ar carbine vs. full size or mid length ar

camo-omega

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I'm new to this forum and I'm wondering if anybody can help me out on this one. I'm looking into buying an ar platform rifle and I've noticed first off that there are too many brands to choose from, and that there are carbines and what I call normal or full size rifles. I'm wondering the pros and cons of having a smaller carbine and also the pros and cons of having a full size. thanks in advance for any of the help.


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Personally I like the full length (20 in Barrel) ARs. I don't find them unwieldy at all.
I shoot my ARs with iron sights, I like the longer sight radius.

I don't do any building searches any more, but when I was in LE and did, I used a pistol/revolver. More convenient, you always had one hand free, and a pistol/revolver is easier when you had to handle a bandit.
 
AR rifles are generally 20" barreled, and commonly have fixed stocks. AR carbines are generally 16" barreled, and commonly are copies of the M4, with adjustable stocks.

Gas length on them all is where the front sight block, or FSB is located, which times the action to open the bolt properly. That means about 5-7 inches from the muzzle to get the optimum timing.

Originally, carbine gas on military issue M4's and others was based on the issue 14.5" or shorter barrels. But, the BATF does not allow possession of barrels under 16" without a special Short Barrel tax paid up front. That tends to put a crimp in impulse sales and overall demand. To supply that, AR15 assemblers used 16" barrels, but the carbine gas tube and handguards. That left a lot of barrel after the gas block, opened the bolt early under much higher pressure, and caused a lot of head scratching in Customer Service departments and the design engineers offices wondering why Marketing created an expensive problem. The bolts were failing much earlier, more often, kabooms were getting reported a lot more on something called the internet, which seemed to let people communicate a lot more quickly about problems.

They invented midlength gas, and in the process, had to justify the expense of midlength handguards, which weren't miiltary issue. The tooling costs were appparently worth it, because midlength gas guns, with the gas block where it should be on a legal 16" barrel, became the civilian standard.

If you want to decipher what a particular AR is meant to do, it's really no different than other guns. Actually easier, the differences are more obvious because thats all that gets changed. Other guns makes taken as a whole confuse it by hiding things in different designs.

IN GENERAL, some broad definitions: long barrels for long range, short barrels for short range. Fixed stocks for hunting or precision shooting, short adjustable stocks because the shooter is wearing heavy clothing or an an armored vest on occasion. 5.56 for competition, cheap shooting, or large quantity shooting, alternate calibers for the higher power and/or longer range they offer.

Examples: 20" flattop fixed stock AR, general purpose use. Add a precision barrel, free floattube, bipod, and 4x12 scope, it's a varmint gun or long range precision shooter. Put a 16" barrel with handguards, in 6.8SPC, with a red dot, it's a deer rifle. Swap an adjustable stock, eave the red dot, 14.5" barrel, and add a suppressor, it's an LEO trunk or call out team carbine.

Leave the 14.5" barrel, pin a long flash hider to make it 16", add the 4x12 and bipod, and yes, it gets very confusing. A 50m precision hostage taker gun, maybe, in metros with an antiterrorist need. Or, just a screwed up gun because it seems so macho somebody had to post a picture of it. Happens all the time, it's practically a cliche. Just add lasers and a 6 C cell maglite.

When you are ready to buy, or build, know what targets at what distance you'll commonly be shooting at. That tells you the caliber and barrel length, then choose the better stock, grip, handguard, optic, flash hider, and last, trigger. In that order, based on What target at what range, you get the optimum combination you need for the job. It's not always what seems cool, but shooting it will be successful with fewer mistakes, and that IS cool.
 
A 16 or even 18 inch midlength gas system AR would be a more versatile option. The midlength gas system provides softer recoil and is easier on the gun's parts than a carbine system, but still provides a shorter barrel to be more maneuverable and lighter, while still maintaining accuracy.

I have a 16" midlength setup.

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but do you lose any range or accuracy? I would think you would lose range with a carbine and may be harder to keep steady on a target

Let me give you an example. First you need to understand, YOUR MILEAGE MAY VARY.

I have been asked to teach a LE rifle class to some Fed Cops on the Coast.
In preparing for the course, I needed to know the ammo and rifle they used.

