I switched to a lighter weight TTSX. A 95gr bullet I believe. Once again, I'm not in front of my data, but I believe that bullet leaves the muzzle at 3650 fps. At any rate, it is fast.

I haven't had any issues since. The exit wound is still small when compared to a non bonded or standard bullet, but thats ok... it doesn't damage as much meat which is why I like the Barnes TTSX. Not to mention if I see a 300lb boar I would have no qualms about nailing him with the same load with the "tiny" 95gr bullet.

So what does it all mean? My theory is that the 130gr bullet was just too tough for the lightweight game I hunt. Not enough animal mass for reliable expansion when using a bullet designed for deep penetration. The 95gr bullet opens up more readily at the higher velocity and produces clean kills with a greater margin for error.

Truth be told, a shot through the heart or lungs regardless of velocity or size will most likely end in swift death. Hard to live with a hole in the heart or lungs.

Not scientific by any means, but my experience nonetheless.
 
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I guess you're right. It's makes sense that the bigger and meaner the game the bigger the bullet. If that doesn't work, there's an old saying - "you don't have to out-run the bear just out-run the guy next to you".
 
If all I had was one rifle every thing I might shoot from sage rat's to moose would be shot with the same bullet! In my 30-06 I shoot 180gr Hornady SP's. My 25-06 use's 117gr Hornady SP's. My 6.5x55 shoot's 129gr Hornady SP's, 6.5x06 use's 140gr Hornady SP's and for target, 140gr SMK's. I'm only shooting cast bullet's from my 308 these days.

For me I like medium to heavy bullet's for caliber but the weight depend's on what I happen to be shooting. I see absolutely no reason to use premium bullet's but the bonded bullet's would maybe interest me. Probably rather than bonded, I'd go with Speer hot core's if they shot well in my rifle's. I like weight retention.

Truth of the matter is that all animal's when hit with a bullet not designed to do what it need's on the animal your hunting, properly placed will kill that animal as dead as any bullet. But you better be certain of where that spot is, how to get the bullet there and the ability to do it!
 
Different weight bullets are meant for different purposes. Looking at the 06 a 110 gr bullet is most likely designed for someone to hunt varmints and not deer.

I sometimes wonder about the people that want to use the heaviest match bullet they can find for hunting because it has the best BC. You have to match the bullet to the task. That's the reason the bullet companies have a tech line. Sometimes it's a great idea to call them and ask for info.
 
Guess I'm lucky.
I've had the means to sporterize, customize and build many rifles for specific hunting.
This way I can pick the "best" suited rifle for many different kinds of hunts.
As such, I've only had to develop one load for that specific hunting purpose in my rifles.

I tend toward heavy for caliper SGKs for 30-06 and smaller rifles.
Like the 200 grain Speer Hot cores in 8mm.
Use NPTs or Swift-As in larger bores w/ the only exception of a Barnes Solid in 458.
 
Caliber and weight alone mean next to nothing. Heavy for caliber is almost always better with a few exceptions (notably solid copper bullets). Within the same caliber heavier bullets are longer. It is longer bullets that penetrate deeper when they hit game. Not necessarily heavier bullets. A 200 gr 30 caliber bullet is long, lean and considered heavy for caliber, a 225 gr 35 caliber bullet is short, stubby and considered light for caliber. The lighter 30 caliber bullet will always out penetrate the 225 gr 35 caliber bullet assuming equal construction.

You will see similar performance in game with 175 gr 7mm bullets, 160 gr 270 bullets, or 147 gr 6.5mm bullets. All are heavy for caliber and all penetrate very well. WD Bell used 175 gr bullets in a 7X57 Mauser to take over 1100 elephant in his lifetime.

There are a lot who miss that concept. Years ago when we were shooting round balls with black powder the only way to make bullets heavier was to make the bore larger. With conical bullets we can now make them longer to get the desired weight.

The actual bore size is not nearly as important as it used to be. But there are limits on how long we can make a bullet. For example around 220-230 gr is about the practical limit in 30 caliber. If we need heavier bullets than that to get the job done then we need to move up in caliber.

Long, heavy for caliber bullets are also more aerodynamic and retain their speed and energy much better down range. I load 150 gr SST's in my 308 @ 2850 fps and 178 ELD-X bullets at 2650. Even though the 150's start out 200 fps faster, the 178's pass them at about 350 yards with more energy at all ranges; and the the gap widens the farther down range we go.

The lighter, faster bullet is slightly flatter shooting up to a point. About 4" less at 500 yards, which is really insignificant. But at some point farther down range the heavier bullet will eventually shoot flatter. This is why all long range target bullets are heavy for caliber.
 
Looking at the 06 a 110 gr bullet is most likely designed for someone to hunt varmints and not deer.
Click to expand...

Usually true, but dont forget a good all copper or bonded bullet will retain its weight. Yes, some lighter weight bullets are in fact designed for varmint hunting.

Spinning off my post from above I will say this...

Barnes encourages folks to drop down a "bullet size" when using their TSX and TTSX line of bullets since they retain much more weight than other bullets.

I bet a 110gr TSX or TTSX at max 30-06 velocity would kill any hog or whitetail on the planet.

Maybe deader than a 180gr standard bullet. :D
 
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