Any wood workers?-Splicing advice

H

Hedley

New member
I've got a few SKS stocks that I've been wanting to experiment on. I'd like to splice a Russian buttstock into the wrist and fore-end of a Norinco stock, so the butt and fore-end would be artic birch, with beech in the center. I know it would be a lot of work, but I think the end result would be stunning. How did the Russians do it at the arsenal? I figure a jig or band saw would be best. But the biggest problem I see is getting the triangle splices to match without gaps, especially when working on a roundish piece of wood.

Here's an example of what I'm shooting for.
hpim5396jq3.jpg
 
That's interesting that it has such sharp points, I wonder how they did it . Woodworkers often use finger joints to join wood especially production where the wood will be painted.The finger joints are extremely strong though not nearly as sharp as those in the photo.Not a big deal if you have a finger joint cutter.
 
Finger joints in wood

Those long pointy finger splices were cut using a single multi-pointed tool bit in a wood shaper. To cut them by hand is possible but would most likely generate imported kindling instead. The cutter could be fabricated on a metal lathe. Spec the center to fit whatever you will be using to drive it. Wood must be cut at much higher speeds than metal so using a Bridgeport may not be feasible. If you do not have access to a large wood shaper you might be able to set it up on a Sears shaper head mounted on a table saw. Use a standard shaper or router bit to get an idea of how the cutter profile is laid out for back clearance etc. and you would have to case harden it but it is doable. Cut some stock sized pine blanks to reverse engineer cutter vs work piece orientation so the butt and wrist centers align. I would consider slugging the joint longitudinally with a 1/4" threaded brass rod for insurance if this is to be a shooter.
The most difficult part would be getting each finger precisely identical with each gullet.
 
Splicing wood

Hedley,
Is there a high school or community college in your area that has an industrial arts program?
Some IA instructors welcome outside projects. Given the liberal brain rot prevalent in most educational faculty, you may want to present it as a historical relic preservation vs a 'gun project'.
Mike in Michigan
 
Custom wood shaper cutter source

I stopped at the local Woodcrafter shop on Friday and asked about custom cutters. Sources for custom wood cutters advertise in Fine Woodworking magazine.
 
I'll have to look for that magazine next time I'm at Barnes and Noble. As fas as the courses go, I think UT offers an "informal class" on woodworking.
 
A very similar type of splicing was done with the wooden shafts of arrows in the 1800's to put heavier wood near the points. There was a simple V splice and also a 4 point splice. I have seen examples and remember reading how they did it (I was really curious about that 4 point splice at the time), but cannot find it quickly now. But you might check on some good archery sources.
 
Splice stock

Mount stock on indexing lathe. Build a overlay jig with the desired v shaped( in one dimension) Using a router insert an appropriate cutting bit, a straight, possably v cutting bit and a patterning collar on router base and follow v pattern on jig and then index to adjacent space on stock and repeat.

This will require reinforcement of stock materials as the surface areas are not sufficient with glue alone.And is not easy.

If you can live with shorter v's a finger joint router bit would work.

An attractive alternative is slightly removing material from lower portion of stock and veneering desired species of wood on.

Even easier may be simply stripping current finish, masking to design desired and appliy different stain colors to acheive desired results.. Also less risky as it can be repeated until you archeive desired results.
 
I was a cabinetmaker by trade and have to ask, are you sure these are two pieces of wood? The grain looks awful alike. A trick that has been used for years for cheap inlay work was staining the same wood in a pattern, that black dividing line is a give away, although it could also be a glue joint but it looks awful constant.
The method described above is correct, it is just like doing a dovetail joint with a router. A true finger joint is extremely strong, just not positive that is what I am looking at.
 
NCHornet you said what I was thinking. I've done alittle wood working with pine ,red oak, popular and black walnut and the grains above look similar. I was to much of a perfectionist to make any money at it but I enjoyed it.

Tom
 
Would using biscuits be OK for your project or internal dowels as pins? These joints would be strong but lack the zig-zag pattern. While thinking of unique joinery, how about a mortise and tenon, like they did with barn joints, that may look kind of cool.

I know that the manufacturers of door frames use the joint you are interested in, any chance of finding a factory that is doing that type of work in your AO? I see those types of splices on door frames all the time.
 
Finger joints

I have not seen this before on any rifle stock. I think what has happened is these people are finger jointing the raw wood while it's in whatever dimensional size they have milled it down to for processing into gun stocks. The wood they use is not the same as our walnut, birch or whatever. Cost prevails and if a 30 inch piece of wood is needed for each stock anything less than that is useless. My guess is the difference in color in the photo is only because of the variation of color in that particular kind of wood. You see similar, although not as extreme, variations in pine molding that has been finger jointed. The same thing as referred to in Meddac19's post. The raw material that door company is using probably came from another source. Wherever it came from the machine used to manufacture it is set up for a standard and particularly selected size of raw material. You can't simply poke a piece of gunstock in it. If the glue is good the joint in that rifle stock will no doubt be stronger than the surrounding parent wood and would perform under the stresses of rifle use.

Now, how to do it yourself using two separate stocks as raw material. I can't think of a good simple method in the home shop. Somehow both pieces are going to have to be held in the exact same position and then cut in the exact same way to fit together tightly. Then, however that is done it has to be set up so the end result is an absolutely completely straight stock on all planes. The indexing wood lathe would work I think. I know one thing, it's not a job for an inexperienced armature. That's what I am when it comes to using an indexing lathe.

If you simply want to attach the front of one stock to the rear of another it can be done at home. The difficult part is temporally clamping or somehow hooking the two stocks exactly parallel side by side and even to some reference point, i.e., trigger guard screw hole or anything else. Build a simple jig to hold the stocks flat on a band saw table. If it were me I'd mark a single finger joint and cut away. When you attach the two pieces together the end result will be shorter than the original by whatever the kerf is on the saw blade. If the cut was made behind the inletted portion of the stock it probably won't matter. If the cut is anywhere in the inletted area you may have to glue a kerf thick spacer in the joint or if appropriate modify the inletting.

This entire post is moot as far as I'm concerned because I wouldn't go to this much trouble. There's no doubt a better way to do this. I never could figure out how to do anything the easy way. That's why I don't go in my shop much anymore.
 
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