Any "history" to this ammo?

S

sthsquid

New member
Years ago, I bought a box of S+W +P 158gr semi-wadcutter hollowpoints for my .38 special Speed-Six. If I recall, the gun-store owner told me that this ammo had been discontinued and that it was considered and "FBI load". (Of course I took that with a grain of salt or two).....However, once I got to the range, I was very impressed with the tight groups (for a 2 3/4" barrel!) I was able to shoot with this ammo - so impressed I saved the last 1/3 or so of the box to this day.

Does anyone know anything about this ammo?...history?.....still manufactured...?
 
158gr lead +P hollowpoint has been around for many years, and at one time was an FBI load. Manufactured by all of the major ammo manufacturers. Still in production by Rem and WW if my memory is right.
 
If you're talking about S&W brand ammo, yes. It's been gone for many many years. S&W didn't load it however, I believe it was made by Fiocchi.
That must have been what he meant.

The "FBI load" is still available from other makers, as was posted.
 
Years ago the standard ammo for police was the old 158 grain, round nosed lead bullet in a standard power load.

This was known to the police as the "Widow Maker" for the numerous failures to stop.

The police unions complained and sued enough, that most police agencies finally adopted the .38 Special +P load of the 158 grain, semi-wadcutter, hollow point, lead bullet.

This pretty well ended the failures to stop, and the round came to be known under a variety or names:
The Chicago, St Louis, New Orleans, LAPD, FBI, and Federal load, depending on where you lived.

It was also known to street cops as the ".38 SPLAT", for the sound it was supposed to make when it hit

In a standard .38 Special revolver, especially in 2" barreled guns, this is one of the very most effective rounds available.
 
FBI load

some years ago a standard issue sidearm for FBI agents was the S&W model 13 3 inch round butt...the FBI load (38 +P S&W LSWC)...was the issued ammunition...and is still a pretty good load....although since then the jacketed JHP's have developed in large varities.
 
The .38 lead round nose did much better when personnel were trained to NOT leave solid cover and empty their weapons in the open as in the Practical Pistol Course. The LSWCHP +P is a good load but it will never replace being alert or use of cover. It was New York, I think, were a NYPD officer scored a good chest hit on an attacking polar bear at the zoo with the "widow maker" and the thing dropped quickly. So, who knows. I just can't see blaming a bullet design on failures after studying so many incidents. I think it is somewhat foolish to blame ammunition when the only shooting you do is during mandated requal's.
 
I'd add that the FBI load (also known as the Chicago load), expands reliably in short barreled pistols. It's still a very good load, as mentioned. I'm not saying it turns the .38 Spec. in to a Mag.

Mathew, unfortunately the 158gr lead round nose is a round that we can all criticize. From a snubbie the velocity was under 700 fps with no expansion. There were too many incidences of police officers being shot after they did everything right.
The bad guys started going dowing with the LSWC +P HP.
 
Nnobby45, I think any handgun round is poor for the most part. But we're talking about a round that was used, basically universally worldwide, for over 70 years. You would think a lot of failures would exist. People absorb 27 9mm silvertips but you don't hear about that very often. Or 11 40 S&W Hydrashoks. Problem is, when only lungs are hit it is a crap shoot whether they go down or not. From John Dillinger to Lee Harvey Oswald the 158gr. LRN was used successfully. But don't get me wrong, the Remington 158gr. LHP +P will do it well, but I think the differences are more incidental than anything else.
 
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