The will be using a 14.4 barrel on a M4, and 64 grn. Speer Gold Dot for LE.

I wanted to check to see what this ammo does out of those little barrels.

The average velocity out of the 14.4 barrel is 2550, The same ammo out of my 20 in. barrel is 2850.

I already mentioned the sight radius being better with the longer barrel but they have some weird red dot sight so sight radius doesn't come into play (unless they break, thats something I'm working on, to see if they can go to iron sights if the red dot sight breaks).
 
In an alternate caliber, you may recover, and even gain range and power. A 16" 6.8SPC has 40% more power than 5.56, and in some loads, can be equally fast as from a 20" barrel. Balance that with the fact it's not cheap military surplus. There's usually some kind of tradeoff.

That's why there are no hard and fast absolutes. But, there are more optimum combinations that meet narrower conditions. As CPT K pointed out, the specific target and range is what's important to know first. From there, you can drill down to what is better in that need.

If it's "general purpose," that's not hard to answer. It was the role of the M16 in 20", one size fits all applications, which is what the DOD uses it for.
 
I never considered the 5.56 AR rifle until they became available in 6.8. Then I really wanted a piston-driven AR. Looking at the extra cost I started realizing the DI guns were completely as reliable.

When I went shopping for my first AR I went with Rock River Arms and their LAR-6 A4 Mid-Length and I love it. It seems the perfect size, on par with my AK and is just plain fun to shoot.

I talked a friend into his first AR and he bought the exact same gun I bought in the same caliber. It is contagious.

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Barrel length only affects velocity, not accuracy.

Percieved accuracy can decrease due to the typically shorter sight radius of the shorter barreled guns. Not an issue with optics.

The velocity can be a detriment depending on what range you intend to shoot at. I personally only own one AR (a BCM) and its a lightweight profile 14.5". I chose this because I only intend to use this rifle for HD and maybe competition. I dont need the extra velocity for either of these. the tradeoff in handling and compactness is worthwhile in my case.

If I were using it for varmiting, I would go with a 20".
 
I had a carbine I didnt care for the accuracy so I bought a dpms barrel which made me go to Mid-Length I dont regret it as I feel it is a good length also the accuracy I picked up from that barrel was well worth it. From my shooting of various Ar's I cannot say that any of them didnt feel good I like all the lengths for some reason I must say that the full length just points better for me. When i build my next Ar it is going to be full length. However if I only had to get one Ar it would only be carbine or mid due to size and weight and versatility.
 
IMO You buy or build a AR-15 for the purpose you intend to use it for,There are so many opts.L.E Hunting,range use,toy,varmint,So the best advise is buy one on a general line of your intened use,go to the after market & build what you want.Good luck Because you will change your mind a few times i'm sure:D
 
It is true,it all depends on what you will do with it.

If you want to shoot 300 yd prairie dogs you have a different set of priorities than someone who has to come up out of the rear hatch of a Bradley to quickly kill someone who is aiming an RPG at your vehicle.

How many miles will you carry it? From the pickup to the firing line,or will it be carried like a sidearm?

Are you going to put a hi magnification scope on it?

For middle of the road,general purpose rifle,Daniel Defense offers a hammer forged 18 in mid gas length chrome lined barrel in a medium light,tapered contour. 1 in 7 twistThis barrel is contoured like a tapered sporting rifle barrel.It is reasonably priced.I put a YHM mid length 4 rail diamond free float tube on mine.It shoots 1 MOA with my 77 gr MK and 24.1 gr RE-15 ammo.

That is one recommendable recipe for a GP rifle.There are a lot more.
 
+1 to tierod

I finally took the plunge on an AR platform myself and for MY PURPOSES I chose a shorter M4 type clone.

The power of the 5.56 is diminished in the shorter 16" barrel however. If you really want/need to maximize the 5.56 AR platform, you really do need a 20" barrel IMO. I've got other guns if I really want/need more power. The best of all worlds right now might well be a gas piston 6.8 SPC M4 type carbine....
 
The length of the rifle would be better for you to determine after handling and shooting the respective platforms. As to brand - Rock River Arms for a completed rifle. Best trigger and best value in an AR.
 
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