Are guns the cause?

Dead

New member
Is "easy" access guns the cause of Civil War in 3rd world nations? Check this video out from WWW.CDI.ORG
http://romeo.midc.purdue.edu:8080/ramgen/defense.rm

The video is LONG (27 mins), and is VERY anti-gun! Has talk about "Forceful" disarmement of the KLA by Nato also. (i.e. going house to house collecting guns from the KLA.

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Dead [Black Ops]


[This message has been edited by Dead (edited August 05, 2000).]
 
No, guns aren't the cause. They're the means to the Civil Wars of 3rd World countries.

The cause is corrupt governments, that don't give a damn about their citizens.
How many peasants could seriously afford an FAL, or HK, or whatever weapon it is they're carrying in these wars?

Think about it a minute. The images we're being handed show a nation of starving children, living in squalor. I don't doubt the images. I suspect they're real. Somewhere.

What I'm challenging is this. If the people are left to decay in such as way, how is that the fault of a gun in their hands? Again, where the Hell did they get the resources to obtain such a firearm? Nobody will convince me that they sold their children to obtain such a firearm. Who would pay them for their children when they're diseased, and dying from malnutrition, if that were the case?
No, these firearms in the Civil Wars are provided for by their own countries, and expecially others, hoping to cash in on the unfortunate outcome of the event of whoever wins in the end.
And everyone here should know that it's almost always the best prepared who will survive the war. That would require military grade weaponry of the kind you see these villagers fighting with.

That brings another item into focus. Who would stand to gain from the annihilation of one group, political or religious, in such a conflict.

Easy access to firearm in 3rd World Countries?
I don't suppose the US, and the former USSR could be held accountable for any of that, huh? Nor the Brits, of Belgians, or Chinese.

Right back to the ability of the masses to afford such weaponry. Even beyond that, is the means to have ammunition for those weapons.
How many people do you know who can, and do buy a several million rounds of ammunition??

[This message has been edited by Donny (edited August 05, 2000).]
 
Donny, a lot of the characters fighting in Kosovo got their weapons from Albanian army depots for free a few years ago. They had a little, "Civil unrest," and army compounds were raided. In many sub-Saharan African nations, AKs can be had for $50 or less.

Most of these old world conflicts are thousands of years old.

In Africa, it's traditional tribal warfare, using modern weapons. In Rwanda, it was/is Hutu vs Tutsi like it's been for longer than anyone can remember, they just used machetes instead of spears.

In the Balkan region, you have the 1000+ year old struggle of Christian (Serb) vs Muslim (Albanian). Prince Vlad would recognize it for what it is, just like in his own time.

We're fooling ourselves if we think that weapon control or a quicky "Camp <fill in the blank> Accord" is going to change anything in the long run. These people truly hate each other in a way that most Westerners can't understand.
 
Destructo,
Good point. And as I said, the peoples involved in these national Civil Wars are doing so for reason, either religious or political. And there is little else that matters in the end.

If most Westerners can't understand this, then they have led a sheltered life, and haven't truly seen the world.
One reason I believe military service is a good idea. It gave me the opportunity to see some of these things were discussing. Not pretty sites, but life, nonetheless.

I suspect that if America were thrown into a Civil War of modern means, we'd have many enemies we citizens weren't even aware of. Or at least most people wouldn't see it that way.

They would, unfortunately, suffer the consequences of ignorance, or stupidy.
 
The anti-self defense movement is clearly international. For more of this drivel, see www.iansa.org .

The messages are clear:

1. More guns = more violence (in spite of significant, contrary American research).

2. Guns should only be in the hands of 'responsible' governments.

3. It boils down to citizen control, and if your country won't control you, NATO or the UN will ... using firearms, I'll add.


BTW, RealPlayer is choppy on my system, despite various preference changes. Anyone have suggestions re: how to receive uninterrupted, clear playback? Thanks.

Regards from AZ
 
Using the "civil" war in Ruanda proves to me that firearms had nothing to do with a cause for the fighting. If I recall correctly, most of the dead where hacked to death with macheties not shot to death with firearms.
Hate is hate and the tools used to express such hate have nothing to do with the prevailing emotion.

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"TANSTAAFL"- R.A. Heinlen

"Molon Labe"- Leonidas to Xerxes at Thermopile
 
Yes, the Hutu-Tutsi thing was mostly conducted with machetes.

Also, remember that a lot of these "civil wars" are a guerilla group against a corrupt and vicious government. Of course the government has weapons, and gun control is not going to stop that. And the guerillas normally get many of their weapons from defecting or dead soldiers, or by seizing armories. Private ownership of guns is pretty low in lots of the countries you read about - maybe that's part of the problem.
 
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